I realize there are very few adherents of JW beliefs present as members and any answers would most likely be the personal opinions of just a few people. Most of us here have very little knowledge of JWs and do not understand how they differ from other groups that call themselves Christian. I do realize that JWs do differ very much from the other denominations to such a large degree that many who call themselves Christian do not consider JWs to be Christians.
Perhaps we have differing views as to what defines God. What is your definition of God?
"God" simply means: "mighty one". In the Bible most often it is applied to Jehovah. But it is also applied to other "mighty ones", e.g.: to the angels, to the Israelite judges, to Satan and to Jesus. Trinitarians focus on the passages that call Jesus "God" and ignore all the others.
"God" simply means: "mighty one". In the Bible most often it is applied to Jehovah
back to that 'oh he' again.. you seem to have no interest in etymology whatsoever. Shouldn't you understand what you subscribe to especially when subscribing to a distorted form of an originally middle eastern religion?
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
"God" simply means: "mighty one". In the Bible most often it is applied to Jehovah. But it is also applied to other "mighty ones", e.g.: to the angels, to the Israelite judges, to Satan and to Jesus. Trinitarians focus on the passages that call Jesus "God" and ignore all the others.
Is this your personal view or is it JW teacing?
Also, since the word "God," being an English word, does not appear in any biblical text, when you say, " 'God' simply means: 'mighty one'," is this based on the etymology of the English word "god" that you make this statement? No, it is based on the Hebrew word 'el, which is only one of several different words that are translated as God in English. Most curious is that 'el is singular but the most common form of this word is in the plural form, elohim and the plural of "might one" is "mighty ones". So, are you arguing that the best understanding of the biblical text would be "the mighty ones created the heaven and the earth", "the spirit of the might ones moved upon the face of the waters", "and the mighty ones said, 'Let there be light.'?"
That is what JWs teach. I'll do some research on the subject if you want.
format_quote Originally Posted by Grace Seeker
Also, since the word "God," being an English word, does not appear in any biblical text, when you say, " 'God' simply means: 'mighty one'," is this based on the etymology of the English word "god" that you make this statement? No, it is based on the Hebrew word 'el, which is only one of several different words that are translated as God in English. Most curious is that 'el is singular but the most common form of this word is in the plural form, elohim and the plural of "might one" is "mighty ones". So, are you arguing that the best understanding of the biblical text would be "the mighty ones created the heaven and the earth", "the spirit of the might ones moved upon the face of the waters", "and the mighty ones said, 'Let there be light.'?"
Elohim means literally "Gods" but this is understood to be using the plural of majesty. Like when the queen refers to herself as "we". Allah in the Qur'an also uses "we".
You and I are surely agreed that there is just the one Almighty God, not several.
back to that 'oh he' again.. you seem to have no interest in etymology whatsoever. Shouldn't you understand what you subscribe to especially when subscribing to a distorted form of an originally middle eastern religion?
What made you become a Muslim, Vale's Lily? Were you borne into the religion or did you choose it?
What made you become a Muslim, Vale's Lily? Were you borne into the religion or did you choose it?
I didn't practice the religion I was born into until my twenties. It was a choice. Islam is a thinking man's religion. I discovered it after 911 and while in grad school. I am grateful for the experience (and have already written about it here before) I believe we all need to renew our covenant with God through the path he chose for his righteous servants!
Sahih International
And who would be averse to the religion of Abraham except one who makes a fool of himself. And We had chosen him in this world, and indeed he, in the Hereafter, will be among the righteous.
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
I didn't practice the religion I was born into until my twenties. It was a choice. Islam is a thinking man's religion. I discovered it after 911 and while in grad school. I am grateful for the experience (and have already written about it here before) I believe we all need to renew our covenant with God through the path he chose for his righteous servants!
Sahih International
And who would be averse to the religion of Abraham except one who makes a fool of himself. And We had chosen him in this world, and indeed he, in the Hereafter, will be among the righteous.
I'm impressed. Something important must have happened in your life.
What made you become a Muslim, Vale's Lily? Were you borne into the religion or did you choose it?
you undersrand muslims very little. perhaps do a little more independant research rather than rely on your spoonfed sources to inform yourself about us before trying to convert us.... that is your intention for being here?
I'm impressed. Something important must have happened in your life.
It is called possessing the ability for a critical independent thought.. indeed at the time I was living in the dorms for the first time away from everyone's influence!
all the best
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
you undersrand muslims very little. perhaps do a little more independant research rather than rely on your spoonfed sources to inform yourself about us before trying to convert us.... that is your intention for being here?
And who do you say is spoonfeeding me? My own religion actually provides me with very little information about Islam. So I am forced to do my own independant research. In fact, discussion boards like this are a mine of information for someone like me. But I have found that many members object to having me here.
But I have found that many members object to having me here.
Not me. In fact I appreciate the opportunity to ask questions of you regarding your beliefs in this setting. Much preferable to an unanticipated knock at my door. Not that they are unwelcomed, but the timing is often not as convenient as posting here is.
You and I are surely agreed that there is just the one Almighty God, not several.
I agree that there is just one God. But I'm beginning to doubt that you do, or that you do consistently.
I don't say that flippantly or even accusatorily. But you have made a point out of the term God meaning "mighty one". Yet you've also made a point that there are many mighty ones. To say that God is THE Almighty One among the many Mighty Ones then needs something to substantiate it beyond a presupposition that it is so. And you have yet to offer that. Rather you continue to reiterate that there are many mighty ones, so that would mean that there are many gods. And there would be as much reason to refer to them as not just mighty but almighty as there is to refer to Jehovah as not just mighty but almighty based on what you have presented of your substantiated beliefs thus far. Now, I know that in fact as a JW you don't believe that there is a god mighty than Jehovah, but on what basis? Especially, since you can't do that based on the word 'el and certainly not elohim alone.
And who do you say is spoonfeeding me? My own religion actually provides me with very little information about Islam. So I am forced to do my own independant research. In fact, discussion boards like this are a mine of information for someone like me. But I have found that many members object to having me here.
The objection stems from both your ignorance and obstinacy when provided with proper exegesis your lack of willingness to accept the source information as adequate favoring your own beliefs as the correct rendition. People tire of that song and dance after a while.. you are certainly welcome to your beliefs, you are just not welcome to explain our beliefs to us-- quote from the noble Quran and tell us that is what is supposed to mean. millennium old traditions that is preserved as no other literature in ancient times isn't subject to some JW calisthenics with words!
all the best
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
I agree that there is just one God. But I'm beginning to doubt that you do, or that you do consistently.
when it comes to multi gods you are both in the same ballpark.. I find it mildly amusing that you deem him a heretic when you subscribe to similar beliefs. pot calling kettle black!
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Then you must acknowledge that "elohim", when applied to Jehovah, (although the plural form) doesn't actually mean that he is "Gods". He is just one God.
The objection stems from both your ignorance and obstinacy when provided with proper exegesis your lack of willingness to accept the source information as adequate favoring your own beliefs as the correct rendition. People tire of that song and dance after a while.. you are certainly welcome to your beliefs, you are just not welcome to explain our beliefs to us-- quote from the noble Quran and tell us that is what is supposed to mean. millennium old traditions that is preserved as no other literature in ancient times isn't subject to some JW calisthenics with words!
all the best
I can understand that. I get people challenging my religious beliefs all the time, even here. And the Bible translated by JWs, the New World Translation, is always being attacked as containing errors.
It is called possessing the ability for a critical independent thought.. indeed at the time I was living in the dorms for the first time away from everyone's influence!
all the best
Maybe that was what you needed to do. Sort things out for yourself without having other people telling you what to think.
The Sep 11 attacks must have polarized the thinking of many people either for or against Islam.
Evidently, those who DID further research about Islam on their own after 9/11 had more favorable views about Islam than prior to 9/11, while those who preferred to be spoonfed by the media had worse views about Islam than before.
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