Re: One Hundred Christian Proofs Of Islamic Falsehood (OP)
I am a Christian and I would like to participate. Since most of the arguments posted above are not real arguments at all and only pretend to be funny (number 21 for example) why don't we focus on the real arguments? Number 2 for instance is a good argument that most Christians agree with. Muhammad killed and killed many people. Jesus certainly didn't, not even to save his life. Who looks closer to our idea of a merciful God?
Interesting. Do you have citations for the above in the Quran, particularly that last sentence?
The last sentence is from the statement of the Prophet Muhamamd pbuh. He tells us in a lengthy hadith narrated in Sahîh Bukhârî #7440 that Allah will continually remove those believers who commited sin from Hellfire after they have been purified of their sins by the punishment. Allah will say, ‘Go, and whoever you find with a dinar’s-weight of faith in his heart, bring him forth, and Allaah will forbid their bodies to the Fire.’
[...] ‘Go, and whoever you find with half a dinar’s-weight of faith in his heart, bring him forth.’ [...] ‘Go, and whoever you find with an atom’s-weight of faith in his heart, bring him forth.’ [... until God removes the last group from Hell described as follows...]
Then they will enter Paradise, and the people of Paradise will say, ‘These are the people emancipated by the Most Merciful. He has admitted them into Paradise without them having done any good deeds and without them having sent forth any good (for themselves).’ Then it will be said to them, ‘You will have what you have seen and the equivalent thereof.
The companion who narrated the hadith quoted a relevant verse:
Qur'an 4:40 Indeed, Allah does not do injustice, [even] as much as an atom's weight; while if there is a good deed, He multiplies it and gives from Himself a great reward.
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
The last sentence is from the statement of the Prophet Muhamamd pbuh. He tells us in a lengthy hadith narrated in Sahîh Bukhârî #7440 that Allah will continually remove those believers who commited sin from Hellfire after they have been purified of their sins by the punishment. Allah will say, ‘Go, and whoever you find with a dinar’s-weight of faith in his heart, bring him forth, and Allaah will forbid their bodies to the Fire.’
[...] ‘Go, and whoever you find with half a dinar’s-weight of faith in his heart, bring him forth.’ [...] ‘Go, and whoever you find with an atom’s-weight of faith in his heart, bring him forth.’ [... until God removes the last group from Hell described as follows...]
Then they will enter Paradise, and the people of Paradise will say, ‘These are the people emancipated by the Most Merciful. He has admitted them into Paradise without them having done any good deeds and without them having sent forth any good (for themselves).’ Then it will be said to them, ‘You will have what you have seen and the equivalent thereof.
The companion who narrated the hadith quoted a relevant verse:
Qur'an 4:40 Indeed, Allah does not do injustice, [even] as much as an atom's weight; while if there is a good deed, He multiplies it and gives from Himself a great reward.
Regards
Much like orbitals in an atom have quantized energy levels, a Paradise with multiple levels must to each level have a quantized entry criteria. This constitutes a level of righteousness, or good deeds, or works.
Does Islam consider Christ to be sinless?
Does Islam consider Muhammed to be sinless?
What is the source of a hadith?
Is a hadith considered God's word?
Is it true that in the bible, it says that the earth is the centre of the universe and that the sun rotates around it? And that the church tried to ban galilees work for this very reason?
Also to ansr al adl
Inn the quran, allah says that the earth is oval shaped, right? U've pretty much probably guessed by now that im no scholar. I only know about7 or 8 suras by heart which i use to pray with.
Much like orbitals in an atom have quantized energy levels, a Paradise with multiple levels must to each level have a quantized entry criteria. This constitutes a level of righteousness, or good deeds, or works.
This is true only if the levels in paradise are discrete.
Does Islam consider Christ to be sinless?
Does Islam consider Muhammed to be sinless?
Prophets were infallible in that they could not commit any sins or fail in their transmission of the message. However, they were susceptible to minor mistakes and temporary lapse in human judgement on lesser issues. For more info see my post here: http://www.islamicboard.com/75709-post2.html
What is the source of a hadith?
A hadith is a report transmitted from the Prophet Muhammad pbuh. Scholars study the chain of narrators in a hadith to evaluate the authenticity of its ascription to the Prophet. Famous hadith compilations include Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abi Dawud, Sunan An-Nasaa'i, Sunan Ibn Maajah, Sunan At-Tirmidhi and many others.
Is a hadith considered God's word?
Hadith is the word of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh inspired by God. So the meaning is divine but the specific wording is not. The Qur'an, on the other hand, is divinbe in both wording and meaning. One can say that the Qur'an is the revealed word of God while the hadith is the inspired word of God.
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
Also to ansr al adl
Inn the quran, allah says that the earth is oval shaped, right?
There are some verses interpreted as such;
format_quote Originally Posted by It-is-truth
Consider the following Qur’aanic verse regarding the alternation of day and night: “Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day And He merges Day into Night?” [Al-Qur’aan 31:29] Merging here means that the night slowly and gradually changes to day and vice versa. This phenomenon can only take place if the earth is spherical. If the earth was flat, there would have been a sudden change from night to day and from day to night. The following verse also alludes to the spherical shape of the earth: “He created the heavens And the earth In true (proportions): He makes the Night Overlap the Day, and the Day Overlap the Night.” [Al-Qur’aan 39:5] The Arabic word used here is Kawwara meaning ‘to overlap’ or ‘to coil’– the way a turban is wound around the head. The overlapping or coiling of the day and night can only take place if the earth is spherical. The earth is not exactly round like a ball, but geo-spherical i.e. it is flattened at the poles. The following verse contains a description of the earth’s shape: The Qur’aan and Modern Science: Compatible or Incompatible?
“And the earth, moreover, Hath He made egg shaped.” [Al-Qur’aan 79:30]*
(* The Arabic word dahaha has been translated by A. Yusuf Ali as “vast expanse”, which also is correct. The word dahaha also means an ostrich-egg. Consider the following verses related to the nature of light from the sun and the moon: “It is He who made the sun To be a shining glory And the moon to be a light (Of beauty).” [Al-Qur’aan 10:5])
The Arabic word for egg here is dahaha, which means an ostrich-egg. The shape of an ostrich-egg resembles the geo-spherical shape of the earth. Thus the Qur’aan correctly describes the shape of the earth, though the prevalent notion when the Qur’aan was revealed was that the earth is flat.
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
Of all religions, I respect Islam and Judaism. Chrsitianity is a joke and the Bible is poorly written (and fabricated) fiction.
The first five books of the Bible constitute the Jewish Torah, so you've insulted Jewish believers with that comment too, even though you claim to respect their religion.
(P.S.: all fiction is fabricated - you could have saved yourself a bit of typing there.)
Does Islam consider Christ to be sinless?
Does Islam consider Muhammed to be sinless?
format_quote Originally Posted by Ansar Al-'Adl
Prophets were infallible in that they could not commit any sins or fail in their transmission of the message. However, they were susceptible to minor mistakes and temporary lapse in human judgement on lesser issues. For more info see my post here: http://www.islamicboard.com/75709-post2.html
So, are you saying that both Christ and Muhammed made minor mistakes or had temporary lapses in human judgment on lesser issues? I tried to figure out your answer from the link, but couldn't.
So, are you saying that both Christ and Muhammed made minor mistakes or had temporary lapses in human judgment on lesser issues? I tried to figure out your answer from the link, but couldn't.
Peace
All prophets - including MOSES, JESUS, DAVID, SOLOMON, ABRAHAM and MUHAMMAD are SINLESS.
Prophets were infallible in that they could not commit any sins or fail in their transmission of the message.
On another thread (this one - see post #3) I read that god is supposed to have sent 124,000 prophets to different parts of the world, but that not all of them were accepted by the people. Is this true?
So, are you saying that both Christ and Muhammed made minor mistakes or had temporary lapses in human judgment on lesser issues?
Yes.
format_quote Originally Posted by czgibson
On another thread (this one - see post #3) I read that god is supposed to have sent 124,000 prophets to different parts of the world, but that not all of them were accepted by the people. Is this true?
Yes. Every nation recieved a prophet.
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
Interesting, thanks. Where does the figure of 124,000 come from? Surely there weren't that many nations? Or did some nations receive more than one prophet?
I was interested in the part about not all of them being accepted by the people, compared with your statement about them being unable to fail in the transmission of the message. Does this mean that they transmitted the message perfectly, but it wasn't always accepted?
Interesting, thanks. Where does the figure of 124,000 come from? Surely there weren't that many nations? Or did some nations receive more than one prophet?
Yes some nations recieved multiple Prophets, like the children of Israel, for example. The figure comes from a hadith narrated in the Musnad of Imâm Ahmad.
I was interested in the part about not all of them being accepted by the people, compared with your statement about them being unable to fail in the transmission of the message. Does this mean that they transmitted the message perfectly, but it wasn't always accepted?
Yes, the Qur'an gives many examples of people who rejected the message of their Prophet. Nuh, Hud, Salih, Shu'aib, Lut all were rejected by their people who were subsequently punished and destroyed. Others, like the nation of Yunus, initially rejected his call but then later repented and accepted it.
Peace.
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
Yes, the Qur'an gives many examples of people who rejected the message of their Prophet. Nuh, Hud, Salih, Shu'aib, Lut all were rejected by their people who were subsequently punished and destroyed. Others, like the nation of Yunus, initially rejected his call but then later repented and accepted it.
Peace.
And some people, even after being punished by Allah (swt), just grow stronger in their disbelief. Look what happened to the Minoans. They were polytheists who worshipped idols, with a religion similar to that of the Greeks. They were then punished for this by the eruption of Santorini/Thera, which ruined their civilisation. But they did not turn from their old ways, and started revering the sea instead, because of the tsunami from the volcano that destroyed their cites. Finally, the Minoans were conquered by the Greeks, and the civilisation was gone completely. There are more stories like this from all around the world, including the events which took place on Easter Island, which are an indesputable warning to anyone, whether they believe in the stories presented by the Quran or not.
There are more stories like this from all around the world, including the events which took place on Easter Island, which are an indesputable warning to anyone, whether they believe in the stories presented by the Quran or not.
Are you seriously suggesting that the decline of Easter Island took place because its inhabitants were not Muslim?
[QUOTE All prophets - including MOSES, JESUS, DAVID, SOLOMON, ABRAHAM and MUHAMMAD are SINLESS.[\QUOTE]
[QUOTE The minimum required limit to get to paradise is to simply believe in God and His Messenger and to abide by His commands, and when one sins - which is something all human beings do - to repent to God and seek His forgiveness.[\QUOTE]
The only way to resolve the inconsistancies between the two claims above is to assume prophets are not human?
1. The Bible says David committed adultry.
2. The Bible says Solomon turned against God and sought after idols and God took the kingdom out of his hand.
3. The Bible says Moses failed to give God glory when bringing water out of a rock, and was therefore prevented from entering the promise land.
Based on your statements:
The possible choices are:
1. The Quran specifically says this is not true making the Bible false,
2. The Quran does not address this at all meaning the Bible could be true,
3. The Quran does not include adultery, idolatry as sins but rather as temporary lapses in human judgement.
All prophets - including MOSES, JESUS, DAVID, SOLOMON, ABRAHAM and MUHAMMAD are SINLESS.
The minimum required limit to get to paradise is to simply believe in God and His Messenger and to abide by His commands, and when one sins - which is something all human beings do - to repent to God and seek His forgiveness.
format_quote Originally Posted by dougmusr
The only way to resolve the inconsistancies between the two claims above is to assume prophets are not human?
1. The Bible says David committed adultry.
2. The Bible says Solomon turned against God and sought after idols and God took the kingdom out of his hand.
3. The Bible says Moses failed to give God glory when bringing water out of a rock, and was therefore prevented from entering the promise land.
Based on your statements:
The possible choices are:
1. The Quran specifically says this is not true making the Bible false,
2. The Quran does not address this at all meaning the Bible could be true,
3. The Quran does not include adultery, idolatry as sins but rather as temporary lapses in human judgement.
Excellent post, Doug. Only GOD has not sinned. That is another proof of Christ's Deity, because ONLY Jesus of all men who walked this earth did NOT SIN.
Jesus said in John 8:46 (Living Bible), "Which of you can truthfully accuse me of one single sin? [No one!] And since I am telling you the truth, why don't you believe me?"
Paul said in 2 Cor. 5:21, "For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.
Peter said of Christ in 1 Peter 2:22, "Who committed no sin, nor was guile found in His mouth.''
John said of Christ in 1 John 3:5, "And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin."
There are many verses to show all other men are sinners, like this one:
Ecclesiastes 7:20. For there is not a just man on earth who does good and does not sin.
Romans 3:23, "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
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“Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day And He merges Day into Night?” [Al-Qur’aan 31:29]
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