Mustafa Kemal Ataturk - Enemy of Islam?

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Bro Skillgannon,

Something odd about Turkey is that they don't worship false gods or anything, the grand majority at least. The nation is nearly 99% Muslim, one of the highest concentrations in the world.

Its just the general public has little understanding.

To add the least, the military of Turkey is pro-secular, and they're the power machines in Turkey, not the parliament or people.

However, I agree with you that Turkey will be brought to light one day.
 
Dahir said:
Bro Skillgannon,

Something odd about Turkey is that they don't worship false gods or anything, the grand majority at least. The nation is nearly 99% Muslim, one of the highest concentrations in the world.

Its just the general public has little understanding.

To add the least, the military of Turkey is pro-secular, and they're the power machines in Turkey, not the parliament or people.

However, I agree with you that Turkey will be brought to light one day.
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I was using false god to refer their worship of secularism, nationalism, their own desires e.t.c beside Allah(swt).

Here: That verse shoud clear it up for you.

Allah says: “Have you seen such a one as takes as his god his own vain desire? Allah has, left him astray upon knowledge and sealed his hearing and his heart, and set a covering upon his sight. Who, then, will guide him after Allah? Will you not then receive admonition?” [ Sûrah al-Jâthiyah : 23]

Here Is a good article:

“Indeed polytheism is a mighty oppression”
 
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The reason why I hate Kemal was because he made the Turks feel "Turkish" before being "Muslim", he infected Turkey with the disease of nationalism. Nationalism is anathema to spirituality, because people feel loyal to a state or ethnic identity before they feel loyal to Allah and the community of believers. Kemal believed Islam was backwards and was impeding Turkey's progress. But actually, Islam is progress, and secularism and nationalism is nothing but tribal regression. Now Islam in Turkey has lost any real meaning to change people's lives. It has been tamed and is not the dynamic Faith that it is intended to be, uplifting humanity, cultivating spiritual and moral values in people, and spreading social justice. This is not the kind of Islam which was brought by Ahazrat (Sallallaho alaihi wa salaam), in his life we see Islam as an active religion, and in the time of his Companions we see how much importance it played in day to day public life.

The disease is Christianity, which views faith as a strictly personal/individual affair, with no relevance to society at all. But if you read the Bible, God is presented as a God for the nation, punishing whole nations, not just individuals, and blessing whole nations for their righteousness or wickedness.

Similarly in the Holy Quran, Allah says:

Thus, have We made of you an Ummat justly balanced, that ye might be witnesses over the nations (2:143)

But what kind of ummah do we have in Turkey that they seek to limit the influence of our Religion, rather than enjoin good and forbid evil, and be witness for their own Faith for the rest of the world which is a religious obligation?
 
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Dahir said:
Bro Skillgannon,

Something odd about Turkey is that they don't worship false gods or anything, the grand majority at least. The nation is nearly 99% Muslim, one of the highest concentrations in the world.

Its just the general public has little understanding.

To add the least, the military of Turkey is pro-secular, and they're the power machines in Turkey, not the parliament or people.

However, I agree with you that Turkey will be brought to light one day.
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Sure, it will be brought to the 'light' one day. It will try it a bit. It might flourish for a while, it might not. It will try something different after a while, going back to secularism for example, or trying an despotic system of government. Political and social change are a given throughout history. In the 1400 or so years of Islam there has not been one country that tried the Islamic system of government and actually stuck with it.
 
The time of the Prophet(saw) and the Islamic Empire was Shariah based. And yes it was stuck with for a very long time. It's the fault of the Muslims that we are in such a predicament.
 
Dahir said:
However, I agree with you that Turkey will be brought to light one day.
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Is it? After watching the 200,000 pro-seculars protesting Erdogan to be president in Ankara several days ago..... I think the "light" would be like centuries to come.

Muslim seculars seem more "PRO-SECULAR" than the Christian ones...
 
ottoman empire was sick man of europe in 18 century. Turkey take a wreck over from ottoman. but Turkey still the most forward country between the all islamic countries. so you better worry about your own country's future rather than Turkey's europe advanture
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Ottomans were not the sick man of europe in 1700's,,in those years,all of the european countries were ruling their own people with pretty high taxes,but ottomans never did this,even they needed money more than before...and they never followed the way of imperialism like the others(like british or french etc),they enslaved other poor n weak countries,but ottomans didnt,thats why the ottomans couldnt industrialized enough,while europeans were using naturel resources of other countries for their own benefits,ottomans tried to keep justice,,,

and if they were pretty weak,how can they won Gallipoli n the other wars wars?they fought against nearly all the europeans...

in our history books,everythng is being tought different than truth...to make us nationalists,or to make us dont like the other muslim communities...
 
north_malaysian said:
Is it? After watching the 200,000 pro-seculars protesting Erdogan to be president in Ankara several days ago..... I think the "light" would be like centuries to come.

Muslim seculars seem more "PRO-SECULAR" than the Christian ones...
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salam bros,

i believe what has written above n pray for this...

about the protest,
they called people, for this protest, many weeks ago,and even in universities,they forced or at least 'adviced' the students to attend,they used media channels,news papers etc..but only 120 000 people participated in...and this is not a big number at all...we are 75 million people bro,,Turkiye has some extremes,thats true,many people doesnt want Tayyip to be president,but also many people wants to see him as president...

so dont think that pessimistic,we are hopefull:)

wassalam
 
abdil han said:
they forced or at least 'adviced' the students to attend
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I was a uni. student once... I do know the consequence of not following the "ADVICE"... even Turkish students have the same problem like Malaysian students too. So sad.


Do you think Erdogan would make a better President for Turkey?
 
lets look to concrete realities rather than looking abstract numbers

http://img267.imageshack.us/...267/3382/mitingun4.jpg

it was executed at the remarked area in link. the places remarked with blue are where you saw on the photoghraphs. below, where the red point finishes is Anıtkabir (square little white building) the red strips are roads with 6 each lanes with huge pavement. between the red point start and finish it is 2km. to walk the short red place remarked at left is about 15 minutes....

official numbers: number of people who visit Anıtkabir is 370 000. all people coundnt visit Anıtkabir because of crowd. and the rest who didnt join the meeting doesnt mean against secularism. my family , friends all are "secular" people but only a friend of my joined living in Ankara. this is not mean we are not supporting. it is the one of the biggest meeting which's participation is high that much in the history of Turkey Republic. even in the public surveys ratios are showing that majority dont want erdoğan to become president.
and i really curious about that where did you get the information that students were forced. as a university student i didnt witnessed such a thing even i didnt heard from my friends even from the friends from other universities. if such a thing happened i really want to learn that to protest. you know we want "sözde değil özde cumhuriyet savunucuları!!!! "
 
and i really curious about that where did you get the information that students were forced. as a university student i didnt witnessed such a thing even i didnt heard from my friends even from the friends from other universities. if such a thing happened i really want to learn that to protest. you know we want "sözde değil özde cumhuriyet savunucuları!!!! "
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Inonu Uni. rector called every student to attend this meeting,and they postponed all the exams on that meeting day,and in some universities(like ODTU) ,they wanted students to make some researces about ''sarıkız'' (i thnk u know about it),,(the disposing plans of the government by some generals)...

these are happening here,,,unfortunately...

many people may think that Tayyip must nt be the president...but many people also wants this...

and Tayyip will nt harm 'secular system' ,,no need to worry about this...
 
abdil han said:
Inonu Uni. rector called every student to attend this meeting,and they postponed all the exams on that meeting day,and in some universities(like ODTU) ,they wanted students to make some researces about ''sarıkız'' (i thnk u know about it),,(the disposing plans of the government by some generals)...

these are happening here,,,unfortunately...

many people may think that Tayyip must nt be the president...but many people also wants this...

and Tayyip will nt harm 'secular system' ,,no need to worry about this...
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70% of turk want tayyip erdogan to be president....minority and military dont want this...no danger for secularızm no danger for republic ...
 
Dahir said:
-Turkey got a helping hand from the USA and European Community -- and its a NATO nation, which really helps it.
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USA and EC helped to Turkey??????? you are funny! do you have any evidence about it.

in fact USA and Europe has never helped to us! Moreover USA and Europe maked embargo on Turkey in 70s because we saved Turks in cyprus who were under attact of Greek. IS THIS YOUR HELP? IF SO WE DONT WANT YOUR HELP!!!
 
I've come to talk to you guys about Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, the man who single-handedly broke up the Caliphate and threw Turkey head-first into future apostasy. Ataturk took pride in breaking up the Caliphate and has a legacy for it - a shameful legacy that too many Turks, sadly, take pride in.
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:sl:
Whilst he did do a lot to demolish Islamic culture in Turkey, Ataturk did not exactly get rid of the Caliphate single-handedly, he had lots of help from other organisations and states.
  • The Caliphate was already pretty rotten. The Ottomans had been on the decline for a long time before WWI, Ataturk just finished off a dying beast.
  • Western countries didn't want there to be another Caliphate, probably because of the way the Ottomans and others had tried to conquer Europe for centuries, or because it might have been a threat to their power.
  • The Sharif of Makkah proclaimed himself both the new Caliph and king of the Hijaz after the end of the Ottomans. Then the Saudis invaded and finished them off, exiling the Caliph to Cyprus. His claim was pretty much ignored anyway.
  • The last Ottoman Caliph also tried to make a comeback in Makkah, but failed too.
  • The King of Morrocco is known as 'Amir-al-Mumineen' to this day. So was the former head of the Taliban. Both of these claims are not really recognised though.
  • The Mureeds of many Sufis consider their Mushrids 'Amir Ahle-Sunnat'. Despite the conflicting claims they don't really argue with eachother about it though.
  • The Ahmadiyya consider their leader a Caliph, but not in a political sense.
  • :w:
 
Arabs and the English helped a great deal, had it not been for ata Turk, Arabs would have swapped Turkey with penthouse subscription + a bevy of white girls + a room in a Mayfair apartment block, a table at a gambling house and a name plaque in some foreign university
 
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Whatsthepoint said:
Could a Turkish speaking member translate what the woman is saying:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCLwLbyP3Q8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNx6ywvNRyo
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first video:

Nur serter is a senator in the parliamentary of Turkey. It is a news about her.

She is very disturbed of sayings of Minister of education like "Allah, prophet" :D She hates Fethullah Gülen's Schools in the world.

Minister of National Education (Hüseyin Celik) replies her:

"Should I think like you? Should I be like you!?? "

the rest of video is like this arguments.

second video:

Ufuk uras a political party leader. His party has a communist sight. Nur Serter insultes his party but Uras defendes his party.
 
mustklc said:
first video:

Nur serter is a senator in the parliamentary of Turkey. It is a news about her.

She is very disturbed of sayings of Minister of education like "Allah, prophet" :D She hates Fethullah Gülen's Schools in the world.

Minister of National Education (Hüseyin Celik) replies her:

"Should I think like you? Should I be like you!?? "

the rest of video is like this arguments.

second video:

Ufuk uras a political party leader. His party has a communist sight. Nur Serter insultes his party but Uras defendes his party.
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Yeah, she's a secularist. She was also the vice rector of the Istanbul university. Did she in any way contribute to the headscarf ban?
 

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