Advice Need:Co-Wife

τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ;1439517 said:



you need to evince that from the Quran and Sunnah.. Islamic society wasn't a segregated society pls, do not pass fatwa ad lib!

best,

are you muslim? just wow. you have so much down that is so wrong. what makes you think it was not segregated? have you not read the Quraan already that you should know this? about not mixing freely with men and that you should no interact with non-mahrams? what is wrong with you? and if you have not read it or ever heard of that being wrong, which frankly surprises me, i am sure you have and are just acting like you don't know, still, here, fatwas full of Quraan references:

1- Attraction between the sexes can occur in any circumstances, no matter how much men and women may deny that. The attraction may start within the bounds of sharee’ah and end up going beyond those bounds.
Even if a person protects himself (by marriage), he is not safe from the snares of the Shaytaan.
3- Even though a person may be able to guarantee himself and he works with the opposite sex within reasonable limits, he cannot guarantee the feelings of the other party.
Finally, there is nothing good in mixing and it does not bear fruit as they claim. On the contrary, it corrupts sound thinking.

- i had inserted links but due to the discrimination on this website it will not let me post links to prove you wrong. how ironic that you can go around saying whatever stupidity comes into your brain and someone who has something constructive to say, they won't let them post it. but moving on.

internet forums did not exist at the time on the Prophet so i would not be able to give you any direct Hadith which mentions that. but you see i, unlike you, am not one to challenge my Allah. i don't go up to brothers with beards and say salam even, i look down when i walk on the street and they pass me, therefore, if it's the internet, i still have my heart in hijab and don't want to even talk to them, as i would not talk to them in real life. end of story. you may need lots of evidence to convince you because you are too arrogant, a good muslim looks at the Quraan and says, ok Allah said this is wrong, meaning it's wrong in every way, any way, all ways. finish. if there were ANY exceptions, Allah would state them. He did not. Prophet did not. so therefore, neither can you pass fatwas according to you messed up views. go study Islam and stop wasting time on forums. this is by no way a good halal thing to engage in when you are talking to all sorts of guys on here. it is not even related to work so it's in fact the worst type of interaction. it is completely unwarranted and unnecessary. for instance, i saw a post last night about you going swimming - was that really necessary - why do you want people to know how you dress when you swim? do you not realize weak men may start picturing you or being curious about how you must look? have some sense! you're not a child i am sure. for all your claim to be smart, your actions are quite stupid. it is absolutely necessary to speak up against wrong people like you so you fail miserably in your agenda to spread lies and get other people off track!

again it was necessary to post this for smart people, excluding you, to read this and understand, you have too much of an ego to ever admit you are wrong. but hopefully other sisters will read this and smarten up. i posted this for their benefit.

men are weak creatures at heart. they can literally even be attracted to so much as a fingernail that is really nice looking and the colour of the skin around it. why has Allah told us women to be ever so careful. even our attitude and our rudeness can be attractive to some. perhaps having our gender as undisclosed can still make them wonder, oh i wonder if she's a girl, oh i wonder how she looks, oh i wonder this and that. i'm not saying all brothers on here are like that. but many are, which i can tell from the fact that you will always see them posting in the common forums and engaging in wrong topics. there are even topics on here about intimate relationships and very sensitive stuff, and you will see brothers jumping up to comment on those. i do question the integrity of any of those who talk to or ever reply to a female on this forum. they should not be doing it, end of story. we are muslims and we need to be responsible and stop all this nonsense of brother/sister, these people are not your mahrams, there is no need to interact with them. the fact that you need to have so many posts before you can gain access to a girls only section is sad. it's not like i never have to interact with men in real life, i definitely do, BUT that is necessary, and work related and it ends at that. this on here is unwarranted and it's not like you are getting any reward for it, and isn't it better to be cautious and protect yourself? who do you know is out there? be smart girls. stop posting in the common forums and post only where other sisters read your threads, because YOU do NOT realize even things which you would never think could attract a man, they could attract him, you don't know yourself as well as your Allah does. so obey him and stop being such a question machine asking for "evidence" and asking people to convince you. read what Allah expects from you, follow that, be happy, finish. if our Prophet even prohibited us from looking or talking, how about mixing freely on the internet talking about sex and other filthy topics? it angers me and cannot find people who engage in it good in any way.

someone needs to break your ego and put you in your place. don't act like you know all that, you barely know Islam. you choose not to answer to valid points and try to stick up fights on stupid little points. just wow. borderline personality disorder much?
 
Can we please stay on topic or the thread will be closed. There is no need for any personal attacks by anyone. Let us remember that our evety post should be to please almighty Allah NOT our enemy shaythan. Jazakallahu khayr
 
i am polite to those who are polite themselves. here is a Quraan ayat which lets me act in retaliation to those who are rude to me. i am sorry to those who have to see this side of me, but really, i will not sit by and watch so much wrong stuff being said, i absolutely need to speak up against these people who are promoting biddah actions. and inshaAllah my Allah will reward me for it.

quoted from islam q and a:

But if this forgiveness will lead to humiliation, then the Muslim has to settle the score. Concerning that Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And those who, when an oppressive wrong is done to them, take revenge”

[al-Shoora 42:39]

Imam Ibn Rajab al-Hanbali said, commenting on this verse:

With regard to the phrase “And those who, when an oppressive wrong is done to them, take revenge” – this does not contradict the idea of forgiveness, because taking revenge may mean demonstrating the ability to take revenge, then one may forgive after that, in which case forgiveness will come in a better context. Al-Nakha’i said concerning this verse: They do not like to be humiliated, so if they are in a position to settle the score, then they will forgive. Mujaahid said: They did not like for the believer to let himself be humiliated, which would lead the evildoers to feel contempt for him.

If the believer is wronged, then he should show that he is able to take revenge, then he should forgive after that. Many of the salaf did that, including ‘Ata’, Qutaadah and others.

Jaami’ al-‘Uloom wa’l-Hukam, 1/179

Hence forgiveness is not good in all cases, rather it may be blameworthy if it results in humiliation of the Muslim or encourages the aggressor even further, etc.

Allaah has referred to that in the verse (interpretation of the meaning): “but whoever forgives and makes reconciliation, his reward is with Allaah” [al-Shoora 42:40]. Here Allaah states that forgiveness is only good if it is done for the sake of reconciliation; if it leads to bad consequences then it is not good.

Hence the Muslim should look at which serves the greater interest – forgiveness or seeking revenge – and act accordingly. This will vary according to circumstances and the people involved. What Imam Ahmad said about forgiving everyone who causes harm except for an innovator (mubtadi’) is in accordance with this, because he thought that forgiving the followers of bid’ah would have bad consequences, which is that the people would be encouraged to follow innovation. So he stated clearly that innovators were not to be forgiven, as a way of putting people off from those innovations.

end of quote

in this case, there is more harm in allowing this toxic individual to further her agenda of bullying people, intimidating them, going around saying WRONG INVENTED things and giving NO islamic evidence to support her claims and filling others minds with filth like her own. she needs to be banned from this board and needs some serious counselling and help.
 
Can we please stay on topic or the thread will be closed. There is no need for any personal attacks by anyone. Let us remember that our evety post should be to please almighty Allah NOT our enemy shaythan. Jazakallahu khayr

i agree. then why is it that the biggest bullies on this website get a free ride? why are they not contacted by the moderators and admins? do you guys not see how they make others leave through their actions? why is it like this? this vales lily person can say whatever she wants and if someone says anything to her, the thread gets shut down. i am posting a lot in this thread so more people can read it and understand the wrong things going on on this forum. and to you and other moderators and the admin staff i would like to say, kindly speak to this ring of goons and inform them that they better be polite to others. i did not attack anyone first, it was her who started it and i am not the first nor am i the last who she will do this to. it needs to stop. plus she never says anything correct or backs it up with Islam. it's just her own ridiculous opinions which are often unIslamic. then why is she protected here?
 
at least i'm posting some useful information and advice for others. her posts are just to pick on me exclusively and to show off her medical knowledge. in her last few posts, someone please show me anywhere where she actually said something useful or constructive. and then look at mine and see how much good stuff i posted. don't just take sides based on who has been here longer. such people do not deserve respect.
 
it is biddah for you to go around saying that it is ok for a woman to divorce her husband as she may not be able to live with that situation due to her personal beliefs, if those beliefs are unislamic. there you go. happy?

Quote me saying it is ok for a ''woman to divorce her wife because she is not able to live with the situation because of her personal beliefs!'' in those exact words..



best,
 
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oh get a life. i quoted the same hadith that the brother above did, you say JazakAllah to him for the part of the fatwa that is the Sheikh's opinion (correct, but an opinion nevertheless) and then the SAME Hadith that is quoted in that fatwa, when i post that you dare to speak back? you need basic understanding of the english language. learning some big words and throwing them into a sentence doesn't make you smart. asking for a divorce from your husband due to the fact that he wants to re-marry based on your personal views on the matter, which are unislamic, they count as "no reason" as stated by the scholar in that fatwa. you're just stupid. get a life. not worth arguing with you.


Yes it is a sheikh's opinion and therefore we are free to take it if we so desire, you or no body can force us to accept your opinion or your point of view. The scholar in the fatwa said if she can't handle her husband marrying a 2nd wife she can get a khula so I don't see your point. The sheikh has deemed it to be a valid reason otherwise he would not have given her the advice to get a khula if she couldn't handle it.

A valid reason could be that she's no longer happy in the marriage and she's afraid she won't behave in an Islamic manner as a result of her husband taking another wife. It all depends on the individual as a person, you can't forbid every sister who's husband gets married to a 2nd wife from seeking khula because not every woman is the same, some women will break down and stop functioning to the point they can no longer fulfill their husbands rights in the marriage, other women will be able to deal with it. So you see whether she has a right to khula depends on her as an individual and how she is able to deal with it. If she can't handle it to the point that it prevents her from fulfilling her wifely duties then she is well with in her right to ask for a khula.

"The Purpose of khula is to provide the women a way out from the marriage if she fears that she will not be able to uphold the limits and boundaries of Allah (ie the rights of marriage). so in reality, its legislation is in order to remove any harm upon the woman, if she has lost her will to remain in marriage to him."

If she feels that by him taking another wife she won't be able to fulfill his rights upon her, then she can ask for her khula because this is a valid reason.
 
her posts are just to pick on me exclusively and to show off her medical knowledge

again, show me where I have 'show off my medical knowledge' and where I have picked on you 'exclusively'-- when it was in fact you who have directed your first post at me!

I can't get past any and I mean any of your posts without going through a barrage of tasteless insults, and non-information which you pose as Islamic knowledge!
show me where I have used words like stupid on you, or having a personality disorder or worst of all in my book passing takfir.

What is wrong with you?


best,
 
Ibne Abbas (radiyallahu anhuma) reports that the wife of (the Sahabi) Thabit ibne Qays (radiyallahu anhu) came to Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and said, "O Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam), I have no complaints about the character and piety of Thabit, but I fear ungratefulness (of my husband) after accepting Islam." Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) asked her, "Are you prepared to return to him his garden, (which he had given as mahr)?"

She replied in the affirmative. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) then asked Thabit (radiyallahu anhu) to accept the garden and divorce her. (Sahih Al-Bukhari)


In the above hadith, she asked for khula because she feared she would be ungrateful, and Thabit didn't even do anything wrong, however she felt she wouldn't be able to fulfill his rights upon her so she asked for a khula. If a sister feels that she will also not be able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her, she can ask for a khula even if her husband has not doing anything wrong. This is what the female companion in the hadith did. She was unhappy in the marriage, she wanted out, for no other reason other than she wasn't happy in the marriage and was worried it would make her ungrateful to her husband thus she would not be fulfilling his right upon her.
 
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Ibne Abbas (radiyallahu anhuma) reports that the wife of (the Sahabi) Thabit ibne Qays (radiyallahu anhu) came to Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and said, "O Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam), I have no complaints about the character and piety of Thabit, but I fear ungratefulness (of my husband) after accepting Islam." Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) asked her, "Are you prepared to return to him his garden, (which he had given as mahr)?"

She replied in the affirmative. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) then asked Thabit (radiyallahu anhu) to accept the garden and divorce her. (Sahih Al-Bukhari)


In the above hadith, she asked for khula because she feared she would be ungrateful, and Thabit didn't even do anything wrong, however she felt she wouldn't be able to fulfill his rights upon her so she asked for a khula. If a sister feels that she will also not be able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her, she can ask for a khula even if her husband has not doing anything wrong. This is what the female companion in the hadith did. She was unhappy in the marriage, she wanted out, for no other reason other than she wasn't happy in the marriage and was worried it would make her ungrateful to her husband thus she would not be fulfilling his right upon her.

I was thinking of that example but I was too pressed for time to cite it properly Jazaka Allah khyran..
and it actually proves another point.. Here a female talking to the prophet, an example of many like a very detailed description of a black slave woman standing up against Omar Ibn Ilkhtab in the mosque to talk of woman's mahr.. obviously the details of her status and position were also to make a point of a woman's status in Islam compared to pre-Islamic societies at large!
Does that seem like a no contact whatsoever between male and female in whatever form in an Islamic society?

Sobhan Allah.. I worry about the state of the ummah for multiple reasons.. Everyone is a google scholar and no reflection whatsoever is exercised when reflecting about the sunnah and the lives of the prophet, the sahaba and the sahabiaat, or even when addressing fellow Muslims giving them their basic due rights!

:w:
 
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τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ;1439566 said:


Quote me saying it is ok for a ''woman to divorce her wife because she is not able to live with the situation because of her personal beliefs!'' in those exact words..



best,

well women can't divorce their wives, lol, but either way, you didn't say it in those exact words, but your evidence-seeking arrogance i see will not be laid to rest unless in throw your own words in your face, so here you go, see the bolded part:

τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ;1439305 said:

Thank you for acknowledging my logic indeed. I have my own (medical) views on keeping someone who is brain dead on life support which might not be compatible with yours given the above. But outside of medicine, from a humanitarian view I don't think keeping someone who is medically declared brain dead alive by artificial means as any form of love either. I accept that death is natural and that we shall all taste it and that it is the only way to attain eternal life. it would be more painful for me to see someone I love with tubes going in and out of them from every orifice along with a loss of dignity, decline in function for my own selfish reason of wanting them around in any physical form!


I am afraid you lost me with a part of that statement above, and I see a need to inject 'pride' into it as well when as stated pride has nothing to do with it. Sometimes circumstances are above love. Love is just an emotion that is independent from worldly constraints and I certainly don't need to paint several scenarios where it is possible to love someone very much but have to let them go for a greater good!


I think this is just either your inner child speaking through rose tinted glasses or a lack of abstract thought to what real life circumstances might throw your way!

Again, see previous responses and try to differentiate between an allowance and an injunction!
It maybe ok for you to take one or two wives, and it maybe ok for your wives to share, by the same token that is an unacceptable living arrangement for someone else.. As God has made an allowance of polygamy he has also made an allowance with divorces and we have seen many during the time of the prophet.. perfectly pious people who couldn't live under certain circumstances. It isn't up to you to decide what is considered selfish or oxymoronic.


on a last note, I am not 'hurt' at all by what you've written we're exchanging opinions. I may not like your certain choice of words but I accept that this is your line of thinking, I am not denigrating your opinion either.. I am just painting a picture that is outside what you might conceive in your mind as having to be 'logical' to everyone else. Also since when is love at all logical?

best,

so there you go, you said, Allah has made an allowance for divorces too as well a polygamy, then you also said this is an unacceptable living arrangement for some people, and then you said perfectly pious people might not be able to live under such circumstances. meaning you said people who cannot see their husband get married can ask for a divorce and they would be ok in doing so simply by virtue of their personal preferences. THIS = BIDDAH. an innovation. you invented this. others have invented this, this room for personal opinion in front of what Allah has decreed. there are STRICT VALID REASONS in Islam under which it is ok for a woman to seek a divorce, and this is not one of them. here is a quote from a fatwa:

Secondly:

It is permissible for a woman to ask her husband for a divorce, if there is a reason for that to be permissible, such as if he fails to give her her rights or he wrongs her or mistreats her, and does not respond to advice to treat her well and be kind to her.

But if a woman asks for a divorce with no reason, that is haraam and is a major sin.

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, the fragrance of Paradise will be forbidden to her.”

Narrated by Abu Dawood (2226) and al-Tirmidhi (1187); classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said: i.e., without there being strong reason that compels her to seek a separation.

Tuhfat al-Ahqadhi, 4/410

Al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar said:

The reports which warn a woman against asking her husband for a divorce are to be understood as referring to cases where there is no reason for doing that. End quote from Fath al-Baari, 9/402

See also questions no. 9481, 12496 and 34579.

Asking for khula’ is also permissible if it is done for a shar’i reason, so as to ward off wrongdoing or to protect one's rights or other such reasons. This has already been explained in the answer to question no. 1859.

What is haraam is asking for khula’ with no good reason.

It says in a hadeeth that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Women who seek khula’ are hypocrites.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (1186) and al-Nasaa’i (3461), both of whom classed it as da’eef. Ibn Qudaamah said in al-Mughni (7/248): Ahmad mentioned it and quoted it as evidence, and Ibn Hajar was of the view that it is saheeh, as it says in Fath al-Baari, 9/403. It was also classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan al-Tirmidhi, 1186.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said:

i.e., those women who ask for khula’ and divorce from their husbands for no reason. End quote.

Tuhfat al-Ahwadhi, 4/409

end quote of fatwa



if a woman cannot live under the circumstances that her husband re-marries and exclusively wants a divorce only because of her jealously and inability to accept that he is also with someone else, this is not a pious person, and their views are unIslamic, which is evidenced by the fact that the Prophet said no woman is allowed to seek divorce for no reason, and when Allah has made multiple marriage halal, it is not a woman's place to go around saying this is unacceptable to me, because if her Creator thinks she should be able to live with it, she should. therefore, when you go around putting into people's head these ideas that you can be a "pious person" and choose to go against something which Allah has not allowed you to do (that is, seek divorce on the grounds that your husband re-married, because this is an unsuitable living arrangement for you PERSONALLY, not islamically) this is an innovation and you are wrong in doing so.

i hope you are understanding what exactly my issue here is. in short, here it is in bold: my issues here is that you have said that these living arrangements may be unsuitable for someone, so they may not be able to live with it and you claimed thatt that is ok and you said that divorce is permissible due to this, when it is NOT. Islam has strict guidelines about when it is ok for a woman to ask for a divorce from her husband, you cannot just make things up and say "oh well Islam allows polygamy and also allows divorces, and there are pious people who may not be able to live like that, so basically divorce is permissible if you can't live with it." NO. that is not how it works! where did you even get this idea? i would love to see YOU madam give me some evidence this time. i know you will have none though!

τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ;1439570 said:


again, show me where I have 'show off my medical knowledge' and where I have picked on you 'exclusively'-- when it was in fact you who have directed your first post at me!

I can't get past any and I mean any of your posts without going through a barrage of tasteless insults, and non-information which you pose as Islamic knowledge!
show me where I have used words like stupid on you, or having a personality disorder or worst of all in my book passing takfir.

What is wrong with you?


best,


um, actually no, it was not me. i was polite to you and if you see the post quoted above #63 in this thread, that was the one in which YOU said something wrong, YOU were rude first, had a condescending attitude, and it had biddah, and it infuriated me because you have no idea what you are talking about, it is not based on Islamic shariah, you are just innovating stuff as you go which is a shame since you are so influenced by the west and are teaching other girls that it's ok to have no patience and divorce is permissible so why not get it, this is all WRONG. you are not a scholar so refrain from saying stuff as you please. and i felt i needed to correct you and bring down your massive ego. mission accomplished. at least i have proven myself right each time, with Islamic backing, i would love to see some proof from you now about why you said that and show me how what you said is NOT biddah. if you're so tough how about we move past the schoolyard insults and why don't you actually prove me wrong Islamically as opposed to flaming me and insulting me? you know you are wrong, that is why you are hiding and resorting to asking me for evidence - how about YOU bring some yourself. what a joke of a person. google scholar = you. learn some Islam.
 
well women can't divorce their wives, lol, but either way, you didn't say it in those exact words, but your evidence-seeking arrogance i see will not be laid to rest unless in throw your own words in your face, so here you go, see the bolded part:
my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!



so there you go, you said, Allah has made an allowance for divorces too as well a polygamy, then you also said this is an unacceptable living arrangement for some people, and then you said perfectly pious people might not be able to live under such circumstances. meaning you said people who cannot see their husband get married can ask for a divorce and they would be ok in doing so simply by virtue of their personal preferences. THIS = BIDDAH. an innovation. you invented this. others have invented this, this room for personal opinion in front of what Allah has decreed. there are STRICT VALID REASONS in Islam under which it is ok for a woman to seek a divorce, and this is not one of them. here is a quote from a fatwa:
None of what I have written is construed as what you are alleging. In fact when I said perfectly pious people, I intended to use the example of br. Salahudin

Ibne Abbas (radiyallahu anhuma) reports that the wife of (the Sahabi) Thabit ibne Qays (radiyallahu anhu) came to Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and said, "O Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam), I have no complaints about the character and piety of Thabit, but I fear ungratefulness (of my husband) after accepting Islam." Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) asked her, "Are you prepared to return to him his garden, (which he had given as mahr)?"

She replied in the affirmative. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) then asked Thabit (radiyallahu anhu) to accept the garden and divorce her. (Sahih Al-Bukhari)


In the above hadith, she asked for khula because she feared she would be ungrateful, and Thabit didn't even do anything wrong, however she felt she wouldn't be able to fulfill his rights upon her so she asked for a khula. If a sister feels that she will also not be able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her, she can ask for a khula even if her husband has not doing anything wrong. This is what the female companion in the hadith did. She was unhappy in the marriage, she wanted out, for no other reason other than she wasn't happy in the marriage and was worried it would make her ungrateful to her husband thus she would not be fulfilling his right upon her.
Secondly:

It is permissible for a woman to ask her husband for a divorce, if there is a reason for that to be permissible, such as if he fails to give her her rights or he wrongs her or mistreats her, and does not respond to advice to treat her well and be kind to her.
Indeed!
But if a woman asks for a divorce with no reason, that is haraam and is a major sin.
Again, I am waiting for you to quote me specifically where I said seek a divorce for no reason!
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, the fragrance of Paradise will be forbidden to her.”

Narrated by Abu Dawood (2226) and al-Tirmidhi (1187); classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said: i.e., without there being strong reason that compels her to seek a separation.

Tuhfat al-Ahqadhi, 4/410

Al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar said:

The reports which warn a woman against asking her husband for a divorce are to be understood as referring to cases where there is no reason for doing that. End quote from Fath al-Baari, 9/402

See also questions no. 9481, 12496 and 34579.

Asking for khula’ is also permissible if it is done for a shar’i reason, so as to ward off wrongdoing or to protect one's rights or other such reasons. This has already been explained in the answer to question no. 1859.

What is haraam is asking for khula’ with no good reason.

It says in a hadeeth that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Women who seek khula’ are hypocrites.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (1186) and al-Nasaa’i (3461), both of whom classed it as da’eef. Ibn Qudaamah said in al-Mughni (7/248): Ahmad mentioned it and quoted it as evidence, and Ibn Hajar was of the view that it is saheeh, as it says in Fath al-Baari, 9/403. It was also classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Sunan al-Tirmidhi, 1186.

Al-Mubaarakfoori said:

i.e., those women who ask for khula’ and divorce from their husbands for no reason. End quote.

Tuhfat al-Ahwadhi, 4/409

end quote of fatwa
See previous!
if a woman cannot live under the circumstances that her husband re-marries and exclusively wants a divorce only because of her jealously and inability to accept that he is also with someone else, this is not a pious person, and their views are unIslamic, which is evidenced by the fact that the Prophet said no woman is allowed to seek divorce for no reason, and when Allah has made multiple marriage halal, it is not a woman's place to go around saying this is unacceptable to me, because if her Creator thinks she should be able to live with it, she should. therefore, when you go around putting into people's head these ideas that you can be a "pious person" and choose to go against something which Allah has not allowed you to do (that is, seek divorce on the grounds that your husband re-married, because this is an unsuitable living arrangement for you PERSONALLY, not islamically) this is an innovation and you are wrong in doing so.
Not being able to withstand a particular living arrangement isn't a non-reason!

i hope you are understanding what exactly my issue here is. in short, here it is in bold: my issues here is that you have said that these living arrangements may be unsuitable for someone, so they may not be able to live with it and you claimed thatt that is ok and you said that divorce is permissible due to this, when it is NOT. Islam has strict guidelines about when it is ok for a woman to ask for a divorce from her husband, you cannot just make things up and say "oh well Islam allows polygamy and also allows divorces, and there are pious people who may not be able to live like that, so basically divorce is permissible if you can't live with it." NO. that is not how it works! where did you even get this idea? i would love to see YOU madam give me some evidence this time. i know you will have none though!
again I challenge you to quote me directly other than that your feelings toward me or the matter are inconsequential!
I don't think along the same tracts you do and we thank God for that for surely a servant who is knowledgeable is still better than a servant who worships all day.. or is that not how the pious Barsisa ended up a murderer and a devil worshiper after having spent a lifetime in the temple? so don't allege things as having been said by my person when they're only concocted in your very interesting mind!

Also spare me all the extraneous and puerile details of what you think I am, where you think I should be or what you think I should do, I have let it go on several occasions hoping you'd see the error in your ways with everyone gently handling you with kid gloves. I will not be this kind with later posts nor will I grant the benefit of the doubt as you have clearly used them all up!



um, actually no, it was not me. i was polite to you and if you see the post quoted above #63 in this thread, that was the one in which YOU said something wrong, YOU were rude first, had a condescending attitude, and it had biddah, and it infuriated me because you have no idea what you are talking about, it is not based on Islamic shariah, you are just innovating stuff as you go which is a shame since you are so influenced by the west and are teaching other girls that it's ok to have no patience and divorce is permissible so why not get it, this is all WRONG. you are not a scholar so refrain from saying stuff as you please. and i felt i needed to correct you and bring down your massive ego. mission accomplished. at least i have proven myself right each time, with Islamic backing, i would love to see some proof from you now about why you said that and show me how what you said is NOT biddah. if you're so tough how about we move past the schoolyard insults and why don't you actually prove me wrong Islamically as opposed to flaming me and insulting me? you know you are wrong, that is why you are hiding and resorting to asking me for evidence - how about YOU bring some yourself. what a joke of a person. google scholar = you. learn some Islam.
Again and adequate assessment of your person-- as for the rest of your diatribe, you need to come up with new material and actually evince it with what we've actually written and superimpose it on shari3a.
I doubt very much you understand the basics of sharia'a and rather prune to emotive outbursts, suspicion in mannerism and character and given to deception as well which is why we suspect you put up this front, makes you all the more far removed from the very basic tenets of Islam.

But I am not lowly enough to pass takffir on you although I have doubts at all that you're who you allege the second time around and not some bubah from some cesspool in Arkansas unleashed on the forum and you certainly wouldn't be the first of your kind!

best,
 
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My dear sister in the shadows, please calm down and relax, what you have presented are hadiths that state a woman asking for kuhla without a valid reason is wrong, and we all agree with you on this. The issue at hand is, what constitutes a valid reason?

If a woman is no longer able to function happily in a marriage because her husband marries another woman is this a valid reason according to you? Does her happyness not matter at all? Is the woman supposed to be a robot and just get on with things and live a miserable life?

If a woman is no longer able to fulfill her husbands rights upon her because he marries another woman is this a valid reason? Lets say the idea of him being touched by another woman repulses her to the point she no longer has any desire to by intimate with him and as a result can no longer perform in certain scenarios and situations. Then is this a valid reason for her to ask for khula? because she would be denying him his rights?

You see sister it's not a black and white issue, every individual is different. Also sister you've presented those hadiths, however you have not presented an understanding from one of the scholars that says "Because of these ahadith, it is forbidden for a woman to ask for khula if her husband takes another wife"

In the fatwa that I posted earlier, the scholar mentioned the hadith you mentioned, and the ruling he derived from it differed from the ruling you're deriving from it. He said if a woman can't handle it then she can seek the khula. That was his understanding of the hadith, a scholar of Islam.

Now if you could kindly tell us why we should take your understanding and your interpretation of the hadith rather than the scholars understanding and intrepretation that would be very helpful.
 
i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.
 
Just to keep this thread on topic inshallah.....

It might be a bit awkward sharing a husband with a close friend. I would advise you to tread lightly and indirectly ask you friend how she would feel in order to prevent awkwardness or a loss of a friend. You will get a brother to marry inshallah, don't worry sister.
 
i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.

Thank God for your presence here :)

best,
 
i have posted enough here to educate others about your stupidity so my job here is done. good luck with your career as a doctor, which i am sure is a huge lie, i know of no doctors who have so much time during the day to be sitting on the internet arguing with strangers. i proved you wrong, now if you still don't want to accept it, your problem. anyone else reading this would clearly be able to see how wrong you were in what you said/did.

good job ignoring the part where i asked you for evidence by the way. i see you work extremely hard at learning lingo which you think will impress people on the net, but in reality there is no substance to anything you say and anyone with any sense can see through your foolishness and immaturity. you don't even have enough knowledge to back up your own innovated claims. i'm not here to interact with men, unlike you, so i will not respond to whatever that guy above posted. i sure can tear that to pieces just like your dumb posts though. but it's sad that you need someone to come save you and you can't even defend yourself properly. probably because you realize your verbal diarrhea makes no sense so of course you would never find anything to back you up, neither are you that educated in Islam that you would know anything to begin with. i suppose the rest of your posse isn't here, so you were lonely for a bit, don't worry they will all come later and try to help you out and then you can be like "yeah! what he said!" lol, what a joke.

joke of the year: my humble apologies for the typo.. unlike some I don't have all day to write meaningless essays on the forum!

Posts
8,672

LOL. nice.

You had no problem responding to brother Hamza, am I not equally worth a response sister? http://www.islamicboard.com/showthread.php?t=134306701&p=1439563&viewfull=1#post1439563

My sister, you're showing your lack of sincerity by making this into a "I'm right you're wrong, I win hahaha" situation, you mentioned you could tear to pieces what I wrote above, is that all this is about to you? Imam shafi said "I never argued or debated with a person in order to win. I debated to learn the truth". Please contemplate on this statement. It's not about being right or wrong, it's about reaching the truth in any given matter.
 
he is an admin, i was complaining to him.


here are some fatwas for anyone interested in knowing why women should NOT be asking for divorce at every small thing:


She wants a divorce but he does not want to divorce her
I have a sister who is married, but her husband has not consummated the marriage with her yet. Everything was fine until my sister suddenly said that she does not want to live with her husband because she no longer loves him. They have not lived together in their house as husband and wife. When her husband heard her say this he got very angry and refused to divorce her. My sister is insisting that she does not want to live with him and he is insisting that he will not divorce her. We have told her that she cannot get divorced without a legitimate shar’i reason and proof, but she says that he gets angry quickly, and discloses secrets. It should be noted that she has not yet lived with him in the same house. Her husband admits that and says that he will change. What is the shar’i solution to this difficult problem?.

Praise be to Allaah.
If the husband is giving his wife her rights as prescribed in sharee’ah, then it is haraam for her to ask him for a divorce, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who asked for a divorce for no reason, the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden to her.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1187; Abu Dawood, 2226; Ibn Maajah, 2055; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood).

What is meant by the words “for no reason” is without any urgent situation which makes it hard for the marriage to continue.

If the wife is being harmed and the situation is too difficult for her because of the husband’s falling short in giving her her rights, or his withholding her rights from her, or because of his bad treatment and other similar reasons, then she has the right to ask for divorce, and she may refer to the qaadi and tell him what is happening, and he in turn can ask the husband to give her her rights or to divorce her.

If she has found out that he has some bad characteristics, he should not hasten to ask for a divorce, rather she has to be kind to him and advise him in the way that is best, and help him to change his character for the better. He acknowledges the way he is and has promised to change. This is a positive step on the husband’s part and it is the first step in dealing with the problem. The wife should help her husband to do good. If every wife wanted a divorce when he was quick to get angry or transmitted some words that were spoken between him and his wife, or other mistakes, there would be no household that was not broken up and its members scattered.

For more information see the answers to questions no 3758 and 12496.

And Allaah knows best.



Complaint from a wife about her husband’s treatment in bed
My question is very embarrassing but there is nobody I can ask about this.
My husband is good and pious, and I have no reason not to trust him, but he is not giving me my rights in bed. Is it permissible for me to ask him for a divorce, or will I be one of those who will not smell the fragrance of Paradise?

Praise be to Allaah.

If a husband is fulfilling his Islamic duties towards his wife, it is not permissible for her to ask him for a divorce, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “If any woman asks her husband for a divorce for no compelling reason, she will be deprived of the fragrance of Paradise.” (Reported by Imaam Ahmad, 21874, and Ibn Maajah, 2055). The meaning of the phrase “for no compelling reason” is anything that gives her a strong motive for seeking divorce. (Sharh Ibn Maajah ‘ala al-Sanadi).

As for intercourse in bed, if the wife’s demands are greater than what is normal, it is not permissible for her to seek a divorce (the word “normal” refers to what is usual, such as once a week or once every ten days and so on, and people vary in their capacity in this regard). For more information, please see Question # 1078.

If the husband has some defect or sickness that prevents him from having intercourse (i.e., he is impotent), then it is permissible for his wife to ask for a divorce. And Allaah knows best.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid



and hoping this one will be sufficient to prove exactly what i have been saying all along:



She asked him to divorce her if he takes a second wife
My wife and i have discused me having a second wife and she sayes that if i do then she would devorse me.we did not get married by the kafirs but we do have a islamic contract. and there was no agreement on that contract forbiding me from taking a second wife.so my question is .Is it permisable for her to deny me this?And is'nt she making the hallal harram on me. my wife is a good muslimah (I.S.A.) and she would respect a answer whith proof. jazallahkum ma lakair

Praise be to Allaah.

If a man is able to marry a second wife, physically and financially, and he can treat both wives in a just manner, and he wants to take a second wife, then he is allowed to do so according to Islam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“… then marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four…” [al-Nisaa’ 4:3]

And this was the practice of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), and of his Companions (may Allaah be pleased with them), but apart from the Prophet, no one is permitted to have more than four wives.

It is well known that women are by nature jealous and reluctant to share their husband with other women. Women are not to be condemned for this jealousy, for it existed in the best of righteous women, the Sahaabiyyaat, and even in the Mothers of the Believers [the wives of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)]. But women should not let jealousy make them object to that which Allaah has prescribed, and they should not try to prevent it; a wife should allow her husband to marry another woman for this is a kind of cooperating in righteousness and piety. According to a hadeeth whose authenticity is agreed upon, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever pays attention to his brother’s needs, Allaah will pay attention to his needs.”

The first wife’s consent is not a prerequisite for a man to take another wife. The Standing Committee for Issuing Fatwas was asked about this and replied as follows:

“It is not obligatory for the husband, if he wants to take a second wife, to have the consent of his first wife, but it is good manners and kindness to deal with her in such a manner that will reduce the hurt which women naturally feel in such situations. This is done by being kind to her and speaking to her in a gentle and pleasant manner, and by spending whatever money may be necessary in order to gain her acceptance of the situation.”

Concerning her request for divorce if her husband wants to marry another wife, this is a mistake. But they should examine the situation, and if she really cannot cope with living with another wife, then she can ask him for khula’ [ a kind of divorce instigated by the wife, whereby she forgoes the mahr]. If she can cope with living with the second wife, but it hurts her to do so, then she should be patient and seek the pleasure of Allaah. Thawbaan (may Allaah be pleased with him) narrated that the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:

“No woman asks her husband for a divorce for no reason, but the fragrance of Paradise is forbidden for her.” (Narrated by Abu Dawood and others, and classed as saheeh by al-Albaani, may Allaah have mercy on him).

If she bears it with patience, then Allaah will make it easier for her and will expand her chest (i.e., grant her peace and calm), and will compensate her with something good. The husband must also help her by treating her kindly, being patient with her for any jealousy etc. on her part, and overlooking her mistakes. And Allaah is the source of help.


Shaykh ‘Abd-Allaah al-Haydari.
 
Getting back on topic!

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

our suggestion to the moderator to evaluate and close this thread because it was going extremely off topic.

We will not provide a appropriate response to the scandalous false claims but use restraint and perform du'a
that Allah increases the sister with Taqwa and Iman.

Usually when you witness that long ongoing rants there is something else going on in a persons life
and they usually use this space to vent.

I suggest the practicing Muslimah embrace this sister and offer dawah and tabliqh (: جماعة التبليغ‎).

It would do more harm that good to continue assuming anything positive could result from continuing a
dialogue.

If the no other forum member has a positive contribution to offer on this request for advice this
thread has run it's course and should be closed. Insha Allah

Allahu 'Alim
 
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