List why I was not satisfied with my Ex religion

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If you accept inshallah, I wish to invite you for Islam, the religion of our God.
What I can say for now, Islam in the Holy Quran, so if you did not accept the book (Quran) you will not accept the faith (Islam). I think you know that there is not even a single letter difference between any 2 Arabic Quran in the world since the time of Mohammed PBUH, but the translations are different.

I have posted on line, one of the best translations for the meanings of the Holy Quran, for Dr. Mahmud Ghali. PDF file with active links.
I wish you will have the time to read and judge it by yourself inshallah.

http://www.4shared.com/document/t0OLrVzR/­Quran_Translation_by_Dr_Ghali.­html 

You can find more translations on www.quran.com

BRMM

Thank you brmm, I appreciate the offer. I honestly don't see how I could wind up at theism again from where I am, but I'm interested in learning more about your religion. I expect I'll read a translation of the Qur'an at some point. I started to once already, but lost the book before I read very far. I prefer real books, but since it's readily available online, as you've pointed out, I should finish what I started one way or the other.
 
You may have a lighter load of cognitive dissonance than I did, but at this point, if there's a God, whether Jehovah, Yahweh, Allah, or some other; he (or whatever pronoun applies) would know how to reach me, and is welcome to.

How do you know that by coming here to an ISLAMIC board, it is actually not by Allah's will to guide you to the straight path and the truth?
 
You may have a lighter load of cognitive dissonance than I did, but at this point, if there's a God, whether Jehovah, Yahweh, Allah, or some other; he (or whatever pronoun applies) would know how to reach me, and is welcome to.

Well, the story of our human nature is more like that of the prodigal son. If you suppose that God needs you, I am afraid you may wait for him forever.
God only loves us. He does not need us.
 
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Salaam Funny how every one here is so into such religous debates, people work on yourselves because one thing i know for sure is that talk won't grant you salvation from hell fire.

Salaam
 
Thank you brmm, I appreciate the offer. I honestly don't see how I could wind up at theism again from where I am, but I'm interested in learning more about your religion. I expect I'll read a translation of the Qur'an at some point. I started to once already, but lost the book before I read very far. I prefer real books, but since it's readily available online, as you've pointed out, I should finish what I started one way or the other.

You are welcome :)
I have tried to get this translation in a book for me, unfortunately it is not available any where on line.
In my opinion, as I know both Arabic and English,it is one of the best translations, the man who made it spent around 15 years to finish the work.

Maybe what I should say is that, Allah have made The Paradise and The Hell for only who gave them the ability to make their own decision, like us.
Inshallah you will decide to take the Paradise way.
In many cases, the difference in time between being a disbeliever and a believer is only part of a second.
 
Well, the story of our human nature is more like that of the prodigal son. If you suppose that God needs you, I am afraid you may wait for him forever.
God only loves us. He does not need us.

In the same way one can love a child but not need it?
 
In the same way one can love a child but not need it?
Love by its nature is self-sufficient if it is true. It is 'gratuit' as french people say. It does not need anything, it rather rejoice in the beloved freedom and life. It does not 'give' to 'get'. So similarly, for good parents, a child is both a gift to each other and a gift in/for himself. A child is not a product of need, that would not be a child but a slave.
 
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I think this thread is the wrong place to debate or contest other peoples' reasons to be dissatisfied with a particular religion. Or even engage in self-satisfied agreement with other peoples' reasons. Could we rather keep it to sharing?
 
You never know. Just because I don't see it coming doesn't mean it isn't. It just means that if it happens I'll be quite surprised.
 
Riana it is nice to read this from you. As I was raised in a Catholic family so I can understand your views. I was always confused about Jesus in the bible too.
‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’ [John 20:17]
It still amazes me how they teach something different when this verse is so clear.

The main thing that annoys me about Catholics I know is that they have never even read the bible or they don't even own a bible. It is strange that people call themselves Catholic when they don't even know what the religion is about. I think a lot comes down to fear of the unknown. People are afraid of things they don't know which can be seen when new cultures come to live in a country - people feel a bit threatened by a different way of life and they don't want to experience it. I always want to be open minded and search for the truth no matter where it comes from.
 
Peace be with you Sister

I am pleased that you come across this thread.
I have summarized some confusion, let us see what BIBLE speaks about God

1. God - who created the World, seen and unseen, non is Comparable to Him, He is not a Man and He is the only One. Elah or Elohim to Jews, Allah to Arabs (even Christian Arabs), Dios to Spanish and God to most

2. Son of God - bible mentioned that God has many sons = Adam, Israel, Egypt, Ephraim, Jesus, Moises, Me and You too. Acts 17:28-29 We are all offspring of God

Okay LET'S assume God begets, hmm so it means Virgin Mary (pbuh) was the mother & wife? So now Virgin Mary becomes a bad woman, she divorced God and marry another one? I mean there is no LOGIC

Son of God simply means Servant of God

Bible disapproved the Trinity in any sense. Jesus himself said there is ONLY ONE GOD WHOM WE HAVE TO WORSHIP, JESUS FAST 40DAYS TO PLEASE GOD

The "SON OF GOD" title was given to others before and after Jesus in the Bible.

There is no Single Verse in the Bible that Jesus said "Worship me, God & I are equal in every sense"

Jesus was one of the Israeli but Jews rejected Prophet Jesus (pbuh) as a Prophet. How more of a God?

Muslims love Prophet Jesus (pbuh) more than anyone in this World, if Christian claims they love Jesus and they drink alcohol, eat PORK, do not fast, do not pray, do not follow his teachings, then we can conclude that their love for Jesus is absolutely FALSE.

Reading the following will make you understand that Priest wronged themselves, so no one can rely on them.

Quran 2:256 There is no Compulsion in religion, so I hope you will continue your discovery and eventually if your heart sincerely desires, may you find the perfect PATH. no single doubt or confusion

Here's the 10Commandments (from diff bible chapters) and other verses that are self explanatory
[TABLE="class: cms_table_wikitable"]
[TR]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][SUP]2[/SUP] I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery; [SUP]3[/SUP] you shall have no other gods before me.[/TD]
[TD][SUP]6[/SUP] I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery; [SUP]7[/SUP] you shall have no other gods before me.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][SUP]4[/SUP] You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. [SUP]5[/SUP] You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me,
[SUP]6[/SUP] but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.[/TD]
[TD][SUP]8[/SUP] You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. [SUP]9[/SUP] You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me,
[SUP]10[/SUP] but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]




Luke 4:5-8 “The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. And he said to him, ‘I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. So if you worship me, it will all be yours.’
Jesus answered, ‘it is written: “Worship the Lord your God and serve him only
“One of the teachers of the law came and noticed them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, ‘Of all the commandments, which is the most important?’
‘The most important one,’ answered Jesus, ‘is this: “Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.
Love the Lord your Only God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.” ….Well said, teacher,’ the man replied. ‘You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him..”




Numbers 23:19: God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?

Hosea 11:9 I will not carry out my fierce anger, nor will I turn and devastate Ephraim. For I am the ONLY God, and not man--the Holy One among you. I will not come in wrath.
Acts 7:48 "However, the Most High does not live in houses made by men. As the prophet says:
Acts 17:24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands.

1 Corinthians 8:4 So then, about eating food sacrificed to idols: We know that an idol is nothing at all in the world and that there is no God but one.

Deuteronomy 4:35 You were shown these things so that you might know that the LORD is God; besides him there is no other.

Deuteronomy 4:39 Acknowledge and take to heart this day that the LORD is God in heaven above and on the earth below. There is no other.

Deuteronomy 5:6 "I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.

Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one

Galatians 3:20 A mediator, however, does not represent just one party; but God is one.
James 2:19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that--and shudder.

Malachi 2:10 Have we not all one Father? Did not one God create us? Why do we profane the covenant of our fathers by breaking faith with one another?
Mark 12:29 "The most important one Commandment," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one (This is four out of 10Commandments, no idol, no human, no trinity, when we say one, IT IS ABSOLUTELY ONE)

Nehemiah 9:6 You alone are the LORD. You made the heavens, even the highest heavens, and all their starry host, the earth and all that is on it, the seas and all that is in them. You give life to everything, and the multitudes of heaven worship you.

Romans 3:30 since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.

1 Samuel 15:29 He who is the Glory of Israel does not lie or change his mind; for he is not a man, that he should change his mind."
1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
Zechariah 14:9 The LORD will be king over the whole earth. On that day there will be one LORD, and his name the only name.

What JESUS SAID?
Matthew 4:10 Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.'
Luke 18:18-19 A certain ruler asked him: ‘Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?’
‘Why do you call me good?’ Jesus answered. ‘No one is good – except God alone.’”

Matthew 22:38 But do not think that this advice was given to Israel or to his own people only. Rather this is the basis of the teachings of all the Prophets. The same advice appears in the Gospel of Matthew, in similar wording, after which Jesus says: There is no God but ONE


Ephesians 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
Hosea 11 When Israel was a child, I loved him, and out of Egypt I called my son (Jacob)

Isaiah 64:8 Yet, O LORD, you are our Father. We are the clay, you are the potter; we are all the work of your hand.
Isaiah 63:16 But you are our Father, though Abraham does not know us or Israel acknowledge us; you, O LORD, are our Father, our Redeemer from of old is your name.
John 10:30 I and the Father are one."
Luke 3:38 Seth was the son of Adam. Adam was the son of God.

1 John 5:12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.

Matthew 11:25 At that time Jesus said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.
Humans, angels etc are referred to as sons/children of God elsewhere in the Bible {(Deut 14:1, Is 43:6, (Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7)


Exodus 20:23 Do not make any gods to be alongside Me; do not make for yourselves gods of silver or gods of gold.
Exodus 32:31 So Moses went back to the LORD and said, "Oh, what a greatest sin these people have committed! They have made themselves gods of gold.
Exodus 20:4 "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.

Exodus 34:17 "Do not make cast idols.

Leviticus 19:4 "'Do not turn to idols or make gods of cast metal for yourselves. I am the LORD your God.
Deuteronomy 27:15 "Cursed is the man who carves an image or casts an idol--a thing detestable to the LORD, the work of the craftsman's hands--and sets it up in secret." Then all the people shall say, "Amen!"

Deuteronomy 4:16 so that you do not become corrupt and make for yourselves an idol, an image of any shape, whether formed like a man or a woman,

Deuteronomy 4:23 Be careful not to forget the covenant of the LORD your God that he made with you; do not make for yourselves an idol in the form of anything the LORD your God has forbidden.

Isaiah 44:9 All who make idols are nothing, and the things they treasure are worthless. Those who would speak up for them are blind; they are ignorant, to their own shame.

Isaiah 44:19 No one stops to think, no one has the knowledge or understanding to say, "Half of it I used for fuel; I even baked bread over its coals, I roasted meat and I ate. Shall I make a detestable thing from what is left? Shall I bow down to a block of wood?"

Deuteronomy 29:17 You saw among them their detestable images and idols of wood and stone, of silver and gold.

Isaiah 45:20 "Gather together and come; assemble, you fugitives from the nations. Ignorant are those who carry about idols of wood, who pray to gods that cannot save.
Hosea 4:12 of my people. They consult a wooden idol and are answered by a stick of wood. A spirit of prostitution leads them astray; they are unfaithful to their God.

Isaiah 44:17-18 From the rest he makes a god, his idol; he bows down to it and worships. He prays to it and says, "Save me; you are my god." They know nothing, they understand nothing; their eyes are plastered over so they cannot see, and their minds closed so they cannot understand.

Hosea 13:2 Now they sin more and more; they make idols for themselves from their silver, cleverly fashioned images, all of them the work of craftsmen. It is said of these people, "They offer human sacrifice and kiss the calf-idols."

Isaiah 44:17 From the rest he makes a god, his idol; he bows down to it and worships. He prays to it and says, "Save me; you are my god."
1 Chronicles 17:13 I will be his Father, and he shall be my Son (Solomon); I will not take my steadfast love from him, as I took it from him who was before you,
Begotten Son
Psalms 2:7 I will tell of the decree: The LORD said to me, “You are my Son (David); today I have begotten you.
Mark 13:32
"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father”
 
Islam was also founded by a human. It does not matter if the word Christian or Muslim appear in a text, because of point number two.

You're mistaken, Islam was not founded by any human but was a revelation revealed to a human. There is a difference between the two and it is proven in many verses of the Qur'an. Muhammed (:saws1:) did not attribute the Qur'an as his own speech nor did he ask for wordly riches or gain for accepting Islam. He faced trials and tribulations like all other prophets to prove his genuineness; no human being would undergo what he went through except that he would lose patience and give up.

Anyone who has read the Qur'an knows that it is entirely focused on Allah and not Muhammed. Al in the word Allah in the Arabic language is the definite article for the in English, while lah is the one whorshipped: God. Thus when you say Allah it leaves no ambiguity as to whom we worship.

The Qur'an says: "O Messenger (Muhammad)! Proclaim (the Message) which has been sent down to you from your Lord. And if you do not, then you have not conveyed His Message. Allah will protect you from mankind. Verily, Allah guides not the people who disbelieve” [al-Maa’idah 5:67]

"Say (O Muhammad): 'I don’t tell you that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor (that) I know the unseen, nor do I tell you that I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me.’ Say: 'Are the blind and the one who sees equal? Will you not then take thought?'" [al-An’aam 6:50]



The Quran is not written by God either. Just like the bible it is a book written by a human hand. Both claim to be inspired or dictated by God. Both require faith to believe that. That one is a single book and one is a collection of books, assembled through the guidance of divine spirit a christian would claim, makes little difference

That's correct, the Qur'an was written down by the companions of the Messenger of God. But it is the literal spoken word of God that, after its revelation, was preserved in writing form for the latter generations to learn from. Verbally passing down the message could have been changed, altered or forgotten knowingly or unknowingly. The Qur'an was never "inspired by God", Muslims never claimed that and it is incorrect for you to attribute this to Islam or Muslim. We have always claimed this to be the literal word of God revealed to Muhammed (:saws1:).
 
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Also to Pygoscelis, you asked about the relevance of sexual relations in first post by Riana. The relevance that this has to with divine revelation is that God always calls for morality, ethics, principles and laws that govern and preserve the uprightness and integrity of individuals, families and society at large. The very make-up of a prosperous society lies in the adherence to these correct principles and laws that would unify it and direct it towards success and prosperity. So when the Bible mentions illicit sexual relations with people whom a lay man would reject, how much more revulsive and repugnant is it when the righteous are wrongly portrayed as such? What kind of society is this kind of message trying to create?

Thus, Riana's post about the mention of sexual relations occurring frequently has significant relevance.
 
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Salam Alaikkum
Many Christian parents had a wakeup call and even stopped their teenage to read the bible because of illicit sexual verses, they are just too much and seriously disturbing.

Istigfurallah, too far from words of Allah, these are just few


GENESIS

19:1-8 Rape virgins instead of male angels
19:30-38 Righteous man impregnates his 2 daughters while drunk
24:2-3, 9 Place your hand "under the thigh" (sexual organs) of someone swearing sacred oaths
25:1-6 Keeping mistresses is not adultery
32:25 God grabs Jacob's testicles
34:1-31 Brothers are riled when sister is defiled
35:2 Reuben sleeps with father's concubine
38:12-30 Tamar plays the harlot to seduce father-in-law
39:1-20 Women tries to rape man
47:29 Joseph ordered to place his hand under father's thigh
RUTH
3:6-9 To "hook" him as husband, Ruth sleeps with Boaz
4:9-10 Boaz buys Ruth
HOSEA
1:2-11 God tells Hosea to take ***** to wife
2:1-15 Complications ensue (lewdly described)
NAHUM
3:4-6 Lord: "I will discover thy skirts upon thy face"
MALACHI
2:1-4 An angry god will spread feces on your faces
REVELATION
17:1-6 A ***** is stripped, eaten and burned



Another important issue is the JIHAD, THEY said Jesus Preached PEACE but that's totally wrong
LUKE
12:51-2 "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three."
14:26 "If any man come unto me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple."
19:27 "But those mine enemies which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me."
MATTHEW
10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I come not to send peace, but a sword."
10:35-6 "For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."


 
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Son of God simply means Servant of God
"Simply?"

My experience is that in life most words and phrases have more than one meaning, and certianly more than one connotation to them. I find this true not just in daily life, but in the various scriptures of the world as well. If it were not so, there would be only one translation needed from any one language into another. But in truth there are many, and beyond that many interpretations whether one is speaking of the Bible or the Qur'an or the scriptures of other religions.

No doubt it works in many instances to understand "Son of God" as speaking of one who understands him/herself as simply a "servant" of God. But I do no find that it is not the one and only way the phrase is used.

(Though, I will grant you this Riana, if one is going to only have exactly one understanding of this particular phrase, I would much rather see people utilize the one you have suggested than get erroneously locked into thinking of "Son" in biological terms. So, I do appreciate what you have written on the subject.)

Peace.
 
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