How well do you know the Anbiyaa (alayhim assalaam)?

Khalid Saifullah said:
Our noble prophet muhammad dabiq
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Sallalahu alaihi wassallam.

Khalid Saifullah said:
was not made of physical light, he was a guiding light and an embodiment of guidance. some traditions state that this light of guidance and prophethood was first transferred in his ancestors on their foreheads, and was then transferred to the lower back of the rest of his lineage.
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Can you answer wher you got the reference for Jinn being on earth 600,000 years before humans? And where you got the reference for hinn and binn?

Scimi
 
Peace to you @ popsthebuilder. Iblees is his name. He is of the Jinns. They are a separate being altogether. Made out of smokeless fire. They have nafs (desire) as do humans. Angels on the other hand, are made of light, they have no desire. They merely serve.

Iblees, was at the highest station before man was created. He was never an angel.

:peace:
 
Mostly from history books by various authors - Muslim.

History is not like hadith, so the requirements of the sanad (verification) is a little lax. History is more for deriving lessons, not formulating legal laws.
 
Khalid Saifullah said:
Mostly from history books by various authors - Muslim.

History is not like hadith, so the requirements of the sanad (verification) is a little lax. History is more for deriving lessons, not formulating legal laws.
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This is not good enough for me - you HAVE to provide a reference. So we can check up on the information and decide for ourselves how "authentic" it really is.

History is a double edged sword. How do you study it?

I follow a method of comparatives, and deductive logic coupled with the the study of antrhopology, paleontology, word sciences such as etymology, morphology and philology, as well as others such as cartography, topography and other "ologies" which help us to better contextualise the study we are partaking in.

All I've seen you do here brother Khalid, is tell me that you read this somewhere once - that's really not good enough my brother. Sorry.

Scimi
 
greenhill said:
Peace to you @ popsthebuilder. Iblees is his name. He is of the Jinns. They are a separate being altogether. Made out of smokeless fire. They have nafs (desire) as do humans. Angels on the other hand, are made of light, they have no desire. They merely serve.

Iblees, was at the highest station before man was created. He was never an angel.

[emoji14]eace:
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Thanks. It still seems that the difference is the desire of the beings. The angels desire what God desires wholly under God's direction. The jinn seem to have gone against the direction of God. I understand the reason for the separation of the two. Just not sure that they came at different times or from different force. I was under the impression that all angels were of the fire of God which is somewhat synonymous with the light of God. One third of them strayed from God's path in pursuit of their own selfish desires. This clarification is very welcome. Again, please take no offence to my input. I am learning and comparing notes basically.
Thanks to all sincerely, and likewise; peace.
 
popsthebuilder said:
I agree totally. Perhaps you have separate words for angels and fallen angels(jinn?) The only sacrifice that is needed is That of sin, through repentance. We are on the same page here. We seem to have differing terms defining the same things is all. I appreciate your clarification and in no way mean any disrespect. Do you believe that Ibilis is the only jinn, or are there others? Forgiveness and mercy are huge and a reciprocal way of direction under God that we receive and are to give. However you cannot idoly ask forgiveness without repentance( turning from sin that you asked forgiveness for). God is a God of mercy. We are but men. This doesn't mean we can continually sin and simultaneously be forgiven for the same wrongs that have been brought to light personally under God.
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i downloaded the book of enoch a few months ago due to it's intriguing parables and encryptive eschatological nature but got put off by the amount of stark errors it contained, it is however true that the previous scripture often disguises prophecies through a blurring of specifics in regard to prophets angels jinn and people and maybe it is for the sake of encryption or for readers to take a lesson from - or both

the jinn are an entire species of creation with gifts of intellect similar to that bestowed upon humans, abilty to travel far and fast into certain limits of space, to spy undetected by humans, but have been put at a level beneath humans in terms of status (hence the foolish reason for rebellion of a portion due to a perceived racial supremacy syndrome from the fact that they were created from fire and see clay as more base), they also have to depend upon the revelations sent to the Prophets pbut who were human and many are true believers who submitted to Allah during the law revealed to Moses pbuh and later updated when they heard the revelation to Muhammad pbuh.
they were utilized in the time of solomon pbuh who ended up subjecting the satans among them to servitude whilst elevating the decent ones to the status of court advisers and speedy couriers, and it is recorded that the satans among them were utilised at the time of the final messenger pbuh and caused him much distress for a certain time, if you ever get hold of the "x-files" of the intelligence (spy) services in your country you'll most likely find that they are regularly utilized by those high in the levels of masonry and "the dark arts". (look out for the eye in the triangle, the square and compass, or checkered black and white surface).

we are seeing some elements of that type racism in certain strands of people such as those who were chosen above al-alamin of the descendants of jacob who were granted the gift of prophethood despite the bible and the Quran clearly demonstrating a tendency of foolishness amonst the masses. whereas God confirms that certain qualities were filtered through adam, noah, abraham and 'imran over mankind. i'm not a geneticist and my knowledge of the alpha beta and gamma streaks gifted to certain humans are limited.

and we see a similar type of racism amongst some whites who's ancestors are said to have migrated early and adapted to harsher environments and diversified their gene pool in their looking down at africans who are said to have stayed put and suffered from the effects of a smaller gene pool, however when one looks more closely one sees that although those who developed lighter skin developed more cunning and industrial prowess, the darker skinned races retained more simplicity and masculinity and protective qualities over their females - so each has their own pros and cons.
race is a controversial issue so i'll go no further at the moment despite knowing that certain traits filter through certain people.

check Quran 49:11 and Chapter Hud 31 for more details.
 
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Abz2000 said:
i downloaded the book of enoch a few months ago due to it's intriguing parables and encryptive eschatological nature but got put off by the amount of stark errors it contained, it is however true that the previous scripture often disguises prophecies through a blurring of specifics in regard to prophets angels jinn and people and maybe it is for the sake of encryption or for readers to take a lesson from - or both

the jinn are an entire species of creation with gifts of intellect similar to that bestowed upon humans, abilty to travel far and fast into certain limits of space, to spy undetected by humans, but have been put at a level beneath humans in terms of status (hence the foolish reason for rebellion of a portion due to a perceived racial supremacy syndrome from the fact that they were created from fire and see clay as more base), they also have to depend upon the revelations sent to the Prophets pbut who were human and many are true believers who submitted to Allah during the law revealed to Moses pbuh and later updated when they heard the revelation to Muhammad pbuh.

we are seeing some elements of that type racism in certain strands of people such as those who were chosen above al-alamin of the descendants of jacob who were granted the gift of prophethood despite the bible and the Quran clearly demonstrating a tendency of foolishness amonst the masses. whereas God confirms that certain qualities were filtered through adam, noah, abraham and 'imran over mankind. i'm not a geneticist and my knowledge of the alpha beta and gamma streaks gifted to certain humans are limited.

and we see a similar type of racism amongst some whites who's ancestors are said to have migrated early and adapted to harsher environments and diversified their gene pool in their looking down at africans who are said to have stayed put and suffered from the effects of a smaller gene pool, however when one looks more closely one sees that although those who developed lighter skin developed more cunning and industrial prowess, the darker skinned races retained more simplicity and masculinity and protective qualities over their females - so each has their own pros and cons.
race is a controversial issue so i'll go no further at the moment despite knowing that certain traits filter through certain people.

check Quran 49:11 and Chapter Hud 31 for more details.
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Nicely put Sir. Again, I agree.
Peace.
 
Not sure what's going on in this thread.

Well, the fact about history is, many of us believe "what we want to believe". So if there's some information that doesn't go down our throat, we say "it is wrong". That's mostly because we were brought up with one type of knowledge and we tend to follow only that, any new information that we didn't knew in the first place, makes us think it's wrong.

As far as the history of Prophets and Messengers is concerned, We only know about 25 of them as the Quran and Hadith mentions.

But our Prophet also said there were 120,000 Prophets and Messengers sent to the face of the Earth.
By name only 25 are mentioned.

So as for the rest, we can only know and learn, but surely not verify.

We as Muslims, whatever is available in the Quran and Hadith, everything in History that matches it, we agree that it's true. Anything that goes against it, we say it's wrong.
Now as far as stuff which isn't available in our texts, and neither agrees to, nor disagrees with the Quran, we say they are ambiguous. May be right, may be wrong. Because it doesn't go against the Quran, you cannot say it's wrong. And because Quran speaks nothing about it, you can't say it's 100% right.

Hence yah, to those of you who want to have certain PROOF, am sorry to say, this thread might disappoint you. Because a lot of the stories are taken from Bible too, the Old Testament and stuff, and it doesn't go against Quran, nor does it agree with, so it's ambiguous, may be right, may be wrong.
If you are the one who believes something about history with certain PROOF, then like I said, you may be disappointed with this thread.
However if you're someone who is okay with ambiguous stuff and can agree that these knowledges have no certain backed up PROOF, but may be right, may be wrong, it's something that we want to know more about, whether it is from History, from Bible, from Veda, whatever. As long as it doesn't contradict, it should be fine to many and I believe this thread is more for those type of people.

Am sorry if I have hurt anyone's feelings, but I was disappointed to see this thread turn in to a "give me proof" thread, that also of stuff which has no certain proof.

Either way, good day and I hope the OP continues his questions and gives his answers and opinions, referred from wherever he learnt them from. Whether you want to agree or not is your wish, but how about we continue this thread like usual? God bless.
 
RE: Book of Enoch (Idris AS)

The book of enoch is supposed to be an ancient religious work ascribed by tradition to Enoch, the great grandfather of Noah (Alaihis salaam).

The problem here is that the Jews were not even an idea let alone a race when Enoch lived.

And when Noah's ark settled the earth, there were no humans left except for Noah, his wife, his three sons and their wives... Where is the book of Noah? :D

How did a book of a pre-flood prophet survive and yet, Noah's own revelations not survive?

It wasn't until approx 2900 year later (according to biblical timelines) between Enoch and David (father of Jews) - and there was a world flood between then too.

Moses was before David - yet Moses never spoke of any book of Enoch.

the israelites at the time of their slavery in Egypt, had all but lost their religion, and had started to worship Egyptian deities.

SO I ask - what nonsense is this regarding the Book of Enoch? its a LIE.

Scimi
 
I don't believe that the flood covered the whole earth, it has covered only Arabia.
 
i'm not sure people were really into reading and writing that much before Ibrahim (pbuh) and Musa (pbuh), most people before that would have most likely left reading and writing to scribes just as they do with computer programmers today,
most traditions would most likely have been oral at the time hence grace of Allah in choosing and inspiring multitudes of Prophets pbut.

regarding what brother Shafat 10 said, we learn to have an inquisitive mind which doesn't normally reject a piece of information without a little checking partly from the mysterious way in which Allah sends us guidance and makes His presence known, to date He hasn't made an appearance to anyone on earth as far as i know, He normally just leaves hints and cues for people to look further into so it's definitely a way of creating minds which are less prone to dismissal.
 
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Sorry Ahmed, shoulda done your research bro.

Why Does Nearly Every Culture Have a Tradition of a Global Flood?

by John D. Morris, Ph.D.

Evidence for Creation › Evidence from Science › Evidence from the Earth Sciences › The Global Flood Is the Key to the Past › Geological Evidence Indicates Rapid Formation

"Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?" (I Corinthians 1:20)​
One of the strongest evidences for the global flood which annihilated all people on Earth except for Noah and his family, has been the ubiquitous presence of flood legends in the folklore of people groups from around the world. And the stories are all so similar. Local geography and cultural aspects may be present but they all seem to be telling the same story.
Over the years I have collected more than 200 of these stories, originally reported by various missionaries, anthropologists, and ethnologists.
While the differences are not always trivial, the common essence of the stories is instructive as compiled below:

  1. Is there a favored family? 88%
  2. Were they forewarned? 66%
  3. Is flood due to wickedness of man? 66%
  4. Is catastrophe only a flood? 95%
  5. Was flood global? 95%
  6. Is survival due to a boat? 70%
  7. Were animals also saved? 67%
  8. Did animals play any part? 73%
  9. Did survivors land on a mountain? 57%
  10. Was the geography local? 82%
  11. Were birds sent out? 35%
  12. Was the rainbow mentioned? 7%
  13. Did survivors offer a sacrifice? 13%
  14. Were specifically eight persons saved? 9%
Putting them all back together, the story would read something like this:
Once there was a worldwide flood, sent by God to judge the wickedness of man. But there was one righteous family which was forewarned of the coming flood. They built a boat on which they survived the flood along with the animals. As the flood ended, their boat landed on a high mountain from which they descended and repopulated the whole earth.
Of course the story sounds much like the Biblical story of the great flood of Noah's day. The most similar accounts are typically from middle eastern cultures, but surprisingly similar legends are found in South America and the Pacific Islands and elsewhere. None of these stories contains the beauty, clarity, and believable detail given in the Bible, but each is meaningful to their own culture.
Anthropologists will tell you that a myth is often the faded memory of a real event. Details may have been added, lost, or obscured in the telling and retelling, but the kernel of truth remains. When two separate cultures have the same "myth" in their body of folklore, their ancestors must have either experienced the same event, or they both descended from a common ancestral source which itself experienced the event.
The only credible way to understand the widespread, similar flood legends is to recognize that all people living today, even though separated geographically, linguistically, and culturally, have descended from the few real people who survived a real global flood, on a real boat which eventually landed on a real mountain. Their descendants now fill the globe, never to forget the real event.
But, of course, this is not the view of most modern scholars. They prefer to believe that something in our commonly evolved psyche forces each culture to invent the same imaginary flood legend with no basis in real history. Instead of scholarship, this is "willful ignorance" of the fact that "the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished" (II Peter 3:5,6).
Cite this article: John D. Morris, Ph.D. 2001. Why Does Nearly Every Culture Have a Tradition of a Global Flood?. Acts & Facts. 30 (9).

http://www.icr.org/article/570/270/


Twentieth-century geologists taught the familiar maxim: "The present is the key to the past."
But now that catastrophic processes are widely employed to describe the strata record, twenty-first century geologists are wondering whether "marine flood sedimentation is the key to the past."
Geological strata and their contained marine fossils provide critical evidence that the ocean once covered the continents, even the highest continental areas. Extremely widespread strata blankets argue for an intercontinental or global flood.
The Sauk Sequence extends throughout North America and appears to extend into Europe. The Tippecanoe Sequence also covers much of North America and may well extend into Europe and Africa. There are also intercontinental redbed sequences, intercontinental tuff beds, and coal-bearing strata cycles.
Granular, water-charged sediment flows result in very rapid stratification. Dilute flows produce thick sequences of plane beds, graded beds, and crossbeds by sustained unidirectional flow. Such flows also produce thick sequences of hummocky beds by sustained bidirectional flow.
Concentrated sediment flows produce thick strata sequences by abrupt deposition from liquefied suspension or evenly bedded strata by flow transformation to a tractive current.
These and many other obvious processes are leading many geologists to construct a global flood model for earth history.
http://www.icr.org/geological-strata

Now watch this:

* Hydroplate Theory Video


Dr Walter Brown hypothesised that the flood waters gushed forth from the earth as the hydroplates shifted and the waters from the deep swelled up to the surface of the earth.


In the Qur'an:


We revealed to him: "Build the Ship under Our supervision and as We reveal. When Our command comes and water bubbles up from the earth*, load into it a pair of every species, and your family-except for those among them against whom the word has already gone ahead. And do not address Me concerning those who do wrong. They shall be drowned." (Qur'an, 23:27)


Scimi
 
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Khalid Saifullah said:
Day Three: Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎):

3. Why did Allah create the Jinn?
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Allah created the Jinn to take over the duty of worshiping Allah and to be His vicegerent on earth. In order to achieve this, He sent an army of Jinn to subdue these other beings, which they successfully did. They were then assigned to dwell on earth and to worship Allah. For their guidance, 800 prophets were sent, but they slew them all and caused much corruption on earth. In order to restore order, Allah sent an army of angels, led by Azazil, the Jinn, to subdue them and confine them to remote islands and high mountains. Only the pious jinn were left alone. This brought an end to the rule of the Jinn on earth, but there was one pious Jinn named Azazil, who was but a child at that stage, who was uplifted to the skies. (Hidayat ke Chiragh of Maulana M. Abdur Rahman Mazhari, vol. 1, page 57)
 
Day Four: Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎):

4. Provide a little more information on the origin of the Jinn?
 
They were created from a smokeless fire.

What do you want to know?

They were given nafs as a gift, but no imaan.

Angels were given Imaan but not nafs.

Humans were given both - the great contadiction exists within us.

Scimi
 
Okay, but i didn't get why God can destroy the other nations in the world just because of the sins of the tribe of Nuh (as)
 
The tribe of Nuh? which tribe?

How many tribes were there? do you know? do you need to know?

All you need to know is that the whole worlds inhabitants, except the family of Nuh AS were unbelievers, and no good was coming from them.

Thus, the world was destroyed by the flood.

it amazes me how Arabs always go on about tribal affiliation as if that were a get out of jail free card :D

Scimi
 

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