Question for Muslims

[MTAFFI]

You accept Jesus by accepting Allaah, and please don't be confused with the name Allaah because even christian arabs call God - Allaah. So to actually accept Jesus is to accept his message of calling to the worship of our own Creator without associating partners with Him.

I agree, I dont usually get confused with the names, what I actually meant to type in up there was Muhammad and not Allah. If you read the above post i think you will see what I mean. My thing is I accept Jesus was a prophet and came here to spread the word of God and die for our sins, however I have never learned much about Muhammad, and my religion or any other religions that I have dug into didnt mention him either. Therefore I have limited knowledge about him.(which i why i intend to read the Quran)

I meant is there any evidence from your scripture that the followers of Jesus called themselves christians? Because theres proof in our scripture that Jesus son of Mary's disciples called themselves muslims as they submitted themselves by obeying the Messenger Jesus son of Mary, hence they were obedient to God.

This is the best proof I can find

Acts 11:26 "And when he (Barnabas) had found him (the Apostle Paul), he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."

I think i understand what you mean, but in islaam - we pray to God Alone and thank Him for everything He has given us. Those who did good in this world would do the same, like Mary, like Jesus, and all the prophets and righteous before and after them. They never prayed to others besides God because prayer is a form of worship, and to pray to others is a way of worshipping others besides, or along with God.

I think that is one really good thing about Islam, that you pray only to God, as I said before, that is also how I pray

If you read it with an open heart and with sincerety, God will guide you. Anyone who is sincere will guide that person because according to a prophetic saying, if one takes a step towards God - God will go to them at speed.

I suppose only time will tell, as I said I will read it with an open mind

Try reading the bible, and you'll see that if you are sincere - that will actually compliment the Qur'an. Nowhere in the bible does Jesus say worship me, but he does say that no-one can come to God except through me, and we believe that - nobody can completely reach God except through a messenger. Because the messengers are the link between us and God.

I have read the bible and I have noticed that it does not say to worship Jesus or call him God. This is why I get into agruments with others on Christianity, because Catholics worship Jesus and God, and to me it does not make any sense.

 

[- Qatada -]

Sorry about talking too much, but i had this in another post previously which may clarify some things for you God willing:



Allaah Almighty says in the Qur'an:

And verily, We have sent among every Ummah (community, nation) a Messenger (proclaiming): "Worship Allah (Alone), and avoid (or keep away from) Taghut (all false deities, etc. i.e. do not worship Taghut besides Allah)." Then of them were some whom Allah guided and of them were some upon whom the straying was justified. So travel through the land and see what was the end of those who denied (the truth). [Qur'an 16:36]


We sent not a messenger except (to teach) in the language of his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now Allah leaves straying those whom He pleases and guides whom He pleases: and He is Exalted in power, full of Wisdom. [14:4]


You'll see that those who were misguided was because they never wanted to come towards God, so their own sins and stubborness increased them in their misguidance. Anyone who turns away from God has chosen the path towards the darkness and away from God, whereas those who turn to God, if they are sincere - God will bring them closer towards Him, the Most Merciful. And the final destination is either paradise or hellfire.
​

Now these Prophets who went to other nations were ordered to convey the message to their people. So Noah came to his people, Moses came to his people, Jesus came to his people, all the prophets of the past came to their own people to call to the worship of Allaah alone, and not to associate partners with Him.

Islaam means submission, and all the true prophets of Allaah called their people to Islaam, submission to Allaah Almighty. Some people obeyed the messenger while others rejected the messenger. Those who rejected the messengers were destroyed by Allaah because they turned away from Allaah arrogantly when the clear signs had come to them. Even though these prophets were calling to the obedience of Allaah and His reward of paradise.


Now because these prophets had come to their people, Allaah gave some of the messenger's books or laws. So Moses was given the Torah, Jesus the Gospel (Injeel) etc. But what did these books call to? They called to the worship of Allaah, and His law.


This was on another thread:

First of all, we accept the previous scriptures [the Old Testament, the Gospel etc.] When these were sent down to the prophets, it was upto the nation to preserve it.

We know that from among them, there were some people who distorted them. Why was this? Because they wanted to follow their own whims and desires. For instance we know that there are so much copies of the Bible today, each with its own different interpretation. None of these are in the original language, and we know that if a scriptures not in its original language - then it's just a translation, its not the actual scripture. [Look at the bible, and ask yourself why you're using that specific version, why can't it just be that you get the original one? The reason for this is because the original doesn't remain. What does this mean? It mean's that you can't compare any of these versions to see what the original message sent down to Jesus was.]


Therefore, we as muslims do believe that the previous scriptures were revealed to the prophets of the earlier nations, however - these got distorted, even though it was upto these people to preserve the message which was sent to their prophet. And we can rightly say that it doesn't exist no more.



Due to the fact that these scriptures were distorted, and the people started worshipping others besides Allaah, and said things about Him which they shouldn't have said (i.e. we're God's children etc.) Allaah sent the message to the final prophet - Muhammad (peace be upon him.) Muhammad (peace be upon him) would come to confirm what was in the previous scriptures [calling to the worship of Allaah/God Alone without any associates] and this message would be for all of mankind (instead of just for the children of Isra'eel.) This message will be preserved by Allaah, and no-one is able to alter it by Allaah's Mercy. We know that till this day [since over 1400yrs ago] the Qur'an is still in arabic and is still preserved the same way it was over 1400yrs ago.

Why you may ask? Why did Allaah not preserve the message of the previous prophets, yet He preserves the message of Muhammad (peace be upon him)? The answer to this is simple. When Allaah sent a messenger to his people, it was upto the people to preserve the message, but they never had to spread it to different parts of the world. However, the message given to Muhammad (peace be upon him) was for the whole world, so Allaah has preserved it, but it is our duty to spread it to mankind. [If you feel this is wrong, you will find verses from the bible which claim Jesus (peace be upon him) being commanded to “Go to the lost sheep of the House of Israel!” Matthew 10:6]

Whereas Muhammad (peace be upon him) is being told:

"Say: 'O mankind! I am sent unto you all, as the Messenger of Allah, to Whom belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth." (Qur'an 7:158)



If you use try reading the Qur'an, you may find things which you find confusing, or verses which you don't understand. You may even accidentally take the verses out of context, so i'd just like to point out that the Qur'an can't be interpreted to our own understanding, rather - it should be understood according to how the Messenger of Allaah, and his companions understood it, due to the fact that they lived it throughout their life.


Therefore you'll have to look at the sciences of tafseer to get a true understanding of the interpretation of the Qur'an. You can do that by visiting these sites insha'Allaah (God willing: )


http://www.tafsir.com/

http://www.theholybook.org/




We don't totally reject the previous scriptures, we believe that they were original once upon a time. Think of it this way, the Old Testament, the New Testament, and the Final Testament (the Qur'an.) The Final Testament confirms what was in the previous scriptures, yet whatever was fabricated/distorted in the previous scriptures has been refuted in the Qur'an/Final Testament, and the Authentic Sunnah [prophetic way/sayings etc.]



​

If you have any questions, please don't be afraid to ask. And Allaah Almighty knows best.


PS: Now that i've seen your post above, if you try reading in the Qur'an - you won't find much direct information on Muhammad (peace be upon him.) Infact if you look in the Qur'an, Jesus son of Mary (peace be upon them) is mentioned more times than Muhammad (peace be upon him) is mentioned. The word Muhammad is only mentioned 4 times, whereas the name of Jesus is mentioned much, much more than that.

The best way to study the life of Muhammad (peace be upon him) is through looking at his biography, which is recorded through the sciences of hadith, so it really happened. We believe in it due to solid facts, and also faith. One doesn't lack the other, rather they both are hand in hand - faith and real life.

 

[MTAFFI]

but the thing is that Jesus and Muhammed (peace be upon them) taught the same message, but even if you reject Muhammed a.s , at the same time you still fail in submitting to GOd, bc God said "Muhammed is the final prophet". so do you get what I am sayin. Whatever you reject what God says, basiclly you failed to submit to him, bc you're leaving something and accepting something .
Submitting to God, and rejecting his prophet is a contradiction.

But if you believe Jesus was the final prophet and everything you have learned tells you Jesus was the final prophet then why would you believe that Muhammad was? If you do not know that Muhammad was the final prophet then how do you know the Quran is the "true word of God"? This is the problem I am running into, I still give myself to God, it is just hard for me to determine what is right and wrong between religions

but you call Jesus lord, and you pray to him. i'm talking in general for christians, bc i dont know if you have specific christian beliefs.

cheers.

I dont, most Christians do though.... I guess I am some sort of religious mutant

 

[vpb]

Fi_Sabilillah, very good post . MashaAllah.

jazakallah bro.

 

[vpb]

But if you believe Jesus was the final prophet and everything you have learned tells you Jesus was the final prophet then why would you believe that Muhammad was? If you do not know that Muhammad was the final prophet then how do you know the Quran is the "true word of God"?

by your religious point of view, christianity says that Jesus is son of God, or God at the same time, does it say anywehre that he was the last prophet sent to all humanity ? i hope i understood right what you said.

 

[MTAFFI]

by your religious point of view, christianity says that Jesus is son of God, or God at the same time, does it say anywehre that he was the last prophet sent to all humanity ? i hope i understood right what you said.

by my religious point of view Jesus was the son of God, or an extension of God, but not God himself. It does not say that he is the last prophet, however he said to live by his word, and since he is the son of God this is what I choose to do. This is where I ask, how am I supposed to know Muhammad was a true prophet or truly spread the word of God? I believe Jesus's words were the true word of God so by that I cannot believe that Muhammads words were unless they were the exact same

 

[Umar001]

I think the significant point is submission.

It is clear, if one submits to Islam then one must accept Islam in it's totality. Thus as a Muslim, when a person says 'I submit to God' the Muslim will say, well God's message to us is Islam so submit to it. But in reality the person might be submitting to their understanding of God. Just as a Muslim's understanding is that God revealed His message to Muhammad peace be upon him, the Christian understanding is different, thus submission can be relative to the individual's understanding.

To move on, is it acceptable for a person to submit to God from an Islamic view point but follow what he believes to be the words of Jesus only? The answer is No.

There are two paths for this answer,

1.
It has been narrated by Abu Hurayra that Allah's Messenger, peace and blessings be upon him, said: "By Him in Whose Hand Muhammad's soul is, there is none from amongst the Jews and Christians (of these present nations) who hears about me and then dies without believing in the MEssage with which I have been sent but he will be from the dwellers of the Fire"

Muslim Book of Faith V1 Chapter 240

Alongside this there are also verse which make it clear that a person cant reject one prophet and accept another and that no other religion except Islam will now be accepted.

2. From a technical point of view claiming to only want to follow Jesus' words, whilst believing in the Qu'ran would contradict it since the Qu'ran says that the Scripture has been changed by people.
Also on the same note the authenticity of the Bible is something debetable.​

But even to break it down further, we should realise not all knowledge is obligatory upon someone. Meaning there are some things which a person can be escused of because he did not have the knowledge.


With regards to those who could not follow Islam before Muhammad, well again if we understand Islam then we see that it is possible to be a Muslim before Muhammad. If we look at the above hadith, we are told 'who hears about me' this is a condition, if a person does not know Muhammad how can he say I believe in Muhammad?

So this is where the rule comes in that in general Jews and Christians are disbelievers, but, it depends on individual cases also, and this is where Allah's knowledge comes in which we do not have. There were many Christians, I being one of them, who did not know bout Islam, but then when we were told we followed it.

 

[vpb]

by my religious point of view Jesus was the son of God, or an extension of God, but not God himself. It does not say that he is the last prophet, however he said to live by his word, and since he is the son of God this is what I choose to do. This is where I ask, how am I supposed to know Muhammad was a true prophet or truly spread the word of God? I believe Jesus's words were the true word of God so by that I cannot believe that Muhammads words were unless they were the exact same

lol, because Muhammed saws told what went wrong with previous scriptures, as brother "fisebili.." wrote on the above post. He didnt say that Jesus a.s taught the wrong message , but he warned us that the message he taught has been altered by people, to meet their own desires, and Muhammed saws didn't ask people for any wealth or anything else, he was sent just to warn people.
It is true that if you look from the christian prespective than he is not a true Prophet, but Qur'an is telling you who Jesus (pbuh) is, what he taught and that what people claim that he taught this and this or he was Son of God is wrong, and how it is wrong , everything, because Allah swt is self-sufficient, he is not in need of anything. Praise be to him. Everythin that exists in heavens and earth and between them belongs to him.
I hope i answered your question. if not tell me i'll try to answer it better

 

[- Qatada -]

MTAFFI, do you believe in One God, our Creator? If so, how can someone really be a child of someone else? It's through having a spouse right? Then they have children and have a family.


Now ask yourself, i don't even like saying this - but does God have a mother? Or uncle? If not - why not? If someone claims that God has children, then they believe that He has to have an equal so they can have that child? Which mean's there's two God's and a junior? Now if you say that God only has a child but no 'spouse' - then that can't really be a child can it?



This leads to the arguments of the philosophers that can God pick up a rock so heavy that no-one can pick it up? Or can God create another God like Himself?

You see that these arguments can't be argued against, however in islaam they can. It's only one statement - God only does what befits His Majesty.



So God doesn't need children, He doesn't need an associate. He doesn't need to create a rock so heavy that no-one picks up. God doesn't make our beliefs so hard for us. Our God is One God, the One who gave us life, and the One who will cause us to die. Then we'll be raised back again and be judged on all that we did by Him.


Do you understand? Jesus son of Mary (peace be upon them) is an honorable messenger in the sight of God, but he is created by God, the same way God created Adam without a father and mother - God can easily create Jesus without a father.



Try looking in your scripture, and try looking in the previous scriptures. All of the true scriptures call to the worship of God Alone, this is the same message revealed to Muhammad (peace be upon him.) Maybe you could read the small biography from this site:

http://www.islamicboard.com/prophet-muhammad-p/1715-biography-prophet-muhammad-saws.html


Hope you benefit from it, and thanks for hearing me out.



Peace.

 

[MTAFFI]

Hope you benefit from it, and thanks for hearing me out.



Peace.

no problem so far the knowledge you have offered has been very beneficial and helpful to me, in fact everyone ones input has been very helpful and thought provoking. I am going to do some research and see if I can find some more questions.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

^^Good for u Always seek knowledge. Ask whatever you can and we'll try our best to answer.

 

[vpb]

MTAFFI,

it's a good website for the Qur'an translation.
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/

 

[- Qatada -]

no problem so far the knowledge you have offered has been very beneficial and helpful to me, in fact everyone ones input has been very helpful and thought provoking. I am going to do some research and see if I can find some more questions.

Thanks for the input. I know we all throwing loads of links infront of you, but i think that we need to discuss a topic which might make the understanding easier, this site will help you understand alot of similarities between christianity and islaam insha'Allaah [God willing.]

http://beconvinced.com/


Maybe by seeing the similarities, we'll understand that they are all revelation sent by the same God to His Messengers (peace be upon them all.)



Peace.

 

[MTAFFI]

thank you all for your links, there is a lot of information to go through so forgive me if I dont respond immediately. From what I see so far this stuff is very interesting, I am comparing it with some sites that are a little more pro christian as most of these seem to be geared straight into the Muslim faith (which isnt a bad thing, I just like to look at things from all angles)

 

[- Qatada -]

Yeah thats ok, trust me i questioned my own faith before taking them steps forward. I was born in a muslim family, but I think that God only guided me because i was sincere in wanting to understand.

The problem usually lies when people don't understand the fundamental beliefs and fall into the error of the propaganda, which makes them turn away.. so yeah, reasoning is good.



Regards.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

^^Same here. Me questioning is what got me interested in Islam more, Alhumdulillah. I didnt know enough even to answer people up until 9 grade. After i realized i didnt know anything, i started researching, Alhumdulillah.

 

[vpb]

Alhumdulillah. I didnt know enough even to answer people up until 9 grade.

so you are in 10th grade now ? lol, just kidding

 

[- Qatada -]

Here's a site which has some good info on how Jesus (peace be upon him) gave glad tidings on the final Messenger, Muhammad (peace be upon him):

http://prophetofislam.com/index.php


Just found it today, praise be to Allaah.



Regards.

 

[Muslim Woman]

I seek refuge in Allah (The One God) from the Satan (devil) the cursed, the rejected

With the name of ALLAH (swt) -The Bestower Of Unlimited Mercy, The Continously Merciful


Assalamu Alaikum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuh (May the peace, mercy and blessings of Allah be upon you)

&&

Here's a site which has some good info on how Jesus (peace be upon him) gave glad tidings on the final Messenger, Muhammad (peace be upon him):

http://prophetofislam.com/index.php

----this site is created by our revert bro ( ex -Christian missinary )

http://www.islamtomorrow.com/default.asp