If there are loads of different Bibles with different context so please tell me why all christians agree with all those fundamental truths and facts for christians like- crucifixion and ressurection of Jesus Christ, that He was a Son of God, that He died for our sins,that He was born from virgin Mary etc etc??
Are Muslims obligated to read the Bible?
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If there are loads of different Bibles with different context so please tell me why all christians agree with all those fundamental truths and facts for christians like- crucifixion and ressurection of Jesus Christ, that He was a Son of God, that He died for our sins,that He was born from virgin Mary etc etc??
Even, even if I agree that the two statements are accurate and reliable, they constitute to nothing that is outside the norm, these people are discribing the view of some Christians and what happend to Jesus, which does not mean that this was the only view. What is obvious is that it became the main view and thus it would naturally most likely cause attention.
Again this poses a similar stance to the above, but where is the quotation? And where are all the sources for these?
What is the context? though I think you have made a mistake, the verse you ment was 10:65 not 10:34 :statisfie
Whilst I leave you to ponder over the context, I will provide an instance which someone who does not want to read the context and has pre concieved ideas can use:
11Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word,
"Oh this means the message of Jesus the Gospel, see not everyone can accept it!"
But if one reads the context 'tis word' is speakin about something here in particular.
8Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. 9I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."
10The disciples said to him, "If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry."
11Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. 12For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage[c]because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it."
10The disciples said to him, "If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry."
11Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. 12For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage[c]because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it."
We had a similar accusation, but where is you proof, what makes you seem like you are either misinformed or lying, and I choose to think the former, is that you claim Ibn Abbas, may Allah be pleased with him, said what he said, but if you read carefully, Ibn Abbas is reported to have said the total opposite of it! And that is recorded in Al Bukhari (which you put on the list even though he collected the narration of Ibn Abbas sayin the scripture is changed) Al Bukhari's book being the most reliable, and you do not even give any quotation/sources.
I leave you with Ibn Abbas' words:
Ibn Abbas said, "O Muslims? How do you ask the people of the Scriptures, though your Book (i.e. the Quran) which was revealed to His Prophet is the most recent information from Allah and you recite it, the Book that has not been distorted? Allah has revealed to you that the people of the scriptures have changed with their own hands what was revealed to them and they have said (as regards their changed Scriptures): This is from Allah, in order to get some worldly benefit thereby." Ibn Abbas added: "Isn't the knowledge revealed to you sufficient to prevent you from asking them? By Allah I have never seen any one of them asking (Muslims) about what has been revealed to you."
Sahih Bukhari, Book 48, Number 850
Regards
Heya
wow fundamental truth,i wonder why then should the church break up into so many denomination if the "differences are so slight"
Also do search google for UNITARIANS,,,they believe that god is ONE,not a trinity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism
wish some one would post the thread again.It showed the entire list of different bibles in the world...
Salaam,
In Islam what ever goes against the Quran and Sunnah,no matter how slight is UNACCEPTABLE.
But for Christian,as long as the fundamentals are the same.
I guess that is why for them they accept the abomination of gay and lesbian
Eat pork and liquour and so on..
All slight differences...LOL..joke..
In Islam what ever goes against the Quran and Sunnah,no matter how slight is UNACCEPTABLE.
But for Christian,as long as the fundamentals are the same.
I guess that is why for them they accept the abomination of gay and lesbian
Eat pork and liquour and so on..
All slight differences...LOL..joke..
If unitarians don't accept Jesus Christ as the Son of God and the only saviour , they are not christians.
Yes the christian Church split into many denominations, but still all christians, catholics, orthodox, protestants agree that Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation, that He died on a cross for our sins and ressurected, and that God is triunity-God The Father, God The Son and Holy Spirit.
And dont tell me about jehova witnesses or unitarians because they are simply not christians, just like baha'i, druzes or sikhs are not muslims.
Only very very few christian churches agree with gay and lesbian abomination, they are minority among minority.And those churches who agree with homosexual marriages loose believers fast, just look what hapenned with Episcopal Church in USA, which lost many believers because they went to conservative denominations.
But still no one explained me, how is it possible, if there are so many Bible versions why all christians- catholics, orthodox and protestans agree that Jesus Christ was Son of God who came to earth in human flesh, died on a cross for our sins and ressurected and that God is triunity- God The Father, God The Son,Holy Spirit.
ScoobyGurl
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I have read the Bible but always in an academic context (Religious Studies major). I still have my Oxford Study Bible. I do look at it once in a while but it's always for comparative reasons. I think there are some wise quotes in the Bible but it doesn't guide my life. The Qur'an does that.
That list only showed many translations of the Holy Bible, not versions.
I am sure that in every "version" of the Bible from that list is written that- Jesus Christ, the Son of God, came to earth in human flesh, died on a cross for our sins and ressurected.
You know lately i read that some muslim woman in USA made new translation of Quaran, where she removed and change all the verses that permitted wife beating, death penalty for apostasy, uneaquality between men and women.
And what, would you say now that there are two Quarans now? or two translations of Quaran?
The same thing is with all this list of so many Bible "versions"
Ok ok and i know many muslim organizations (Muslim Brotherhood,Jamaat Islamiya,Hesbullah,Islamic Jihad from Palestine) which agree that violence and suicide bombings can be used to fight with the unbelievers.
ScoobyGurl
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It's not the same. There are different translations of the Qur'an but there is only one Arabic version that was revealed to the Prophet (saws) and that is the source of various translations.
However, there are different versions of the Bible because different denominations accept different books of the Bible. A King James Bible does not have the same books as a Catholic Bible. Every Qur'an has the same number of chapters and verses.
Also, the books that accepted as canon have changed over the centuries. This is fact. Any Biblical scholar will tell you that the books that are in the Bible today do no encompass all the various scriptures that existed during early Christian history.
So I don't think there is really a comparison. Not trying to be argumentative. Just putting in my two cents.
Well first you put for the condition, i.e. acceptance of Jesus as saviour and Son of God, then you said J.W. and Unitarians are not Christians, thus I assume you mean that they do not pass the condition, whilst in reality they claim they do.
Two things, 1. All christians believing in the same foundationals, what you are doing is taking a belief nd then saying anyone who does not believe it is not Christian, and then saying 'Look all christians believe these things' of course by your definition all christians do, because anyone who does not you claim is not Christian. But in reality, not all Christians believe Jesus is God, and you have no statement in the Bible that either clearly states he is, or that states that a person who does not believe in the Trinity is not Christian.
2. This faith, i.e. the common foundations shared by the majority of Christians maybe dominant now, but in the early days it may not have, in the early days there were different 'gospels' preached, just because they have dissapeared does not make them not true.
Another point, you stated And dont tell me about jehova witnesses or unitarians because they are simply not christians, just like baha'i, druzes or sikhs are not muslims.
That statement is false, you are claiming that the just like the Muslims claim Baha'i or others are not Muslims Christians claim that about J.Ws
Whilst in reality the Muslim can only claim someone is not Muslim with evidences from the scripture, so for example, if someone believes another messenger or prophet will come then this goes against the teachings of Islam so the person is not Muslim, it is clear cut. But what you as a Christian do is not this, you do not derive who is or who isnt from scripture, nowhere does it say 'If you do not belieeve in Jesus as God you are not Christian' nor is there a statement which produces the kind of evidence used by muslims to say Baha'is are non Muslim.
So please, do not liking things whilst in reality they are very different.
Not all Christians agree to that, and you saying they are not Christian does not help unless you prove they are not from scripture. Furthermore, as I said before, the dominant faith now is all derived from a common foundation, i.e. the gospel Paul preached, but there were other 'gospels' just because they did not turn out dominant does not mean they are false.
Well the Qu'ran is well know, and it has reached a stage now where it can never be logically falsified, and even before the situation around it made this impossible, so any attempt to bring a 'new' version of the Qu'ran would be impossible.
But with the Bible, this is different since from the start things were not so clear, what has happend now, is that there is restriction of the different version able to be made, due to the fact that the sources are known, i.e. the Manuscritps, but even the Manuscripts differ, and as seen before, with new found manuscripts the bible is revisioned.
Your attempt to mean translations by version is not right, since translations are basically substituing words, neither adding a word nor taking away rather keepin the word in meaning and expression, whereas versions are the adding or taking of verses and this is what the Bible has undergone, let me give you 1 example, you read the NIV? Turn to 1 John 5:6-8 it gives you a footnote, stating a different reading and then stating that this reading is not found in any manuscripts before 16th, then go to a KJV and you will find the reading in the footnote which has been taken out by the Scholars of the NIV due to reasons just given above, you will find the verse there in the KJV.
That is not translation, but rather version.
I have yet to recieved any sort of reply so I am not sure if you have read my replies but I hope you have.
Regards,
Eesa.
Salaam,,
Hmm funny isn't it.
You say the other ar not chrisitans,,,what if they say the smae abot you?
Would you accept it?
And bahai, sikh are not muslims,,,they worship other than Allah.
So it is not the same,they have their own book..
Also i thought druze is a race not religion.
Heya
Well i cna you fully that gay and lesban action are an abomintaion.
anyone who think otherwise but claim to be a muslim is blashemer.
You have chruches in the san francisco and even the catholic church safe guarding men who raps chidren.
they should be stoned to death..
It is not up to us to tell you why so many dnomination follow a set a rules.
But you also cannot tell us why so many denomination exist in christianity.
Is it a choose what you wish to follow religion?
Just like you are choosing your faith by the rules hat you like,and ignore those you dislike?
Malaikah
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I don't know if anyone has mentioned this yet, but can I please point out that the New Testament is NOT the book being referred to in the Quran that was given to Jesus (the injeel).
The injeel is the direct word of God.
The New Testament is a historical record written by men. Christians themselves recognise this.
The NT is not just some tampered with version of the injeel. The NT is just a book that has no authority by Islamic standards in the first place.
It is possible parts of the injeel might have been quoted in the NT, but their is no reference to this as far as we know.
The main point to take home: They are two totally different books!
Therefore trying to prove that the Quran is wrong by showing that the NT was never changed is baseless because the Quran is not talking about the NT in the first place.
Please see this link for more information:
http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=47516&ln=eng
Beliving something was sent from God does not mean believing that it was sent to you. You mix those two things up, you start with the presumption that it is true and then you bring any verse to back it up.
The verses you quoted only indicate that Muslims believe in what was sent before Muhammad, peace be upon him, meaning we believe that God did sent the Torah and Injeel, but this is not the same as saying we believe we have to read them and that they apply to us, no, the second part is a subdivision, i.e. what does the belief in them entail.
Slm,
I'm an english teacher but because our religion teacher went to another city I have given religion lesson to 6th grade students.
I want to tell about an anecdote. Our subjects was holly books. and told students that we should be respectfull to all 4 books, because we believe in 4 of them but we don't read bible because we believe that it has been changed, but there may a word that hasn't been changed. So that word is God's word. And I also brought bible to class and we examine it together. We read a part about Christ (AS) curing a captian's servent. both in matta and Luka. and we saw that same event was told differently and that is enough for us to believe that it is not original. because a prophet will never say "I cured" as it is said in matta but he will say "he has been cured" as it is said in Luka but we are not sure which words in it are corect.
And one of my sts asked ma'm 'is it sin if we tear and jump on a bible'
and I asked ' would you like to see anyone tear and jump on Qur'an?' ' you don't have to believe in other people's holy things but you have to respect them if you want them to respect your holly things.'
he blushed and said he'll never do a such an action again.
regards
I'm an english teacher but because our religion teacher went to another city I have given religion lesson to 6th grade students.
I want to tell about an anecdote. Our subjects was holly books. and told students that we should be respectfull to all 4 books, because we believe in 4 of them but we don't read bible because we believe that it has been changed, but there may a word that hasn't been changed. So that word is God's word. And I also brought bible to class and we examine it together. We read a part about Christ (AS) curing a captian's servent. both in matta and Luka. and we saw that same event was told differently and that is enough for us to believe that it is not original. because a prophet will never say "I cured" as it is said in matta but he will say "he has been cured" as it is said in Luka but we are not sure which words in it are corect.
And one of my sts asked ma'm 'is it sin if we tear and jump on a bible'
and I asked ' would you like to see anyone tear and jump on Qur'an?' ' you don't have to believe in other people's holy things but you have to respect them if you want them to respect your holly things.'
he blushed and said he'll never do a such an action again.
regards
AvarAllahNoor
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I don't see why people can't read books of other faiths. it will only enhance their knowlege in that religion.
AvarAllahNoor
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Incorrect. We do worship Allah, Ram, Jehovah, God, as all names are used to reffer to the the one and same. Only lack of knowledge stands as a barrier between those that claim that God is not one. (And use names to separate)
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^^Islam doesnt prohibit it I think. The difference is that reading the Qur'an holds more importance to us as Muslims because we are here striving to be the best Muslims and do our best to worship Allah Subhana wa ta'ala. So reading the Quran should come first before any other scripture.
No, it is not funny at all. Jesus Christ, God in human flesh came to earth 2 000 years ago. He was crucified to pay for our sins , so that those who believe in Him could be saved and go to paradise. He was killed and after ressurected. Those who believe in Him and His message are christians. Those who reject His divinity, like jeahova witnesses, are simply not christians. And do you know what mormons believe? Their theology is very different from catholic, orthodox and protestant belief. Mormons believe in material God, who had beggining and was born from other God. People according to mormons after death can gain God's attributes, so they are the same being with God, which can not be connect with christian belief. Mormonism was made in contrary to whole christianity, its prophet and creator Joseph Smith called all christian churches as contradict with christianity. And jeahova witnesses don't even call themselves christians, they call themselves jeahova witnesses and they believe just like muslims and jews that Jesus Christ wasn't Son of God.