Brothers For The Sake Of Allah | Keep A Beard | Lengthen The Beards | Size Of Fist |

[Salahudeen]

I understand what muraad is saying that we need to get people's emaan up before talking about beard because the commandments of Allah are hard to follow without strong emaan and that's why the first verses revealed focused on emaan, however the context the article was written in was that of an Islamic forum where people come to learn about the deen, if he stood up and read the article out in a night club full of Muslims' then I'd agree with muraad and tyrion because in that context the beard isn't the most important thing, the most important thing is to stop those people from going clubbing.

However the article was written in the context of an Islamic forum where people come to learn about their religion, because they have some level of emaan that's encouraged them to join an islamic forum and seek islamic knowledge. So in that context I'd say it's perfectly fine and nothing wrong with it, however if the article was read at a gathering of Muslims that are all drinking alcohol and then fornicating then in that context the article would be out of place.

We may as well stop talking about all other issues under the guise of "there's more important things to talk about" I know this isn't what you're saying and it's not the point you're making, but it can easily be done, someone could go onto every topic and type "Why are you mentioning this for when we have bigger problems in our community" and it would fit in every thread.

But at the end of the day there's a context in which things are said, and this article was posted on an Islamic forum where people are trying to seek knowledge about every aspect of their deen, and that's why you have all the sections of the forum such as fiqh, aqeedah, general, comparitive religion, worship in Islam, for people to talk about these issues, if you think they're not worth talking about then just close those sections of the forum and say "we have more important things to talk and worry about than fiqh issues" instead of creating a platform for people to speak about these issues and then telling them "hey why are you posting this in the fiqh section for when we have bigger problems to worry about" why not just close the section so people can't talk about it that makes more sense instead of having a section for fiqh issues then when people talk about fiqh they get told "man there's bigger issues to worry about than this why you talking about this for", then the OP thinks "Hang on I thought this was the fiqh section where such things could be discussed :hmm:"

And I think even the op understands that if he was in a situation where people were doing greater sins then his first priorty is to stop those sins but he's posted it on an Islamic forum where people like to learn about Islam. He never went out to a night club and started lecturing Muslims who were drinking alcohol about the importance of the beard. So saying to him "worry about more important things" is incorrect I feel, I mean how do you know he's not worrying about more important things? He could be out every night on the streets giving dawah to people and doesn't even mention their beard cos he understands its not the correct context.

Your argument would only be valid if the op posted this article on a kafir forum or a forum where muslims were doing major sins, but the fact is he posted it on an Islamic forum that provides a platform to discuss such issues. So I don't understand why people are telling him to worry about bigger issues, you may as well post in the entire fiqh section of the forum "why are you worrying about this for when we have bigger issues to worry about" people will laugh and say "hello this is an islamic forum and this section of the forum was created to talk about such issues so stop telling us that please" :hmm:


Now I think basically what's happened is, people have got their wires crossed, murad and tyron are talking/thinking about real life scenarios, they're imagining a practising Muslim with a beard lecturing another Muslim who's fornicating and drinking alcohol about keeping a beard, they're saying in this situation the beard isn't the most important thing to worry about. And I'm sure everyone would agree with this. In this situation the beard is not the priority everyone agrees with this!

However other people are talking about something completely different, they're talking about discussing Islamic issues in an Islamic gathering such as an Islamic forum, and they're saying there's nothing wrong what so ever in mentioning these issues in such a context and I think we'd all agree with this. and hence the wires have been crossed which gave way to the big misunderstanding.

You're all talking about two completely different things :hmm:

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

Well we shouldn't get so passionate that we almost get to the point of dissing someone or wanting to prove them wrong. Thats not passion. I agree with the post before members, this is an Islamic forum and a platform has been layed out to discuss it so stop bugging....

 

[GuestFellow]

Well we shouldn't get so passionate that we almost get to the point of dissing someone or wanting to prove them wrong. Thats not passion. I agree with the post before members, this is an Islamic forum and a platform has been layed out to discuss it so stop bugging....

Asslamu Alaikuma!

Your back. Nice to see your posts again.

Anyway, not sure if I should say this but I suspect the Muslim members dislike the the topic may not actually grow a full fist beard themselves. This may be a possibility why some have taken a confrontational reaction.

Light of Heaven (I prefer to call you Light of Thunder lol) put it well when she said "ppl shouldnt bungee jump someone for talking about it"...

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

Wa alaykum assalaam. JazakAllaah khayr brother, good to see u too. Thunder lol....sorry I just usually make up stuff as i go.

I did notice that usually people get defensive when they themselves don't want to let it grow or don't like it...not all but many. And I also noticed whenever the topic of the beard comes up, I see opposing comments.

I posted a video once on my Facebook page about it and the sister reacted in the same manner that people are here. So my question to such people, why does it bother you? It's still islaam is it not? Everything that is connected to this deen has importance.

 

[Salahudeen]

Wa alaykum assalaam. JazakAllaah khayr brother, good to see u too. Thunder lol....sorry I just usually make up stuff as i go.

I did notice that usually people get defensive when they themselves don't want to let it grow or don't like it...not all but many. And I also noticed whenever the topic of the beard comes up, I see opposing comments.

I posted a video once on my Facebook page about it and the sister reacted in the same manner that people are here. So my question to such people, why does it bother you? It's still islaam is it not? Everything that is connected to this deen has importance.

They usually get defensive because they've had guy with a beard lecturing them day in day out making them feel inferior and bad for having a clean shave, I once trimmed my beard below a fistful and every person I met asked me "why did you trim your beard for" like I'd comitted the crime of the century, even people without beards would point the finger and say " mg: how could you trim your beard" in the end I got sick of it all and shaved it all off just to spite them and when they'd ask me why I shaved my beard off I'd just make some stupid answer to anoy them, reviewing my actions now, that was probably not the best thing to do and was foolish, but the point is people become defensive over certain stuff cos they've been attacked in the past about it. I actually had one brother who refused to shake my hand when he saw I trimmed my beard less than a fistful???

If someone trims their beard I never mention it in a derogatory manner cos I know how annoying it is, there's a way to doing things and making people feel bad isn't the way. I'm actually put off modern men with beards, apart from the few that I've met who know how to talk to someone. I know that sounds very wrong and bad, but a lot of them I found, if you don't have a beard or you have a short beard, they make you feel so guilty and bad that you can't bear to be in their company cos you're constantly reminded of your insufficiencies. Not all bearded brothers are like this, just the one's I've met personally in my life.

What anoyed me more was that different scholars have different opinions about the beard, yet when people follow a certain opinion i.e the beard should be this long then they try to force that opinion on everyone else around them, and a person who follows another scholars opinion and has a shorter beard is made to feel inferior like he's doing something wrong.

As a result I don't really mix with bearded brothers even though I have a beard myself and could be apart of the "bearded guys gang" I choose not to cos I get anoyed when they gossip about someone as if he's done the greatest sin possible because he decided to take an inch off his beard :hmm: la hawla wa la qu watta illa billa he trimmed his beard a bit astagfirAllah!!! ya Allah!!! this type of mentality/attitude I've come across in my life.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

^^ I absolutely understand that and it's not the way to go but speaking from experience those same people shouldn't fume out at others, it puts me off also. They get put off and then someone like me gets put off, no one benefits.

Anyways I jus hate that it has to be such a big deal to talk about it. I'm pretty sure had the sahaba been around or even the prophet sallalallaahu alayhi wasallam, we wouldn't dare do this. So just think of it like that...I hardly doubt we would say to them, let's focus on the bigger stuff as if those r the only important aspects. I dislike this "this is more important than that" type of attitude, mind you they all have meaning...

 

[A-Brother]

Jazakallah To The Above Two Users Salahuddin And Light Of Heaven, I Am Quite New To The Forum Meaning I Am Not Very Familiar With The Users On This Forum And Not Aware Of How They React With Posts, So I Have Tried To Let Others Discuss The For And Against Arguments They Have Bought Up In The Thread. Jazakallah For Presenting Your Views Foward. I Agree On The Point Which The Brother Mentioned ' Theres A Time And Place For Everything '.

I Apologise Once Again If Anyone Has Been Hurt During The Posts Made In This Thread Due To The Contradictions/Differences In Opinions. The Forum Is Not To Cause Any Kind Of Hatred. We All Are In Need Of Seeking Knowledge. We Shouldn't Let Others Get Put Of By Coming On This Website By The Comments We Make.

May Allah Grant Us The Correct Understanding.

Allah Knows Best

 

[Insaanah]

As Imam Suhaib Webb said, ‎"Don't study Islam to go back to your community and dictate your books without practicality. If you do, you're a criminal." And there can be no truer statement

Allah is the only one who can judge who is a criminal and who isn't.

If someone posts an article on keeping the beard (or any other "lesser" good deed for that matter), whatever is in their capacity, even if it is reminding but without how practically to do it, while pornography is happening in your community, will Allah say to him, "You are a criminal for reminding people about that good deed"? OR, will this happen? "So whosoever does good equal to the weight of an atom (or a small ant), shall see it.'' (Qur'an 99:7). This is for Allah to judge, not us.

Our communities are plagued with much worse issues than shaving such as domestic violence, divorce, pornography etc. Those issues are of much greater importance.

If pornography, domestic violence etc is a problem in your community, then the most constructive thing to do about it is not to question someone who posts an article on keeping the beard, but to open a new thread, and say, peeps, pornography is a problem in my community, could we all put forward ideas and brainstorm, how it can be dealt with and how can it be prevented on a short and long-term basis, how can we advise people in a wise way so that they're not tempted to it etc. That is a far better use of your time, and of far more benefit to your community. If you think it's a problem in the Muslim community as a whole, and you want to do something about it, start threads, get ideas, get people involved. Questioning an article on the beard won't really help you to achieve the aim you're after.

Also, comments like the following do not help foster Islamic unity and brotherhood, if we are going to question the egos of our fellow brother and sisters when they enjoin the good and forbid the evil:

I'd say the vast majority of those who claim to be enjoining the good and forbidding the evil have their own ego problems they need to work out first... But that's just from my experience...

If what is written is Islamically correct, take it, if it isn't, leave it. People's egos are Allah's affairs not ours, and He knows their intentions, and will reward or punish accordingly. If you think that something is Islamically wrong with what has been posted, then quote the part you think is wrong, and explain with evidence why you think it is wrong, and again, with evidence, explain how it should be. This is far more constructive.

Now I think basically what's happened is, people have got their wires crossed, murad and tyron are talking/thinking about real life scenarios...in a night club full of Muslims' I'd agree with muraad and tyrion because in that context the beard isn't the most important thing

I hadn't considered this possibility, jazaakallah khayr for alerting us to it. Maybe that is the case. Allahu a3lam.

Anyhow, this is my last post in this thread, Allah knows best in all matters and may He forgive me if I said anything wrong.

 

[Salahudeen]

Jazakallah To The Above Two Users Salahuddin And Light Of Heaven, I Am Quite New To The Forum Meaning I Am Not Very Familiar With The Users On This Forum And Not Aware Of How They React With Posts, So I Have Tried To Let Others Discuss The For And Against Arguments They Have Bought Up In The Thread. Jazakallah For Presenting Your Views Foward. I Agree On The Point Which The Brother Mentioned ' Theres A Time And Place For Everything '.

I Apologise Once Again If Anyone Has Been Hurt During The Posts Made In This Thread Due To The Contradictions/Differences In Opinions. The Forum Is Not To Cause Any Kind Of Hatred. We All Are In Need Of Seeking Knowledge. We Shouldn't Let Others Get Put Of By Coming On This Website By The Comments We Make.

May Allah Grant Us The Correct Understanding.

Allah Knows Best

Our poor bro has become stressed with this thread, look at his mood

 

[A-Brother]

Thats The Reason Why I Have Used The Following Thread To Clear My Mind From All The Confusions. Hope You Find It Beneficial In Any Way. Jazakallah For Your Assistance Brothers And Sisters. Its Also Important That We Get Our Knowledge From The Correct People And Sources. Before We Flick Through Channels To Watch A Speaker. Do A Profile Check On The Scholar/Where He Studies/Who He Studied Under E.T.C, It Doesn't Mean If He Is Quoting Loads Of Ahadith And Quran Ayaats That He Is An Authentic Scholar. We Should Ask Our Local Imams/Scholars/Shaykh Whether We Should Listen To Such People. Another Example Is When One Sits And Reads A Book, It Is As If You Are In The Company Of That Author. And The Words Of That Author May Have An Affect On Your Heart. Same Could Be Said About Our Comments, Our Comments Can Have An Effect On The Reader And Be A Means Of Guidance Or Other E.T.C.

Allah Knows Best

Watch The Live Broadcast Of Prayers From Makkah And Madinah Live Including 24 Hour Broadcast

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

Wa eyyak wa barakAllaahu feek brother Adam. I hope these incidents don't hinder your stay at this forum. You will come cross such instances and you will surely find brothers on here you'll grow to love and appreciate.

May Allaah reward any good intention from any post that was presented here, Aameen. I would consider sis insanahs post....some good advice mashaAllaah.

Wassalaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaah.

 

[Ibn Abi Ahmed]

Well we shouldn't get so passionate that we almost get to the point of dissing someone or wanting to prove them wrong. Thats not passion. I agree with the post before members, this is an Islamic forum and a platform has been layed out to discuss it so stop bugging....

I think we're discussing in a fairly civil manner. Critiquing someone else's position does not mean that there is a personal agenda or that one person wants to prove the other wrong. It's a mature discussion. I'm positive no on here has anything personal against anyone else.

^^ I absolutely understand that and it's not the way to go but speaking from experience those same people shouldn't fume out at others, it puts me off also. They get put off and then someone like me gets put off, no one benefits.

Anyways I jus hate that it has to be such a big deal to talk about it. I'm pretty sure had the sahaba been around or even the prophet sallalallaahu alayhi wasallam, we wouldn't dare do this. So just think of it like that...I hardly doubt we would say to them, let's focus on the bigger stuff as if those r the only important aspects. I dislike this "this is more important than that" type of attitude, mind you they all have meaning...

With all due respect sister, this is a forum and I am sure we can all discuss this topic as mature individuals. I haven't seen anyone fuming at anyone else.

I don't think it's a fair argument to say, if the Prophet (saw) or the Companions were here, we wouldn't talk about it. Frankly, things would be very different and to bring that social reality into our current social reality doesn't really work.

Jazakallah To The Above Two Users Salahuddin And Light Of Heaven, I Am Quite New To The Forum Meaning I Am Not Very Familiar With The Users On This Forum And Not Aware Of How They React With Posts, So I Have Tried To Let Others Discuss The For And Against Arguments They Have Bought Up In The Thread. Jazakallah For Presenting Your Views Foward. I Agree On The Point Which The Brother Mentioned ' Theres A Time And Place For Everything '.

I Apologise Once Again If Anyone Has Been Hurt During The Posts Made In This Thread Due To The Contradictions/Differences In Opinions. The Forum Is Not To Cause Any Kind Of Hatred. We All Are In Need Of Seeking Knowledge. We Shouldn't Let Others Get Put Of By Coming On This Website By The Comments We Make.

May Allah Grant Us The Correct Understanding.

Allah Knows Best

You have no reason to apologize brother. You posted something commendable and there were certain aspects I disagreed with and I wrote about it. This is the purpose of having a forum where we can talk things out. Discussion is a good thing.

Allah is the only one who can judge who is a criminal and who isn't.

You're still not getting it. We're not talking about a criminal in the spiritual aspect of the meaning, if we were, you would be correct, rather the intended meaning is the fiqhi aspect. A faqih does have the right to call someone a faasiq (criminal), you cannot argue with him that "Allah is the only one who can judge" because then you are speaking about something completely different. Imam Suhaib was simply echoing what the fuqaha, giants such as Ash-Shaatibi and others have said regarding the role of the mufti and what he is obligated to do.

If someone posts an article on keeping the beard (or any other "lesser" good deed for that matter), whatever is in their capacity, even if it is reminding but without how practically to do it, while pornography is happening in your community, will Allah say to him, "You are a criminal for reminding people about that good deed"? OR, will this happen? "So whosoever does good equal to the weight of an atom (or a small ant), shall see it.'' (Qur'an 99:7). This is for Allah to judge, not us.

This is irrelevant to the discussion.

If pornography, domestic violence etc is a problem in your community, then the most constructive thing to do about it is not to question someone who posts an article on keeping the beard, but to open a new thread, and say, peeps, pornography is a problem in my community, could we all put forward ideas and brainstorm, how it can be dealt with and how can it be prevented on a short and long-term basis, how can we advise people in a wise way so that they're not tempted to it etc. That is a far better use of your time, and of far more benefit to your community. If you think it's a problem in the Muslim community as a whole, and you want to do something about it, start threads, get ideas, get people involved. Questioning an article on the beard won't really help you to achieve the aim you're after.

I'm trying to understand why you're repeatedly picking out a sentence or two of my entire post and then addressing that instead of looking the point holistically.

My conclusion was, had you understood the point holistically, that the people who actually care about the community should focus on issues that are of a greater priority to the entire community and place that benefit above the benefit of the practicing few because at the end of the day the people that actually care about knowledge and practicing are a very small minority. If they're caught up on issues that are secondary at the macro level, then who in the world will focus on the social evils that are plaguing our youth?

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

^^ there have been a few comments in this thread that did just the opposite of what you seem to be claiming. In fact, the very first reply was harsh. Give your brother the benefit of doubt in regards to his intention when he posted this. I find it rather silly that you would say no one is saying anything to anyone when it's right in front of our faces.

Why is it bothersome to talk about it, this is my question since I started posting here and this question still stands. I know that you are critiquing his posts. If u haven't noticed I took no ones names, but those who are behaving in an unnecessary manner know who they are. I don't think I need to take names and I won't.

I think it is fair to bring up the prophet sallallaahu alayhi wasallam and the sahaba radhiAllaahu anhum. I brought it up so that we think about how some of us are behaving. obviously they are not here and can't be, that would imply islaam isn't complete and alhamdulillaah it is.

I'm not angry or anything, annoyed yes. Like I said there's no reason for anyone to say or even remotely imply that he cannot talk about it.

Quite frankly, it's far from a critique. I wonder if anyone took into consideration how some of these posts may have made him feel. I da say some people are heartless if you cannot be more gentle in your approach.

I know I will have some opposing comments oming at me but frankly I don't care anymore. I feel sad when I see someone being cornered and it's pathetic. Ys I'm emotional, good for me huh.

FYI Ill mention again I took no names and most of my posts were not to you akhi Muraad

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

Unless this thread sticks only to critiquing his posts in a way that is right, I'm jetting out of this thread before you know it.


Also, does anyone know what to make of this:

Reported by Abu Darda that RasulAllaah, sallallaahu alayhi wasallam, said "I have no connection with one who shaves, shouts and tears his clothing e.g. in grief or affliction."

Muslim.

^^whether it's actually in Muslim. JazakAllaah Khayr.
Assalaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaah.

 

[Periwinkle18]

JazakAllah khayr for sharing learnt alot will go n tell my bro

 

[Txyib]

salaam
keeping a beard is sunnah and it should be at least a fistfull regardless of what people think
wasalam