Debate: Why do some people completely reject hadith?

[M H Kahn]

We as Muslims do not have to read all the hadith to determine which ones are authentic or not the Prophets Companions have done it for us.

How could the prophet's companions determine which of the Hadiths were fake or fabricated when the stories were written about two hundreds years after the death of the prophet and when none of his companions was alive? Take reason in showing scholarship !

 

[Looking4Peace]

... There is only one Islam and that is the Islam that there Prophet and his Companions were on, people who reject hadiths are far from the Islam of Prophet Muhammad. There are 73 sects and only one is saved, the People of the Sunnah. [post was edited]

Wow nice verbal attack right there, you should feel so proud of yourself

first of all i am new to Islam you are right about that, and what a nice way to greet me or make me feel welcome, you assumed that i do not read the hadith and yes i actually do, you are completeltly insulting western culture, yea it has its problems but i am from a western culture so you are clearly insulting me and being prejudice at that, and to say that voting in this country is not aloud? --- your basically saying every muslim in the united states is not allowed to vote, hmmmmm? Its people like you who give islam a bad name by being so extreme, attacking people and thinking you must be better than everyone else, also let me say its people like you who think because someone becomes muslim or shall i say reverts to islam, that we have to completely drop our culture and accept that culture of where islam first started when the truth of the matter is one does not have to disregard ones culture as long as its not engaging in activities that are forbidden in islam. You messed with the wrong person, cause for the record i emails scholars back and forth, i am not a dummy, i am simply learning, i simply stated a fact that it is not the easiest undestood aspect of islam (hadith)
i was just explaining to people that no matter what not evreryone intereprets either the quran or the hadith excatly the same and you just proved this by attacking me for living in a western society, where are you anyway saudi arabia?

and half the stuff you speak of i cannot even understand what u mean, why try to confuse someone who is new with all this technical talk, get a life and learn how to deal with people

why the do u insist on attacking me

do yourself a favor and do not ever speak to me here again OR I WILL KEEP REPORTING YOU OVER AND OVER AGAIN

maybe you should read how people talk to each other here, cause you sure go about things quite disgusting, i gave up plenty of things, you do not know me so why judge? i do not drink, do not smoke, do not fornicate was never much for these things before i reverted and i sure dont assume and jump on peoples backs to way you do

shame on you

Get off your high horse and it is not your place to judge anyone, YOU ARE NOT GOD

 

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

If someone is confused about a hadith or doesn't understand something the only logical thing to do is ask those who know. If you don't know something just ask! Why languish confusion and doubt and keep your troubles to yourself? Alhamdulilah, Muslims today have resources which provide them with access to scholars who have studied these issues and can provide answers for them and clarify their confusion. This is especially what Muslims need to do when it comes to the hadith since it can be very easy for a non-scholar to get confused in the area if they don't turn to others for help.

As for understanding the Qur'an, it is true that one can understand the complete Islamic message from the Qur'an itself. However, they will not be able to implement the Qur'anic injuctions accurately in their life without turning to the ahadith which clarify how the Prophet pbuh implemented the laws, under what conditions and circumstances.

Hadiths are mostly hearsays collected by some individuals of their own around two hundred years after the death of Muhammed (pbuh).​

An unfortunate MYTH.

Myth #1 Ahadeeth were written 200 years after the Prophet (Peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)

This misconception is based on the hadeeth mentioned in Saheeh Muslim (Second authenthic Hadeeth collection):

It was narrated from Abu Sa’eed al-Khudri that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: Do not write anything from me; whoever has written anything from me other than the Qur’aan, let him erase it and narrate from me, for there is nothing wrong with that. (Narrated by Muslim, al-Zuhd wa’l-Raqaa’iq, 5326)
​

Those who use this hadeeth and argue that no ahadeeth were written are ignorant of the historical temporary prohibition of this statement. The temporary prohibition was meant as a precautionary step to ensure the correctness of the word of Allaah as distinguished from the words of the Prophet himself, as both came from the lips of the Prophet. This is one view and several other views are mentioned in the commentary on Saheeh Muslim by Imaam Al-Nawawi (May Allaah have mercy on him)


Al-Nawawi said in his commentary on Saheeh Muslim:

Al-Qaadi said: there were many disputes among the Sahaabah and Taabi’een concerning the writing down of knowledge. Many of them regarded this as being makrooh, but most of them regarded it as permissible. This dispute is no longer an issue.

They differed as to the meaning of this hadeeth which says that it is forbidden. It was said that this pertained to one who was sure of his memory, and there was the fear that he may rely upon what he had written if he wrote it down; the ahaadeeth which say that it is permissible to write things down is to be interpreted as referring to the one whose memory is not reliable, such as the hadeeth, “Write it down for Abu Shaah”; or the hadeeth of the saheefah of ‘Alee (may Allaah be pleased with him); the hadeeth of the book of ‘Amr ibn Hazm, which contains laws on inheritance, sunnahs and diyaat (blood money); the hadeeth about writing down charity, and the minimum amounts at which zakaah becomes obligatory (nisaab), with which Abu Bakr sent Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) to Bahrain; the hadeeth of Abu Hurayrah which says that Ibn ‘Amr ibn al-‘Aas used to ; write things down but he (Abu Hurayrah) did not write things down, and other ahaadeeth. And it was said that the hadeeth forbidding writing down ahaadeeth was abrogated by these ahaadeeth.

The prohibition was in effect when there was the fear that (the words of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) might be mixed with the Qur’aan. When that danger was no longer present, permission was given to write down (ahaadeeth). And it was said that the prohibition mentioned in the hadeeth referred to writing ahaadeeth on the same page as Qur’aan, lest they become mixed and thus the reader would be confused when looking at this page. And Allaah knows best.

The hadeeth of Abu Shaah was narrated by al-Bukhaari from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him), who said:
‘When Allaah granted His Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) victory over Makkah, he stood before the people and praised and glorified Allaah, then he said: “Allaah protected Makkah from the elephant and has given authority to His Messenger and the believers over it, so fighting was forbidden for anyone before me, and was made permissible for me for part of a day, and it will not be permissible for anyone after me. Its game should not be chased, its thorny bushes should not be uprooted, and picking up its fallen things is not allowed except for one who makes public announcement for it, and he whose relative is murdered has the option either to accept a compensation for it or to retaliate.” Al-‘Abbas said, “Except Al-Idhkhir (a kind of plant), for we use it in our graves and houses.” The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, “Except Al-Idhkhir.” Abu Shaah, a Yemeni, stood up and said, “O Messenger of Allaah! Get it written for me.” The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, “Write it for Abu Shaah.” (al-Luqatah, 2254)

Ibn Hajar said: What may be understood from the story of Abu Shaah (“Write it for Abu Shaah”) is that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) gave permission for hadeeth to be written down from him.
​

This contradicts the hadeeth of Abu Sa’eed al-Khudri, which says that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, ‘Do not write down anything from me except the Qur’aan.’ (Narrated by Muslim).

The two may be reconciled by noting that the prohibition applied only to the time when the Qur’aan was being revealed, lest it be confused with something else, and that permission was given at other times; or that the prohibition applied only to writing down things other than Qur’aan with the Qur’aan on one thing, and that permission was given to write them separately; of that the prohibition came first and the permission abrogated that, when there was no longer any fear of confusion. This is most likely to be the case.

It was said that the prohibition applied only to those whom it was feared would depend on the writing and not memorize things, and that permission was given for those from whom such a thing was not feared.

The scholars said: a group of the Sahaabah and Taabi’een regarded it as makrooh to write down the hadeeth and they regarded it as mustahabb to learn it from them by heart, as they had learned it. But when people were no longer able to strive so hard (in memorizing) and the scholars feared that knowledge might be lost, they compiled it in books.”
There are countless instructions from the Prophet instructing his companions to write down some ahadeeth.
​

One of the Ansaar (The Helpers) asked the Prophet if there was another way to preserve ahadeeth as he sometimes forgets them. The Prophet replied:

Seek help from your right hand, and pointed out to a writing. (Tirmidhi)
​

Raafi ibn Khadij (May Allaah be pleased with him) said:

I said to the Prophet that we hear from you many things, should we write them down?” He replied: You may write. There is no harm. (Tadreeb ar Raawi)
​

Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) narrates that the Prophet said:

Preserve knowledge by writing. (At-Tabari Jaami ul Bayaan)
​

Abu Raafi (may Allaah be pleased with him) sought permission from the Prophet to write ahadeeth and the Prophet granted him that permission (Tirmidhi)

​

Salma (student of Ibn Abbaas) says:

I saw some small wooden boards with Abdullaah Ibn Abbaas. He was writing on them some reports of the acts of the Prophet which he acquired from Abu Raafi’. (Tabaqaat Ibn Sa’d)
​

Abdullaah ibn Amr ibn al-Aas (May Allaah be pleased with him) reports that the Prophet said to him:

Preserve Knowledge
​

Abdullaah then asked,

how should it be preserved?

​

The Prophet replied,

by writing it.
(Mustadrik Haakim; Jaami ul Bayaan)
​

In another report, he says,

I came to the Prophet and told him, I want to narrate your ahadeeth. So, I want to take assistance of my handwriting besides my heart. Do you deem it fit for me?’

​

The Prophet replied,

If it is my hadeeth you may seek help from your hand besides your heart. (Daarimi)
​

He also says:

I used to write whatever I heard from the Prophet and wanted to learn it by heart. Some people of the Quraysh dissuaded me and said,
Do you write everything you hear from the Prophet, while he is a human being and sometimes he may be in anger as any other human beings may be? (Abu Daawood)
​

After Abdullaah ibn Amr conveyed their opinion to the Prophet, the Prophet replied by pointing to his lips and said:

I swear by the One in whose hands is the soul of Muhammad: nothing comes out from these two (lips) except truth(haqq). So, do write. (Abu Dawood; Tabaqaat ibn Sa’d; Mustadrik ul Haakim)

​

These narrations attest that ahadeeth were written during the era of the Prophet.

I will list here the prominent compilations written in the first and second century, some written by the sahabas (the Prophet’s companions), their students (taabi’een), and the students of the taabi’een (tabaa'at-taabi'een).

Some of the compilations during the era of the Prophet:

The Scripts of Abu Hurairah

Hasan ibn Amr reports that once:

Abu Hurairah took him to his home and showed him “many books” containing the ahadeeth of the Prophet. (Jaami’ Bayaan-ul-‘Ilm; Fath-ul-Baari)
​

The Script of Abdullaahi ibn Amr

Mujahid, his student, said

I went to Abdullaah ibn Amr and took in hand a script placed beneath his cushion. He stopped me. I said, You never save anything from me. He replied:
​

This is the Saadiqah (the Script of Truth). It is what I heard from the Prophet. No other narrator intervenes between him and myself. If this script, the Book of Allaah, and wahaz (his agricultural land) are secured for me, I would never care about the rest of the world. (Jaami’ Bayaan-ul-‘Ilm)
​

The Script of Anas

Sa’eed ibn Hilal, one of his students, says:

When we insisted upon Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) he would bring to us some notebooks and say, These are what I have heard and written from the Prophet, after which I have presented them to the Prophet for confirmation. (Mustadrik Haakim)
​

The Script of Alee

Alee said:

I have not written anything from the Prophet except the Qur’aan and what is contained in this script. (Saheeh Bukhaaree- Book of Jihaad)
​

Ibn Sa'd reports that Alee stood in the mosque and delivered a lecture then he asked the people:

Who will purchase ‘knowledge’ for one dirham only?
​

meaning, who wants to learn ahadeeth should buy writing paper for one dirham and come to him for dictation.

It is reported that Haarith al-A’war bought some paper and came to him:

So, Alee wrote for him a lot of knowledge. (Tabaqaat Ibn Sa’d)
​

Scripts of Jaabir

Qataadah, one of Jaabir’s students, says,

I remember the script of Jaabir more than I remember Surah al-Baqarah (Qur’aan). (Tahdheeb at-Tahdheeb)
​

Scripts of Ibn Abbaas

Musa ibn Uqbah says:

Kuraib left with us a camel load of Ibn Abbaas’s books. When Alee ibn Abdullaah ibn Abbaas would need any book from them, he wrote to Kuraib, ‘Send to me such and such books.’ He would then transcribe the book and send to him one of the two copies. (Tabaqaat Ibn Sa’d)
​

The pupils of Ibn Abbaas would copy these scripts and read them over to him to confirm the correctness of the copies. (Tirmidhi)

Sometimes Ibn Abbaas would narrate the ahadeeth to his pupils while they would record them. (Daarimi)

The compilations of the First Century:

1. Book of Khalid ibn Ma’dan (d. 104)
2. Books of Abu Qilabah (d. 104). He bequeathed his books to his pupil, Ayyub Saktiyan (68-131 A.H.), who paid more than ten dirhams as a fare for them being loaded on a camel.
3. The script of Hammam ibn Munabbih,
4. Books of Hasan al-Basri (21-110 A.H.)
5. Books of Muhammad al-Baqir (56-114 A.H.)
6. Books of Makhul from Syria
7. Book of Hakam ibn ‘Utaibah
8. Book of Bukair ibn Abdullaah ibn al-Ashajj (d. 117)
9. Book of Qais ibn Sa’d (d. 117). This book later belonged to Hammad ibn Salamah.
10. Book of Sulaiman al-Yashkuri
11. Al-Abwaab of Sha’bi,
12. Books of Ibn Shihaab az-Zuhri
13. Book of Abul-Aliyah
14. Book of Sa’id ibn Jubair (d. 95)
15. Books of Umar ibn ‘Abdul Aziz (61-101 A.H.)
16. Books of Mujahid ibn Jabr (d. 103)
17. Book of Raja ibn Hywah (d. 112)
18. Book of Abu Bakr ibn Muhammad ibn Amr ibn Haq
19. Book of Bashir ibn Nahik.

The compilations of the second century (note that only the prominent ones are listed due length) :

1. Book of Abdul Malik ibn Juraij (d. 150)
2. Muwatta of Maalik ibn Anas (93-179)
3. Muwatta of Ibn Abi Zi’b (80-158)
4. Maghaazi of Muhammad ibn Ishaq (d. 151)
5. Musnad of Rabi’ ibn Sabih (d. 160)
6. Book of Sa’id ibn Abi ‘Arubah (d. 156)
7. Book of Hammad ibn Salmah (d. 167)
8. Jami’ Sufyan ath-Thauri (97-161)
9. Jami’ Ma’mar ibn Rashid (95-153)
10. Book of ‘Abdur-Rahman al-Awzaa’I (88-157)
11. Kitaab az-Zuhd by Abdullaah ibn al-Mubaarak (118-181)
12. Book of Hushaim ibn Bashir (104-183)
13. Book of Jarir ibn ‘Abdul-Hamid (110-188)
14. Book of Abdullaah ibn Wahb (125-197)
15. Book of Yahya ibn Abi Kathîr (d. 129)
16. Book of Muhammad ibn Suqah (d. 135)
17. Tafsîr of Zaid ibn Aslam (d. 136)
18. Book of Musa ibn ‘Uqbah (d. 141)
19. Book of Ash’ath ibn ‘Abdul-Malik (d. 142)
20. Book of Aqil ibn Khalid (d. 142)
21. Book of Yahya ibn Sa’id Ansari (d. 143)
22. Book of Awf ibn Abi Jamilah (d. 146)
23. Books of Jafar ibn Muhammad al-Sadiq (d. 148)
24. Books of Yunus ibn Yazid (d. 152)
25. Book of ‘Abdur-Rahman al-Mas’udi (d. 160)
26. Books of Zaidah ibn Qudamah (d. 161)
27. Books of Ibrahim al-Tahman (d. 163)
28. Books of Abu Hamzah al-Sukri (d. 167)
29. Al-Gharaaib by Shu’bah ibn al-Hajjaj (d. 160)
30. Books of Abdul-Aziz ibn ‘Abdullaah al-Majishun (d. 164)
31. Books of Abdullaah ibn ‘Abdullaah ibn Abi Uwais (d. 169)
32. Books of Sulaiman ibn Bilal (d. 172)
33. Books of Abdullaah ibn Lahi’ah (d. 147)
34. Jami’ Sufyan ibn ‘Uyainah (d. 198)
35. Kitaab-ul-AAthaar by Imaam Abu Haneefah (d. 150)
36. Maghaazi of Mu’tamir ibn Sulaiman (d. 187)
37. Musannaf of Waki’ ibn Jarrah (d. 196)
38. Musannaf of Abdur-Razzaaq ibn Hammam (136-221)
39. Musnad of Zaid ibn Alee (76-122)
40. Books of Imaam Shaafi’i (150-204)

The following are available today in printed form:

1. Al-Muwatta by Imaam Maalik.
2. Kitaab-ul-AAthaar by Imaam Abu Haneefah.
3. Musannaf by ‘Abdur-Razzaaq. This book has been published in eleven big volumes.
4. As-Seerah by Muhammad ibn Ishaq.
5. Kitaab az-Zuhd by ‘Abdullaah ibn al-Mubaarak.
6. Kitaab az-Zuhd by Waki’ ibn Jarraah (3 volumes).
7. Al-Musnad by Zaid ibn Alee (76-122).
8. Sunan of Imaam Shaafi’i.
9. Musnad of Shaafi’i.
10. Siyar of Awzaa’i (88-157).
11. Musnad of ‘Abdullaah ibn al-Mubaarak.
12. Musnad of Abu Daawood Tayalisi (d. 204).
13. Ar-Radd ‘ala Siyaril-Awzaa’i by Imaam Abu Yoosuf.
14. Al-Hujjah ‘ala Ahlil-Madeenah by Imaam Muhammad ibn Hasan Shaibaani.
15. Kitaabul-Umm by Imaam Shaafi’i.
16. Al-Maghaazi by Waqidi (130-206) (4 volumes).

Taken from br.kadafi's post here:
http://www.islamicboard.com/212874-post5.html

 

[samobosna96]

How could the prophet's companions determine which of the Hadiths were fake or fabricated when the stories were written about two hundreds years after the death of the prophet and when none of his companions was alive? Take reason in showing scholarship !

in my hurry i confused something, here i will clear it up, and if someone who is more knowledgable can correct me. the Prophets Companions in the first and second hijra years BEGAN to compile sort out the authentic hadith and this continued through until the Prphet died and many, many years after.

after the prophets death Umar relied on Aisha, Abu Huraiyah, and Ali to convey and compile hadith.

also the companians in their time and travels communiated the various teachings written down from the arab pennisula to china along with the quran.

even though the bulk of the authentication began later the Companions started the process.

 

[samobosna96]

crystal4peace..


for one thing i wasnt tearing off your head and let me clear some things up..

1. those who reject hadith are not Muslim
2. the saudi arabia comment proves your ignorance of this religion
3. yes i was insuting the west, I am a Muslim (Bosnian) Canadian. I live in the west and i see everyday how bankrupt secular culture is. God willing one day it will fall to Islam and Islam will take over the world. (through intellectual means not violent)
4. yes a muslim cannot accept demoracy and support it. to support democracy is to take arms against God and the Muslims. Demoracy is not cultural it is ideological, a Muslim cannot accept secular concepts on any level to do so is shirk.
5. and i never said i was better than you, i was only stating a point, get tougher skin, you'll need it when the Muslim Holocuast starts roaring within the next few years.
6. and yes you have to drop everything that you did prior to Islam for the sake of Allah SWT. You will never be a true beleiver until the message of islam is dearer to you than this world.
7.i didnt attack you stopping do those activities is a good thing, never did i say you were a bad person, just that by saying yhat hadith should be rejected takes you out of the fold of Islam, which it does.
8. and go ahead report me to moderators while you are at it report me to the Canadian government and the American government. I fear Allah SWT not you, forum moderators, or the political elite. TAKE ME AWAY TO GIT-MO.
9. Islam is Quran and Sunnah whether you understand it or not

 

[Looking4Peace]

Again alot of what you are saying is not true, i jsut emailed your commentes to a scholar (dont worry your name was not used)

I think you are exaggerating a bit, and so you are saying that one has to drop his/her culture to except islam, even if these things dont go against islam?

certainly not true at all. I mean im a european and hispanic mix? i cannot eat spanish or european dishes anymore you are saying? do i have to just eat arabic food

you say i have to drop everything i did prior to islam?
you mean i have to drop things that were not unislamic in any way, even if they were completely positive things? do you think that all other cultures do is drink and have sex- proves you are a very prejudice person

your really sounding foolish

and i take it upon myself to vote, hoping that people like bush wont get into office again- i guess im going to hell for this one with intentions that we will get a president who will stop attacking the mideast.

 

[Looking4Peace]

crystal4peace..



6. and yes you have to drop everything that you did prior to Islam for the sake of Allah SWT. You will never be a true beleiver until the message of islam is dearer to you than this world.


can someone please tell me what he exactly means
if this means i cannot do things that have to do with my culture that do not go against islam or are not haram, please show me proof

and please someone else give me an answer besides this guy

 

[Muslim Knight]

I wonder how anti-Hadith people do their prayers. Astagfirullah.

 

[BoiStop]

Re: Rejection of Ahadith

Salaam Ansar Al-'Adl,

Why do some people reject hadith? The answer is quite simple - ignorance...

Could you please prove the authentication of hadiths through the Quran? Could you please give me the verses in the Quran that talk about these hadiths?

The problem is you do not understand what the hadith and the hadith compilations are. The Qur'an commands us to follow the way of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh and accept his teachings. In fact it negates the faith of anyone who fails to do so..

45:6
Such are the signs of Allah, which we rehearse in truth: then in what hadith will they believe after Allah and his signs?


So was the Messenger rehearsing other hadiths?

This is another one of your miscocneptions. We don't accept the hadith in Sahih Bukhari because they were compiled by Imaam Bukhari. We accept them because they have gone through the most rigorous process of authentication by the scholars, and the efforts of the Muslim scholars for over a millenia have confirmed their authenticity.

And again, your faith lies in the hands of men. Why? becuase you depend on man to sort "authentic" and what is not. You depend on man to tell you what is divine. Do you believe that every so called "authentic" hadith, is honestly authentic? Do you believe that every so called "fabricated" haidth is truly fabricated? Where have all of these people recieved their authority/mission from? Why do you believe these are divine? Because man tells you so? What does the Quran say about the issue?

You misunderstand the function of the compilers of hadith - they were collecting the hadith that had already been recorded and transmitted and after authenticating them included them in their collection.

And again, you believe that Allah has left it up to men to authenticate divine messages?

And the efforts of the hadith scholars were built on the efforts of those who preceded them and confirmed by the efforts of those who came after them.

So these poeple have not made one error?

Why hasn't Sahih Ibn Hibban achieved the status of Sahih Bukhari? Was it because Imam Ibn Hibban was any less of a scholar? No, it is because the hadith in Sahih Ibn Hibban went through the authentication process and the scholars found some hadith to be inauthentic, so overall the compilation does not hold the same status as Sahih Bukhari which has unanimously been upheld to be completely authentic by the Muslim scholars.

And again, you are confirming what is authentic and what is not through men. Are men divine? Are men incapable of error?

Exactly what would you do if something labeled as "fabricated" is actually "authentic"? Whose fault is that? Theirs because they told you that it was? Or yours because you believed them? What in the Quran tells you that these men are incapable of error?

Myth. The hadith were recorded during the Prophet's lifetime by the companions; see br. kadafi's post here:
ALL MYTHS ABOUT AHADEETH DEBUNKED HERE

Yea, and the Prophet was also reported to have said do not write anything that he says but the Quran.

He didn't leave it up to you - you don't understand the rigorous process behind the authentication of hadith because you have never studied that science. Yet for some reason you have the audacity to pass judgement on a subject you are ignorant of!

Us- in general. And yes, I have the audacity to pass judgment.

Ahadith are not authenticated by some randomized process - the content as well as the chain of narration for each hadith is studied carefully to determine its authenticity, and this isn't done by just one scholar - this is the collective efforts of all the Muslim hadith scholars throughout Islamic history.

Are these men incapable of error???

Another point - it is always amusing to note hadith rejectors says, "But some of these hadith contradict the Qur'an". They forget that one of the requirements for a hadith's authenticity is that it be in accordance with the Qur'an, so the scholars of hadith already checked that before passing their judgement on it.

Obviously that is not the case becuase in the Quran it does not say to stone hte adulterer, rathar it says flog those who commit illegal sexual intercourse and then it goes even further to say that an adulterer should only be with an adulterer. YET hadiths clearly say to stone the adulterer.

What a hadith rejector really means when they make such a comment is that the hadith contradicts their ill-informed and mistaken understanding of the Qur'an.

Yes, we are all mistaken, though you can't even provide any verse from the Quran that authenticates these so called divine hadiths.

You're asking the wrong question. If we agree that God mandated for us to follow the Prophet pbuh, then the question should be whether these hadith are authentic in what they ascribe to the Prophet. By mandating obedience to the Prophet, God has mandated for us to follow all of the sayings and teachings of the Prophet which have been authentically transmitted to us.

Please read the verses that talk about staying away from alcohol and gambling, and women covering themselves.

If you think this verse is saying that there is no need for information beyond the Qur'an, then you haven't read the entire Qur'an:

Qur'an 16:44 And We have also sent down unto you the reminder, that you may tubayyina (EXPLAIN CLEARLY) to men what is sent down to them, and that they may give thought.

Again, I don't deny the MEssenger. I know his mission, and that was all established through the Quran.

salaam

 

[BoiStop]

Salaam,

Thoughts before I go to bed:

I find it interesting how some of you seem to be trying to put some status on being born and raised Muslim compared to not being raised Muslim.


Let me just say there are millions of born and raised Muslims in this world and look at how corrupt so many are: honor killings, raping women, killing innocent men, women, and children, oppressing others, giving women second class citizenship, denying them the right to vote and own thier own property. Also let's look at the genocide of the ethnic Arab Muslims who are killing ethnic black Muslims becuase according to them, black Muslims aren't real Muslims.

So if you like to live on the false beef that becuase you have been raised Muslim you are guided and you know more, check again... it means nothing.

salaam

 

[BoiStop]

Salaam M H Kahn,

But why do you reject the other sayings that do not conflict with the Quran?

The same reasaon why I would reject the idea that jumping up 20 times every 20 minutes is a religious obligation.

The Quran says it is a fully detailed scripture, and the details includes obeying the prophet, too.[/LEFT]

Who was to tell you about gambling, drinking alcohol, and women covering themselves?

salaam

 

[muslim_friend]

There are so many ahadith that speak of following the Sunnah. Since you hold the view that all hadith cannot be trusted, consider this: if atleast one of those hadith pertaining to the sunnah really is true, then your case is lost. All it takes is just one of those hadith to be verified (and they have). Even from a neutral point of view, it would appear you are taking a risk.The tides are in the favour of Qur'an and sunnah rather than Qur'an alone. When scholars say it is authentic, you say it is not. What if it really is authentic?>>> It so happens you just rejected the Prophet's saying!

Do you know of this verse?

"Verily in the messenger of Allah ye have a good example for him who looketh unto Allah and the Last Day, and remembereth Allah much." (33:21)

 

[muslim_friend]

If you think this verse is saying that there is no need for information beyond the Qur'an, then you haven't read the entire Qur'an:

Qur'an 16:44 And We have also sent down unto you the reminder, that you may tubayyina (EXPLAIN CLEARLY) to men what is sent down to them, and that they may give thought.

Again, I don't deny the MEssenger. I know his mission, and that was all established through the Quran.

The verse is very clear here. It's in favour of following the sunnah.

 

[x Maz x]

Chillax ya'll remember the Quranic ayah in which Allah says to us to give dawah in a wise respectful manner and argue in ways which are both respectful and beneficial..Please dont stoop to insults inshAllah..

"Invite to the way of your Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching and argue with them in ways that are best." Sura An-Nahl 16:125

Anyone disregarding the hadith claiming they are all false and madeup whatnot, please answer me two things:
1) How do you think the Quran was compiled?
Do you jus think it was sent on tablets and someone later just copied it? Or was it recited and recorded and compiled by MAN?...
2) I'm beginning to think you dont even think the Sahabah existed? Yay or nay?
Peace x


"You have indeed in the Messenger of Allah a beuatiful pattern [of conduct] for anyone whose hope is in Allah and the Final Day, and who engages much in the rememberance of Allah." [Surah al-Ahzab 33:21]

 

[x Maz x]

I find it interesting how some of you seem to be trying to put some status on being born and raised Muslim compared to not being raised Muslim.

We were all born as a Muslim, Verily Allah guides whom He wills and lets lead astray whom He wills, if anyone turns back to thy Lord with repentence it is obviously from Allah that they have come back to deen-ul-haaq...Surley our Lord is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful...

Let me just say there are millions of born and raised Muslims in this world and look at how corrupt so many are: honor killings, raping women, killing innocent men, women, and children, oppressing others, giving women second class citizenship, denying them the right to vote and own thier own property. Also let's look at the genocide of the ethnic Arab Muslims who are killing ethnic black Muslims becuase according to them, black Muslims aren't real Muslims.

Ya Allah guide them to Siratum-Mustakeem..Their answering is to Allah on the Day...Give dawah and guide them to whats right...the rest is to Allah...

So if you like to live on the false beef that becuase you have been raised Muslim you are guided and you know more, check again... it means nothing.

What is this? Competition whose a better Muslim: Reverts/People who are brorn in an Islamic background??
Listen Everyone Allah made us ALL as Muslim...we are ALL brothers and sisters, so stop competing, Allah alone is aware of what is concealed in your hearts and you will be payed your wages accordingly ...Your life, intentions and all your deeds will be judged as will everyone else...

"O Mankind!We have created you from a male and female, and made you into nations and tribes, so that ye may know one another (Not that ye may despise eachother). Verily the most honourable amongst you in the site of Allah is that who has At-Taqwaa [i.e one of the Mutataqun (pios)]. Verily Allah is All-knowing, All-Aware"

Peace and Keep the faith x

 

[chacha_jalebi]

alsoo

der r hadiths qudsi, which r directly sed by Allah (swt) 2 RasoolAllah (saw) so do you really think someone, will make something up about Allah (swt), when Allah (swt) says in surah al ghafaar it says

"Truly Allah guides not one who transgresses and lies."

also and by you rejectin hadiths sis, lemme post an ayah from d quran, surah an Nahl verse 106

"Any one who, after accepting faith in Allah, utters Unbelief, except under compulsion, his heart remaining firm in Faith - but such as open their breast to Unbelief, on them is Wrath from Allah, and theirs will be a dreadful Penalty."

rejectin the sunnah of RasoolAllah (saw) is unbelief, so it says here dat if u utter unbelief, then d wrath of Allah (swt) will b on ya!

2 lik make my statement more strong here we gooo in Surah Nisa vrse 79 it says .....

"And We have sent you (Muhammad) as a Messenger to humanity, and Allah is sufficient as a witness. He who obeys the Messenger, has indeed obeyed Allah, but he who turns away, then We have not sent you as a watcher over them."

and by rejectin d sunnah, u hav turned away as it says in d above ayah

so fix up!!! kay:

 

[x Maz x]

Braap Well said akhi...mucho respecto [sumin long lines of spanish sayin losa respect *eyes rolly*] lol...Well said...
Continue...
Peace x

 

[chacha_jalebi]

sista maz, chank u lol ders ova ways of showin ur happyness aswell (green button in corner) HINT HINT

come on boi stop sister, we want wots best 4 ya, we showin u evidence from Quran, dat hadiths r part of d deen, basically if u reject dem, den reject em, but i dnt tink u sud lead others 2 reject em, cos ur takin dem away from d deen..

and u didnt answer moi!!

do u belive in d dajjal?

 

[x Maz x]

LOL, Cuzzin' wont leme do it ...Must chuk reps round b4 givin it 2 u agen LOL...
Yo Sis answer us enit, we not tryna av a go at ya merely pointing evidence backin up HAAQ Peace x

 

[chacha_jalebi]

lol

answer sista boi stop lol we sud call u hadiths stop, but we not goin 2 :embarrass, bcos we cnt use nicknames

c how nice we r

but sista, do u belive in the dajjal? that he will come and stuff?