Do Angels Have free will?

[Fishman]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Hai!

I just wanted a quick banter about angels .

1) Are they free willed? Satan was, because although he was a perfect angel and quite high up in the rank system of angels, he decided he knew best, rebelled and became fallen. what about the others? Do they have free will or are all their actions and thoughts controlled by God?
If one of them got miffed at another would they start fighting?

2)Do islamic angels have wings? Or are they like Djinns in form?
3) Actually do Christian Angels have wings. ive never seen em portrayed flightless, but I cant find anything bibalic about them being airborne apart from where they appeared in the sky to the shepherds. And they might not have had wings to do that, they could have just hovered or something.

1) In Islam, Shaytan was not a fallen angel but a 'fallen' Djinn. He used to be a brilliant servant of God but, but he grew arrogant and ended up refusing to follow God's command to bow down to Adam, on the grounds that he was created from fire and was therefore superior to Adam (who had been created from clay/dirt). For this complete and outright rejection of God's Commands, he was thrown into Hell. He now wants to pull as many humans as he can down there with him as revenge.

In Islam, Angels always obey God, they don't fall. There is no story of a war in Heaven between different factions of Angels.

2) At least some definitely have wings, as I can remember. Maybe the Christian stories of winged Angels are based on Islam, like a lot of the traditional ideas about Heaven and Hell are supposedly. I remember somebody saying that a lot of Dante's Inferno was borrowed from Islam.

 

[lyesh]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

1) As fishman said... Satan is among the jinns.

"Behold! We said to the angels, "Bow down to Adam": They bowed down except Iblis. He was one of the Jinns, and he broke the Command of his Lord. Will ye then take him and his progeny as protectors rather than Me? And they are enemies to you! Evil would be the exchange for the wrong-doers!" (18:50)



2) We believe that angels have wings.

"Praise be to Allah, Who created (out of nothing) the heavens and the earth, Who made the angels, messengers with wings,- two, or three, or four (pairs): He adds to Creation as He pleases: for Allah has power over all things." (35:1)

 

[FatimaAsSideqah]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

The difference between angels and humans is that angels have been given the necessary qualities and powers to carry out their duties but they do not have free will. Man, on the other hand, has been given free will and can choose between right and wrong; this is why man will have to face the test on the day of judgement.

The duty of the angels is to glorify and praise Allah. They never get tired. They are always ready to obey Allah. They do not need sleep, nor do they require the things a human being would need. We cannot see the angels unless they appear in human form.

There is a host of angels in the kingdom of Allah. The four most prominent ones are:

Jibraeel (Gabriel) – brought the revelation from Allah to Prophet Muhammad and all other prophets.

Mikaeel (Michael) – is in charge of the weather.

Izraeel (Azrail) – also known as the “Angel of Death”, is responsible for ending our life.

Israfeel (Israfil) – will blow the trumpet at the time of the end of the world and on the Day of Judgement.

Angels are pure and created to serve Allah; part of this service is to help the true believers at times of need. They have been sent down to help during times of battles. They have put confidence, strength and resilience into the hearts of the believers and they have been instrumental in putting fear and doubt into the hearts of disbelievers. On a day to day basis they shield and protect the Believers from harm, Insha'Allah (Allah's Will) we should strive to achieve their friendship.

 

[Keltoi]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

The Bible eludes to the fact that angels might have wings, but it doesn't specifically state that to be the case, only that they "fly". As for where the images and paintings of angels with wings comes from, that is simply artistic expression and imagination.

According to Revelations, angels obviously do have free will, as Satan chose to disobey God and 1/3 of the others angels chose to do so as well. The difference is that unlike humans, angels cannot be forgiven or restored. I believe Peter mentions that angels "long to look into these things", meaning salvation and grace, which are not available to them.

 

[barney]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Thanks for the answers.

I know this might be hard to answer from scripture, as i cant find anything about it, but why would angels need wings?
If they are spirits, does their coming to earth mean they are physically transformed to material matter and so are affected by gravity? (hence they need wings to keep airborne), or are they just asthetic?

 

[barney]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Cheers Kelt.
They technically in a christian version then still have free will, and so, although they are nominally obaying God, they could technically just get sick of the eternity of servitude and start a rebellion? Is this a possibility from christian doctrine?

Is that always going to be the way? cos if so, when we are up in heaven having lost our free will there, we might get mugged by a bunch of independent thinking angels.

 

[------]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

:salamext:

Peace

1) Are they free willed?

Nope.

2)Do islamic angels have wings? Or are they like Djinns in form?

Angel are Angels. Jinns are Jinns. 2 completely different beings. And yes, Angels have wings.

 

['Abd al-Baari]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Greetings,

Here is some more information on Angels:-

The angels are by nature obedient to Allaah:

“[they, i.e., angels] disobey not, (from executing) the Commands they receive from Allaah, but do that which they are commanded [al-Tahreem 66:6 – interpretation of the meaning]

They are created in such a way that they do not eat or drink. Their food is tasbeeh (glorification of Allaah) and tahleel (saying Laa ilaaha ill-Allaah), as Allaah tells us concerning them (interpretation of the meaning):

“They (i.e. the angels) glorify His Praises night and day, (and) they never slacken (to do so) [al-Anbiyaa’ 21:20]

The angels bear witness to the Oneness of Allaah, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Allaah bears witness that Laa ilaaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), and the angels, and those having knowledge (also give this witness); (He always) maintains His creation in justice. Laa ilaaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), the All-Mighty, the All-Wise” [Aal ‘Imraan 3:18]

Allaah has honoured some of the angels by choosing them as Messengers, just as He has chosen some of mankind as Messengers:

“Allaah chooses Messengers from angels and from men” [al-Hajj 22:75 – interpretation of the meaning]

The angels have great powers given to them by Allaah, including the following:

The ability to take on different forms. Allah has given the angels the ability to take on forms other than their own. Allah sent Jibreel to Maryam (Mary) in the form of a man, as Allah says:
". . . Then We sent to her Our angel, and he appeared before her as a man in all respects." [Maryam 19:17]

Angels also came to Ibraaheem in human form, and he did not know that they were angels until they told him so. Similarly, angels came to Lut in the form of young men with beautiful faces. Jibreel used to come to the Prophet (Peace & Blessings of Allaah be upon Him) in different forms: sometimes he would appear in the form of Dihyah al-Kalbi, a Sahaabee who was very handsome, and sometimes in the form of a Bedouin. The Sahaabah saw him in his human form, as is reported from ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab in the two Saheehs. (‘Umar) said:
"One day while we were sitting with the Messenger of Allah (Peace & Blessings of Allaah be upon Him), there appeared before us a man whose clothes were exceedingly white and whose hair was exceedingly black; no signs of travel were to be seen on him, and none of us knew him. He walked up and sat down by the Prophet (Peace & Blessings of Allaah be upon Him). Resting his knees against his and placing his hands on his thighs, he said: ‘O Muhammad, tell me about Islam.’. . ." (Saheeh Muslim, no. 8).

Many other ahaadeeth refer to the angels taking human forms, such as the hadeeth about the one who killed a hundred, in which it says ". . . there came to them an angel in human form . . ." and the hadeeth about the blind man, the bald man and the leper.

Their speed
The greatest speed known to man today is the speed of light; the angels are able to travel much faster than this. Hardly had an enquirer completed a question to the Prophet (Peace & Blessings of Allaah be upon Him), but Jibreel would bring the answer from Allah.

And Allah Knows Best

Peace

 

[Keltoi]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Cheers Kelt.
They technically in a christian version then still have free will, and so, although they are nominally obaying God, they could technically just get sick of the eternity of servitude and start a rebellion? Is this a possibility from christian doctrine?

Is that always going to be the way? cos if so, when we are up in heaven having lost our free will there, we might get mugged by a bunch of independent thinking angels.

There is no indication that Heaven will even be available to angels, at least not in the "physical" sense...although I don't like thinking of Heaven in physical terms whatsoever. The available info on angels is so slight that most comments on the matter are derived from imagination, wishful thinking, and pointless speculation.

 

[barney]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Thanks again Kelt, I had been under the impression that the angels were already "up" in heaven and were a permnent fixture, as kind of observing and waiting for commands.

I have been reading far too much "in nomine" and looking at paintings.

With the lack of info, is it your beleif they are simply physically visible manifestations of his will?
If so why do they need names?

 

[------]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

:salamext:

With the lack of info, is it your beleif they are simply physically visible manifestations of his will?

Can u repeat that in basic english please?

 

[Ghira]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Thanks again Kelt, I had been under the impression that the angels were already "up" in heaven and were a permnent fixture, as kind of observing and waiting for commands.

I have been reading far too much "in nomine" and looking at paintings.

With the lack of info, is it your beleif they are simply physically visible manifestations of his will?
If so why do they need names?

Physical manifestation of God's will?? You ask some strange questions but I see where you are getting at. We believe everything is under the will and power of God. We always repeat that "there is no will or power except by what He permits." One of the basic tenants of faith is to believe in whatever God has willed the good and the bad. God has created both good and evil. That does not mean we don't try to change the evil, fight evil, and make good prevail. It just means that is what The All-Mighty willed by His wisdom and we have to plan accordingly. An Angel is a creation of God with unique capabilities that other creations don't have. We believe God does have certain attributes and names and He wants His creations to manifest those creations on earth. We don't mean that we become God, or part of God, or pantheism. It just means that we exemplify these attributes because God loves to see that in his creation. For example, there is a statement of Prophet (saw) that says "God is beautiful and loves beauty" in response to someone who thought dressing nicely was a sign of being boastful and filled with pride. We can beauty ourselves with certain limits, we can beauty our houses, have gardens, that is beauty and God loves to see that. Another example, well I can just say the best person to look at as the walking manifestation of God's attributes is to read about the Prophet of Islam Muhammad (saw). End by saying God's attributes are not like His creations it is just a glimpse a speck of what He possess. And some attributes creations are exempt from having. God posses the ultimate form of true mercy, forgiveness, peace. Those who show these good qualities are great people indeed.

 

[barney]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

:salamext:



Can u repeat that in basic english please?

Are they things we can see that are there by gods will. That they are not interacting with the world in a physical way, except being able to be seen.

 

[Keltoi]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Are they things we can see that are there by gods will. That they are not interacting with the world in a physical way, except being able to be seen.

That is a theory about angels that some theologians have brought up. That they are in fact simply manifestations of God's Will. However, that sort of contradicts some of the info included in the Bible relating to the interaction between God, angels, and human beings.

 

[barney]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Physical manifestation of God's will?? You ask some strange questions but I see where you are getting at. We believe everything is under the will and power of God. We always repeat that "there is no will or power except by what He permits." One of the basic tenants of faith is to believe in whatever God has willed the good and the bad. God has created both good and evil. That does not mean we don't try to change the evil, fight evil, and make good prevail. It just means that is what The All-Mighty willed by His wisdom and we have to plan accordingly. An Angel is a creation of God with unique capabilities that other creations don't have. We believe God does have certain attributes and names and He wants His creations to manifest those creations on earth. We don't mean that we become God, or part of God, or pantheism. It just means that we exemplify these attributes because God loves to see that in his creation. For example, there is a statement of Prophet (saw) that says "God is beautiful and loves beauty" in response to someone who thought dressing nicely was a sign of being boastful and filled with pride. We can beauty ourselves with certain limits, we can beauty our houses, have gardens, that is beauty and God loves to see that. Another example, well I can just say the best person to look at as the walking manifestation of God's attributes is to read about the Prophet of Islam Muhammad (saw). End by saying God's attributes are not like His creations it is just a glimpse a speck of what He possess. And some attributes creations are exempt from having. God posses the ultimate form of true mercy, forgiveness, peace. Those who show these good qualities are great people indeed.

So they are creations of God, they have unique attributes, but dont neccesserily exist in permenace?
Is Jibreal around at the moment as we type, or is he simply created as he is needed.
On interacting with the world, if he has no physical presence then he wouldnt need the wings. If he was a spirit only with permenace in heaven , that would indicate that he needed the wings for his heavenly existance. Hence Heaven has a type of oxygen or at least a gas that can be actuated by wing-use.
Or the wings are just to make them look cool?

 

[aadil77]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

angels and jinn are of the Unseen, since Jibrael appeared in the form of a man, then they must be physical creatures, but unseen to man and their presence is unknown to man,

and who knows their wings may not need the prsence of air particles to be able to move

God knows best

 

[Snowflake]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

So they are creations of God, they have unique attributes, but dont neccesserily exist in permenace?
Is Jibreal around at the moment as we type, or is he simply created as he is needed.
On interacting with the world, if he has no physical presence then he wouldnt need the wings. If he was a spirit only with permenace in heaven , that would indicate that he needed the wings for his heavenly existance. Hence Heaven has a type of oxygen or at least a gas that can be actuated by wing-use.
Or the wings are just to make them look cool?

Angels do exist in permanance and each are assigned different duties in the Heavens & Earth. Arch-angel Jibril is the chief of the angels and at present he is wherever Allah wills him to be.


The wings are a symbol of power or ability. Angels' abilities/powers vary according to the work entrusted to them. Some angels have two wings, some have three, others have four (4). And Allah says in Surah Fatir (35:1) that He can multiply His creation when He wills. I assume that the number of wings show that they are for the purpose of flying. Some, like Angel Jibril, have up to six hundred wings. If just one of his wings was spread open, it would cover what is between east and west.


Some angels are in a constant state of worship of Allah. Other's are responsible for safeguarding us against harm. If you're standing near a wall which is about to collapse an angel will not come and physically lift you out of harm's way. If a person is destined to be saved an angel will prompt him or convey a warning to move away. This is what we call instinct or intuition.

It is sufficient for a muslim to believe in angels. We do not dwell on their image. Nor, do we need to.

Peace.

 

[barney]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

Ok. Cheers.
So angels are always around, but not free willed, they all have jobs. Some are bosses and some get the mundane stuff.
Jibreal is the overall boss.(apart from Allah)
Their wings increase in power, but have no heavenly or earthly use, but can take up a hemisphere.
Some do nothing at all but praise allah, some help out on earth according to allahs will.

So if you hear a screech of brakes and leap out of the road, the unseen but physical beings flying in a real atmosphere but not using their wings, which may number in the hundreds , which are not there for asthetic's, will tell you that your in danger, and that may save you.

I'm getting it slowly I think.

 

[kirk]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

If God were all knowing and all powerful he wouldn’t need angels.

The religious belief in angels is one of the proofs there is no god.

-

 

[Malaikah]

Re: Angels: Free will or controlled?

If kirk thought outside the box he would realise that the existence of angels doesn't mean God can't do stuff Himself, just that He choose to have angels do those things, for what ever reason He Wills.

As for free will, it is my understanding that angels do have free will but they always choose to do good according to the vast majority of scholars. The proofs cited for this include the fact that they asked Allah question about He did certain things, and also because the angels have been praised by God, and if they did not have free will, then they would not deserve praise.

As for wings, I have never heard that they have no purpose other than too look good... Nor have I heard they are non-physical beings.