for the agnostic members...

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Gee! This post is about me!!!! :D
OK its not.
I call myself an agnostic because I don't subscribe to any one religion. I have a problem with believing that one is right and others are wrong sort of the "US and Them" syndrome that seems to cause a lot of problems in our world.
I have friends that are very religious and I feel that if it works for them great its just not for me. As for believing in God I guess I must believe to a certain point because a while ago a good Friend died of cancer and I found myself angry with God, how can you be angry with something that doesn't exist?
I guess my dilemma is that I'm Absolutely Positively not sure

Would you say your anger at God over loss of a friend was something that was a general characteristic of humans independent of culture, or did you pick God because you were raised in a culture that acknowledges His existance.
 
Would you say your anger at God over loss of a friend was something that was a general characteristic of humans independent of culture, or did you pick God because you were raised in a culture that acknowledges His existance.

I would say you are right on both counts, also in a case like that there was no one else to blame.
I since have gotten over the anger part but I still miss my friend.
Whenever I feel life is unfair I just turn on the news and realize that my life is pretty good.
 
Whenever I feel life is unfair I just turn on the news and realize that my life is pretty good.

That is good. We should always remember that.

I would also like to point out, and you may benefit from this (indeed we all can), is that it is a a very serious thing to be anger at good and accuse Him of things- we have not right to do that. God doesn't need us, we need Him, and we should always know that everything He does is done with wisdom and justice, and no blame Him and be angry at Him negates the acceptance that He is indeed Al-Mighty and full of Wisdom...

We don't have rights over God except for where He has given us those rights, we are the ones who are 100% dependent on God, not the other way around...

God isn't there to be blamed, rather we should turn to Him in our times of need for true support and comfort and be ever grateful to Him, especially in our times of ease...
 
I agree that blaming "God" is counter productive. Short term it may be good, as it may keep you from attacking/blaming innocent people, but long term it only gets in the way of real closure.
 
Gee! This post is about me!!!!
LOL, I notice that.
:D
OK its not.

Let's go with the previous statement because it humours me.

I call myself an agnostic because I don't subscribe to any one religion. I have a problem with believing that one is right and others are wrong sort of the "US and Them" syndrome that seems to cause a lot of problems in our world.

The problem is when one think it is my religion vs this religion. First one has to take the stance Allah(s.w.t) exist. From their one has to establish who is Allah (Monotheism) e.t.c and specifically what is not Allah.
We are all agreed that Allah is not his creation in anyway. That worship is solely due to him. You follow me?
This is the Fundemntal creed which one will should notice i.e. their is no god beside Allah.
Woshiping man as god, or idols as god, or stone as god tree as god e.t.c are all false and false woship, even if one argue's that this is soley to draw closer or nearer to Allah i.e. like a mediator.

Woship is only for Allah directly and one does not need a mediator to reach him.

I have friends that are very religious and I feel that if it works for them great its just not for me.
I am sorry for what happened to you freind, but to everyone the reutrn is to Allah(s.w.t). Their is nothing to be angry about. He giveth life and take's away. Everyone will go return to him.

As for believing in God I guess I must believe to a certain point because a while ago a good Friend died of cancer and I found myself angry with God, how can you be angry with something that doesn't exist?
I guess my dilemma is that I'm Absolutely Positively not sure

Maybe denying existance of God is not the way to go. It does not make change anything nor changes anything of his existance.

Tell me why do you or did you think/believe Allah(s.w.t) exist?
 
Pygoscelis,

What do you mean by 'real closure'?

Being able to move on with ones life and not looking back.

Blaming "God" only opens up a new can of worms, and once you've gotten over those new issues, you've still got the original one (you still haven't actually dealt with it, only passed it off on "God").
 
Let's go with the previous statement because it humours me.
Glad I can make you laugh

The problem is when one think it is my religion vs this religion. First one has to take the stance Allah(s.w.t) exist. From their one has to establish who is Allah (Monotheism) e.t.c and specifically what is not Allah.
We are all agreed that Allah is not his creation in anyway. That worship is solely due to him. You follow me?
This is the Fundemntal creed which one will should notice i.e. their is no god beside Allah.
Woshiping man as god, or idols as god, or stone as god tree as god e.t.c are all false and false woship, even if one argue's that this is soley to draw closer or nearer to Allah i.e. like a mediator.

Woship is only for Allah directly and one does not need a mediator to reach him.
If I were to say I was a Catholic,Jew or other religion I believe you would tell me that only Islam is the true religion.
Am I correct ?

I am sorry for what happened to you friend, but to everyone the reutrn is to Allah(s.w.t). Their is nothing to be angry about. He giveth life and take's away. Everyone will go return to him.
Perhaps my anger was misdirected. But in my sorrow I lashed out at nearest target I since have gotten over it.

Maybe denying existance of God is not the way to go. It does not make change anything nor changes anything of his existance.
In observing the world I have not seen any evidence that affirming the existence of God changes anything either

Tell me why do you or did you think/believe Allah(s.w.t) exist?
Sometime I want to believe that there is more than just existence then nothing but nothing I has seen or felt has given me the faith to truly believe God exists or that one way of worshop is the correct one

Blaming "God" only opens up a new can of worms, and once you've gotten over those new issues, you've still got the original one (you still haven't actually dealt with it, only passed it off on "God").
As I said Ive gotten over it
 
I think agnostics are closer to understanding God than most religious people.

It is said that the first step in learning and understanding something is to admit that you don't know anything.

As agnostics, we realize that God is far too complicated for our feeble human minds to comprehend with the insufficient information that we have. We know that we don't really understand what or who God is. Many religious people think they understand God, and what his nature is.

Knowing that one doesn't know anything, puts one further ahead than those that think they know something.
 
As agnostics, we realize that God is far too complicated for our feeble human minds to comprehend with the insufficient information that we have. We know that we don't really understand what or who God is. Many religious people think they understand God, and what his nature is.

That is not true of Muslims. It is a fundamental part of Islamic belief that we can never truly comprehend the nature of God.

That said- Muslims have a lot to go on because at least God describes himself a little bit in the Quran, whereas an agnostic has nothing at all to go by other than speculation.
 
That is not true of Muslims. It is a fundamental part of Islamic belief that we can never truly comprehend the nature of God.

That said- Muslims have a lot to go on because at least God describes himself a little bit in the Quran, whereas an agnostic has nothing at all to go by other than speculation.

From the point of view of someone that does not believe that the quran is the truth, or was given by God, this is only backs up what was already said. This falls under "people that 'think' they know.

BTW, I have heard christians say also that It is a fundamental part of christian belief that we can never truly comprehend the nature of God.
 
From the point of view of someone that does not believe that the quran is the truth, or was given by God, this is only backs up what was already said. This falls under "people that 'think' they know.

BTW, I have heard christians say also that It is a fundamental part of christian belief that we can never truly comprehend the nature of God.

According to islam...knowing Allah subhanahuwata'ala...is not 'a point of view'. If something that we have to learn and study.
 
Do you think you can get to know who God is from 'study'?

define 'know God'? i think both of our definitions are very different.

if you want to know briefly about Allah subhanahuwata'ala pls check out the thread Knowing Allah in the discover islam.

But if you really want to 'know' Allah subhanahuwata'ala... there is so much process of learning you have to do. In Islam we have alot of subjects to study which in arabic you call it 'ilm'.

check this link out
http://www.al-islam.org/al-tawhid/islam-know-conc.htm

There are ilm tawhid, fiqh, hadith and so much more.
you can check this out too...
http://al-islam.org/alpha.php?sid=637545293&cat=258&alpha_id=182&t=258
 
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Greetings and peace be with you Silent Observer

Do you think you can get to know who God is from 'study'?

I feel that you get to know God by doing something.

The things that you do help to prove to yourself and others that you have a faith in God. I believe that you can still have faith in God and be kind and compassionate to people of other faiths. God created all people and he is not the exclusive property of any one religion, even though we may give that impression at times.

Faith in God is a gradual journey always one day at a time, some days you may have grave doubts, and other times your actions will prove to yourself that your belief is certain.

In the spirit of searching for a kind and compassionate God,

Eric
 
So many people claim to know God. There are many discriptions of what he may look like. But........what if God is really a woman???
 
Gender is for procreation, I don’t think god does that. :uuh:

The reason the male gender is used is because, men created the image of god. :mad:
 
^^^lol.... hehe in islam, Allah has no gender.

Please read this...
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/tawheed/conceptofgod.html

It is a known fact that every language has one or more terms that are used in reference to God and sometimes to lesser deities. This is not the case with Allah. Allah is the personal name of the One true God. Nothing else can be called Allah. The term has no plural or gender. This shows its uniqueness when compared with the word god which can be made plural, gods, or feminine, goddess.


and this... http://www.al-islam.org/concept/
Commonly Asked Questions About "Allah"

Let us now try to answer a number of basic questions about the Almighty:

1. How can you describe Him?

Numerous verses of the Holy Qura'n point out to His existence. Consider the argument of His Friend Ibrahim (Abraham, as) who said: "My Lord is the One Who brings life and Who causes death" (Qura'n, 2:258), and the argument of Moses who said, "[He is] your Lord and the Lord of your fathers of old" (Qura'n, 26:26). Also consider these verses:
Our Lord is the One Who gave everything its creation, then He guided it (to its destination). (20:50)The Lord of the East and the West: there is no god but He; therefore, take Him for a protector. (73:9)

2. Can you define Him?

The Exalted One says that He defies definition: "... nothing at all is like Him" (Qura'n, 42:11).

3. Can one ask: "What is He?"

Pharaoh asked Moses, "And what is the Lord of the worlds?" (Qura'n, 26:23). Moses answered by saying that He is "Your Lord and the Lord of your fathers of old" (Qura'n, 26:26). There is no way to know Him by defining "what" He is; rather, one can get to know the proofs of His Existence, Might, Knowledge, Wisdom, Mercy and His being the Creator of everything. "Do not think about Allah," said Imam `Ali, "rather, think about what Allah has created, for thinking about Allah only increases one's bewilderment."

4. Is He one or more?

The Glorified One has required the Muslims to

Say: He, Allah, is One. (112:1)

And your God is One God! (2:163)

Had there been in them any gods besides Allah, they would both have certainly been in a state of disorder. (21:22)

5. Is He confined to any place?

The Holy Qura'n tells us that: He is the Supreme (watching) over His worshippers. (6:61) They revere their Lord High above them. (16:50) The Beneficent God is firmly established on the throne (of authority). (20:5)

"Above them" in 16:50 refers to the Almighty being above His servants in His Might, Power, Loftiness, not to being above them in place, space, area, elevation, or physical location; these do not apply to Him. The Messenger of Allah called upon His Lord during his ascension to heavens pleading to Him thus, "You are as You have praised Your own Self," and Prophet Younus (Jonah) son of Matti, while being in the bottom of the sea, called upon his Lord saying, "There is no god but You! Glory to You! Surely I have become one of those who commit injustice against their own souls!" (Qura'n, 21:87). The Messenger of Allah has said, "Do not exalt me over him [over Younus] in nearness to Allah just because I reached the High Throne while he was in the bottom of the sea, for the Adored One is above being confined to a space or a direction." He has also addressed Him saying, "You and he in the strata of the heavens;" the believers call upon Him saying, "You and them on earth." Had He been in a particular area or place, all these persons could not have differed from one another in His regard at any given time. He is above being confined to place or direction: "All those in the heavens and the earth glorify Allah" (Qura'n, 57:1).

6. When did He begin to exist?

The Praised One has said, He is the First and the Last, the Evident and the Immanent, and He has full knowledge of all things. (57:3) Everything is to perish except He. (28:88)

Anyone who asks when His existence came to be implies that there was a time when He did not exist, i.e. that void preceded Him. He is not "preceded" by anyone, nor is He "succeeded" by anyone. His continuation is above being tied to time. His existence is too holy to be dependent on time; such are characteristics of things or persons who come to be then perish, or of those whose being is possible in the future, but they do not apply to Him. Another verse which similarly describes His eternity and perpetuity is this one: "Everyone on earth will perish but will abide (forever) the Face of your Lord, full of Majesty, Bounty and Honour" (Qura'n, 55:26-27), and also this: "Blessed is He in Whose hands is the dominion" (Qura'n, 67:1). "Blessed," that is, tabaraka, is derived from baraka, blessing, which connotes constancy and lack of acceptance to change. His existence is everlasting, eternal, perpetual.

7. Over what does He rule?

The Almighty says, "Say: O Allah! Master of authority! You give authority to whomsoever You please and take it away from whomsoever You please" (Qura'n, 3:26). He, and only He, is the King of kings; He grants others authority: "Blessed is the One in Whose hand is the kingdom" (Qura'n, 67:1). Vanities and possessions owned by others will all disappear on the Day of Judgment: "Whose will be the dominion that Day? It is Allah's, the One, the Subduer (of all)" (Qura'n, 40:16).

8. What is [the extent of] His knowledge?

He has said, [He is] the One Who knows the unseen and the seen. (6:73) And with Him are the keys of the unseen treasures: none knows them except He. (6:59) Slumber does not overtake Him nor sleep. (2:255) And your Lord is not forgetful. (19:64) And you are not (engaged) in any affair, nor do you recite concerning it any portion of the Qura'n, nor do you do anything, except that We are witnesses over you when you enter into it. (10:61)

9. What is His speech?

The Most Glorified and Exalted has said, Were every tree on earth (made into) pens and the sea (to supply it with ink), with seven more seas to add thereto, the words of Allah would not have been exhausted; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise. (31:27) Say: Were the sea (turned into) ink for the (recording of the) words of my Lord, the sea would surely be consumed before the words of my Lord are exhausted though We were to bring the like of that (sea) to add thereto. (18:109)

10. How is He?

The Exalted One says, Allah's is the command before (now) and thereafter. (30:4) The day on which no soul shall control anything for (another) soul, and the command on that Day shall be entirely Allah's. (82:19)

11. Why is He the Praised One?

The Almighty has said that He is "... the Apparent and the Hidden" (Qura'n, 57:3), that is, His Existence, Might and Wisdom are all evident if one observes the indications thereto, yet His reality is obscured from all intellects.

12. What is His will?

The answer to this verse is provided by verses such as these: And you do not please except if Allah [so] pleases. (76:30) Allah chooses whomsoever He pleases especially for His mercy, and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace. (2:105) Allah grants His authority to whomsoever He pleases, and Allah cares for all, and He knows all things. (2:247) Allah sets on the right path whomsoever He pleases. (2:272) He it is Who shapes you in the wombs as He pleases. (3:6) If He pleases, He may take you off and make whomsoever He pleases successors after you. (6:133)

13. Why is He the all-Knowing, the Omnipotent?

He has responded to those who raised such a question by saying, He cannot be questioned concerning what He does while they shall be questioned. (21:23) All things are destined in the end to the One Who has facilitated their being what they are, the One Who cannot be explained; therefore, the attempt to analyze Him, His Attributes, and His actions, is simply impossible.

14. Does He have sons, daughters, parents, or any family members or relatives?!

The God of Islam and of all mankind has said, "Say: He, Allah, is One. Allah is He on Whom everyone [and everything] depends. He does not beget, nor is He begotten, and none is like Him" (Qura'n, 112:1-4).

15. Does He forgive?

He has said, "Inform My servants that I am the Forgiving, the Merciful" (Qura'n, 15:49).

16. What about His creation?

He has said, O man! What has beguiled you from your Lord, the Gracious One Who created you then made you complete, then He made you symmetrical? Into whatever form He pleased did He shape you. (82:6-8) Have they not considered that Allah, Who created the heavens and the earth and was not tired by their creation...? (46:33) This is Allah's creation, so show Me what those besides Him have created. (31:11)

17. Can He be seen?

He, the Most Exalted, the Most High, has told that When Moses came to the place appointed by Us, and his Lord addressed him, he said: "Lord! Show (Yourself) to me so that I may look upon You." Allah said: "By no means can you see Me; but look at the mountain; if it abides in its place, then shall you see Me." When his Lord manifested His glory to the mountain, He made it like dust, and Moses fell in a swoon. When he recovered his senses, he said: "Glory to You! To You do I turn in repentance, and I am the first to believe." (Qura'n, 7:143).

Sunnis, however, believe, as the reader will find out in a later part of this book, that the believers will be able on the Day of Judgment to see Allah. Shi`as disagree with them as you will read later in this book, Insha-Allah.

18. How does He command?

He has said, His command, when He intends anything, is only to say to it: Be, and it is. (36:82) When He decrees an affair, He only says to it: Be, and it is. (40:68) His creatures have always wondered about His Attributes, Praise and Glory to Him, so He provided them with the following verses wherein they can find the clear answer: And Allah's are the most Beautiful Names (Attributes), so call upon Him thereby. (7:180) Allah: there is no god but He; His are the very Best Names. (20:8) Say: Call upon Allah or upon al-Raman; whichever you call upon, He has the Great Names...(17:110).

He is Allah, besides Whom there is no other god; the King, the Holy, the One Who grants peace, the One Who gives security, the Guardian over all, the Mighty, the Supreme, the Possessor of greatness; Glory to Allah from what they set up (with Him). He is Allah the Creator, the Maker, the Fashioner; His are the most beautiful Attributes; whatever in the heavens and the earth declares His glory, and He is the Mighty, the Wise. (59:21-24)

[1] Ibn `Abbas was one of Prophet Muhammed's cousins: he was Abdullah ibn `Abbas ibn Abd al-Muattalib, of Banu Hashim, of Quraysh. Referred to as the Islamic nation's scribe, he was a highly respected sahabi whose hadith are classified by al-Bukhari and Muslim as "sahih" accurate, authentic. He was born in Mecca, and he kept the Messenger of Allah company and narrated his traditions. He fought on the side of Imam `Ali during the Battle of the Camel (which started on Friday, Jumada I 16, 36 A.H./November 10, 656 A.H.) against `Ayesha and her supporters, and also during the Battle of Siffin (which started in Thul-Hijjah 36 A.H./May 657 A.D.). During his later years, he became blind, so he retired to 'if where he died in 68 A.H./687 A.D. In both al-Bukhari's and Muslim's Sahih books, there are 1160 hadith transmitted through Ibn `Abbas alone.
 

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