Guru Nanak Dev Ji a Muslim....?

lol ok, so if you could explain my misunderstanding it would be of great help. The one on 'being united with God' which is the highest aim you wish to achieve. :)
 
Well I am sorry. Even if I do my best, I probably can't explain the concept of "light is merging into light" to you. It's mainly because of differences in our understanding.

The only other thing I can think of right now is how Heer felt about Ranjha. If you have heard story of Heer/Ranjha, you may have heard what Heer said about Ranjha in Waris Shah's story. She said,"Ranjha Ranjha kardi ni mai aapey Ranjha hoyi, hun aakho mainu dheedo Ranjha, Heer na aakhe koyi." I am pretty sure you can ask your parents if they grew up in Pakistan their understanding of this as well. But my understanding is that Heer having so much in love with Ranjha lost her own identity and completely emotionally merged into Ranjha.

So the same way, Bhagats' soul completely merges spiritually into God's spirit.

This is simply my attempt at explaining how I understand. It doesn't mean that this is exactly how it is...
 
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Yeah i heard about Heer Ranja alot, but i don't understand - does this mean that according to sikhis, the person merges into God? And if that is so - then what role does that person have when they do that?

Also, what does God actually do according to Sikhi beliefs?
 
Problem in understanding this concept could be because you think that when the person dies, s/he actually goes to the paradise. Instead, it's soul that goes in the world beyond, the body stays here in this world. So it's the soul that merges, not the person...
 
We believe the person goes to the grave, then they are raised back up with their bodies on the Day of Judgement and be questioned by Allaah, the deeds are weighed, the book of all our actions are shown, and then depending on that - the person will either enter the prison of the fire or the eternal home of paradise.

That's been the exact message of all the prophets of God. And introducing re-incarnation is simply influenced by philosophy. Especially in regard to the claim that God doesn't actually have a role in anything. Whereas we know that Allaah is the Lord of the Worlds, and He is the One who legislates the laws for mankind, since He knows best His creation. And He reveals the message to the best of people, and He is the Most Wise.
 
Fi_Sabilillah said:
We believe the person goes to the grave, then they are raised back up with their bodies on the Day of Judgement and be questioned by Allaah, the deeds are weighed, the book of all our actions are shown, and then depending on that - the person will either enter the prison of the fire or the eternal home of paradise.

That's been the exact message of all the prophets of God. And introducing re-incarnation is simply influenced by philosophy. Especially in regard to the claim that God doesn't actually have a role in anything. Whereas we know that Allaah is the Lord of the Worlds, and He is the One who legislates the laws for mankind, since He knows best His creation. And He reveals the message to the best of people, and He is the Most Wise.
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But what goes to the paradise or hell? Is it the soul or the body and soul together? and when is the day of judgment?
 
People ask you concerning the Hour, say: "The knowledge of it is with Allah only. What do you know? It may be that the Hour is near!" [Qur'an 33:63]


The body and soul enter paradise, both parties are placed into different bodies compared to this world.
 
Fi_Sabilillah said:
People ask you concerning the Hour, say: "The knowledge of it is with Allah only. What do you know? It may be that the Hour is near!" [Qur'an 33:63]


The body and soul enter paradise, both parties are placed into different bodies compared to this world.
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Is the body in paradise same kind of body as we have in this world or is it referring to some kind of spiritual body?
 
cali dude said:
Is the body in paradise same kind of body as we have in this world or is it referring to some kind of spiritual body?
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No, it will be a new physical body. :) Because this life is only temporary, like an exam hall. Those who pass will be rewarded in the true home of paradise, whereas those who failed the test will be punished in the fire, also physically because they chose disbelief over belief. We seek refuge in Allaah from falling into that.

So it's not strange that the life of the hereafter can also be physical, since the One who created us from nothing can easily bring us back to life once again. Our souls will be the same i think, but new bodies. And Allaah knows best.
 
Fi_Sabilillah said:
No, it will be a new physical body. :) Because this life is only temporary, like an exam hall. Those who pass will be rewarded in the true home of paradise, whereas those who failed the test purposelly will be punished in the fire, also physically because they chose disbelief over belief. We seek refuge in Allaah from falling into that.

So it's not strange that the life of the hereafter can also be physical, since the One who created us from nothing can easily bring us back to life once again. Our souls will be the same i think, but new bodies. And Allaah knows best.
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So you actually believe that there is another physical world somewhere? Is that physical world in this universe somewhere or out of this universe?
 
cali dude said:
So you actually believe that there is another physical world somewhere? Is that physical world in this universe somewhere or out of this universe?
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If God can create this world as a physical world, it's easy for Him to create another physical one. It is part of the unseen which will become apparent once death overtakes us. I don't know the answer to the second question, so Allaah knows best.
 
Fi_Sabilillah said:
If God can create this world as a physical world, it's easy for Him to create another physical one. It is part of the unseen which will become apparent once death overtakes us. I don't know the answer to the second question, so Allaah knows best.
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or maybe it's only spiritual world and exists among us but only souls without bodies can realize it...

If everything is physical, does Islam tell how the soul travels to the other world?
 
cali dude said:
or maybe it's only spiritual world and exists among us but only souls without bodies can realize it...

If everything is physical, does Islam tell how the soul travels to the other world?
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The angel of death takes it. If the person was a believer and did good, it will be a good angel - their soul will be removed like a drop of water slipping out of a jug, however if the person was a disbeliever and did evil - then a scary angels will come to rip their soul out of them.

We hope to die as believers, in a state that Allaah is pleased with us. ameen.
 
Fi_Sabilillah said:
The angel of death takes it. If the person was a believer and did good, it will be a good angel - their soul will be removed like a drop of water slipping out of a jug, however if the person was a disbeliever and did evil - then a scary angels will come to rip their soul out of them.

We hope to die as believers, in a state that Allaah is pleased with us. ameen.
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Are Angels physical or spiritual?
 
cali dude said:
When I say I have not seen a Khalsa, I mean in real life or on the Net, even on this site. I hope you understand whom I am talking about.

Also a Khalsa does not change the interpretation of Gurbani just to fit in with some people. You remember Ram Rai who changed Gurbani to please Aurangzeb? He was excommunicated and he was Har Rai Ji's son.

I understand that you feel the need to please people here because of your Khalistani views but do not ridicule Gurbani...
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1 - I get ya...

2 - I have not altered any Bani, find me the post that displays this. You interpretation is how you percieve it to be. Go to the Gurdwara with an open mind and ask them excatly what Bani says, and it's interpretation is. It appears you are segregating the verses of the Dhan Bhagats and those of the Gurus' . This is wrong, as there is no DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THEM!!

3 - And the last claim is ludicrious. If you go though my posts, you'll find I've not agreed to most things said on this forum, because they are not Gurmat or Sikhi, BUT that does not mean I should insult and mock it just because I can't fathom, or agree to dissagree.

On the last note, yes I am a Khalstani, just like millions of others. You'll understand the concept of "Raj Bina Nahin Dharam Chale Hain, Dharam Bina Sab Dalle Malle Hain" which literally means that sovereignty is a MUST in order for a religion to survive; otherwise religion perishes When your are graced with the Khande Bate Da Amrit. Please, do not delay any longer Basiakhi is upon us. Sacrafice your head for the Khalsa Quam and above all Akal Purakh.

Gur Fateh veer

Also your explanation on Sikhi to Fasbillah, has been YOUR own interpretaion on Sikhi and not Gurmat -Sikhi!
 
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This one is for Fi_S...

But it's obvious that they can't be physical. Otherwise, we would probably see them once in a while...
 
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cali dude said:
But it's obvious that they can't be physical. Otherwise, we would probably see them once in a while...
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Pain is real & physical, we don't see it but we feel it. The reason why i'm not giving you a clear answer is because i don't know [as i'm not knowledgable] anything from my scripture which states if they're physical or spiritual. Otherwise i can make up my own opinions too - but we need proof from the Authority before making up our own ideas into beliefs. :)
 
Fi_Sabilillah said:
Pain is real & physical, we don't see it but we feel it. The reason why i'm not giving you a clear answer is because i don't know [as i'm not knowledgable] anything from my scripture which states if they're physical or spiritual. Otherwise i can make up my own opinions too - but we need proof from the Authority before making up our own ideas into beliefs. :)
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If we don't understand it entirely, we shouldn't be talking about it. But the pain to soul could also be due to separation from God. Once it's united with God, it doesn't desire anything else. That's why the first important thing is to quiet down our mind and mind is the one that wanders around desiring stuff other than God, which causes the soul to suffer as it takes the soul away from God. You may have experience this as well. Pain isn't always physical. Some times, there is nothing wrong with us physically but something within us is bothering us. Even physical pain has to register in the brain. So you should also find out if there is a brain in the physical body we supposedly acquire once we we die.
 
We believe that the heart gets hardened it if it leaves the remembrance of Allaah. An example can be like rust on iron which keeps getting rusted unless it is polised. The remembrance of Allaah removes that rust, but if one doesn't remember Allaah - then by default the rust will keep coming back.

That is why things in our daily lives such as even placing a morsel of food in one's wifes mouth is a source of reward for the believer, and that is because they are doing the good to please Allaah. :)


The more a person sins - the heart gets a black dot on, the more a believer does good deeds in order to please Allaah - the heart gets a white mark on.
The more black stains the heart gets on, the more sins the person has done and therefore the person loses that innocence and pureness. However if they repent and do good - their heart will get that white once again.


The disbeliever and sinner may continue doing evil and the more evil they do, their heart may get sealed, locked etc. because they persisted in their evil. Their heart has become dark black, full of stains of evil. Yet still Allaah is willing to forgive them if they turn to Him before death overtakes them. However, the more dark stains they have - the more the person hates good and the more they incline to evil.


The good doer, believer however will get more stronger and more purer so long as they keep doing good to please their Creator, this will make them want to do more good deeds. Their heart will become as white as snow if they continue, and the more greater and beloved they will become in the sight of Allaah. Allaah loves them, and they love Him.


The good is ordained by Allaah and His Messenger.


For example:

Hadith - At-Tabaraanee collected it, and Albani authenticated it in Silsilatul-AHaadeethis-Saheehah (#432).

The Prophet (saaws) said: "The most beloved of Allah's servants to Allah are those with the best manners."
Hadith - Sahih Bukhari, Muslim, and Tirmidhi

... 'Abd Allah ibn 'Amr said, "The Prophet of Allah, upon him be peace, was never obscene or coarse. Rather, he used to tell us that the best among us were those with the best manners."




Allaah says in the Qur'an concerning the Messenger of Allaah:


(And verily, you [O Muhammad] are on an exalted (standard of) character.) [Qur'an 68:4]

​


"It has been mentioned to us that Sa`d bin Hisham asked `A'ishah about the character of the Messenger of Allah , so she replied: `Have you not read the Qur'an' Sa`d said: `Of course.' Then she said: `Verily, the character of the Messenger of Allah was the Qur'an.'''



`Abdur-Razzaq recorded similar to this and Imam Muslim recorded it in his Sahih on the authority of Qatadah in its full length. This means that he would act according to the commands and the prohibition in the Qur'an. His nature and character were patterned according to the Qur'an, and he abandoned his natural disposition (i.e., the carnal nature). So whatever the Qur'an commanded, he did it, and whatever it forbade, he avoided it. Along with this, Allah gave him the exalted character, which included the qualities of modesty, kindness, bravery, pardoning, gentleness and every other good characteristic. This is like that which has been confirmed in the Two Sahihs that Anas said, "I served the Messenger of Allah for ten years, and he never said a word of displeasure to me (Uff), nor did he ever say to me concerning something I had done: `Why did you do that' And he never said to me concerning something I had not done: `Why didn't you do this' He had the best character, and I never touched any silk or anything else that was softer than the palm of the Messenger of Allah . And I never smelled any musk or perfume that had a better fragrance than the sweat of the Messenger of Allah.''





Imam Al-Bukhari recorded that Al-Bara' said, "The Messenger of Allah had the most handsome face of all the people, and he had the best behavior of all of the people. And he was not tall, nor was he short.'' The Hadiths concerning this matter are numerous. Abu `Isa At-Tirmidhi has a complete book on this subject called Kitab Ash-Shama'il. Imam Ahmad recorded that `A'ishah said, "The Messenger of Allah never struck a servant of his with his hand, nor did he ever hit a woman. He never hit anything with his hand, except for when he was fighting Jihad in the cause of Allah. And he was never given the option between two things except that the most beloved of the two to him was the easiest of them, as long as it did not involve sin. If it did involve sin, then he stayed farther away from sin than any of the people. He would not avenge himself concerning anything that was done to him, except if the limits of Allah were transgressed. Then, in that case he would avenge for the sake of Allah.''






Peace. :)

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