Learn to speak southern Thai

:sl:

I have check the thread of Malay for beginners and I found that it is useful for the spelling of the roman script Malay. Well, Kedah Thai that we use to speak at home and village is a non-written language and we grab the skill by listening to elders speaking. The way of pronouncing the Thai words in here is based on bahasa Malaysia writing system.

Muslim who speak Thai have no medium like Buddhist friends. They have Wat or temple that teach Thai script to their people. Muslim only depends on listening the sound and speak Thai automatically. Malay is being emphasized as the medium of learning, while Thai is only used at home informally.

There is currently no effort to support the learning of Thai among Muslims, so we have to depend on Roman script to construct the sound. Government also do not see that Thai should be preserve among Muslim since we do not care much about our language and most of us can speak Malay well.

I only discover that Radio Malaysia Kedah or Kedah. Fm teach Thai in the radio at 9.30 pm local time every Tuesdays. The Thai taught in the radio is the formal one and it is standard used in Bangkok.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 
Place like Kodiang, we separate both of the words into single word... they will become Kou and diang... Kou means hill, and diang means red... the word which is identical to Malay is Kou or Kau... Diang is pronounced in Kedah Thai sound as [Dee-Urhng] or [DaEhng] in Thailand counterpart.
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I pronounce it "Kok-Diang"... a miserable mistake!!!:exhausted
 
malayloveislam said:
I only discover that Radio Malaysia Kedah or Kedah. Fm teach Thai in the radio at 9.30 pm local time every Tuesdays. The Thai taught in the radio is the formal one and it is standard used in Bangkok.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
Click to expand...

Hey.. I can listen to Kedah.fm .... it's 97.5 FM in Kulim.
 
:sl:

I feel that Kokdiang is more easy to pronounce... My friends from Thailand sometimes can't understand what am I mumbling when I mix the Malay pronunciation in Thai :blind:

Kau is almost identical to Bukit-bukau.

These are the words which were spelt the same in Roman script:

Kau [Gao] : nine
Kau [Gaw] : rice
Kau [khaO] : hill
Koh [kOhk] : island as in Kohk Mark [Penang Island]
Khau [khAu] : white

They are actually marked by intonation marks in Thai script, but it is difficult to differentiate them unless you speak them out with your Thai friends and hear them correct your pronunciation.

For me, as long you have the sound, whatever you write or utter is correct.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 
:sl:

Here is some useful phrases used in the villages

Kin Kau [GeeN GaO] : eat rice
Kin Nam [GeeN nAm] : drink water
Kin Nam Ron [Geen nAm rOhN] : drink coffee
Kin Nam Cha [Geen nAm tcHa] : drink tea

Sieo Pla [Si-uhr PlA] : buy fish
Sieo Phak [Si-uhr pHak] : buy vegetable
Sieo Sing Khong [Si-uhr Seeng KhOng] : buy things

Pai Nai : Where are you going? or Pergi mana?
Pai Talad : go to market
Pai Hong Rian [Pai HouNg Rie-yarn] : go to class
Pai Rong Rian : go to school
Pai Ab Nam : go to bath
Pai naksah [Pai Nark-Soh] : Go to musolla
Pai an jahama [Pai ArN Tcha-Ha-Mo] : go to read Muqoddam or Beginning
Surahs

Ta Na Ban : Village headman or Tok penghulu

Rian is a verb. It means study or learn. Hong means room. and Rong means a hall as in Balai Rong (a place where King meets his ministers and listening to complaints of his subjects), thus Rong Rian means study hall or school.

Jahama is probably coming from Persian, it is used by Muslim who speak Thai or Malay alike in the northern part of Kedah.

Ta have several meaning. In this term it is a title, equivalent with Malay Datuk or Tuk. Na means the front and Ban means village. We call the male elders with this respect title such as Ta Chan for Tuk Hassan or Ta Chein for Tuk Hussain.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 
:sl:

The word used by Budddhist for prayer is Wai Prahk...it means bowing to God. In Malay it means Sembah Tuhan Buddha, because Buddhist concept of God is not clear. Their God is represented by Buddha. Thai in Thailand bowing to people saying Sawaddeekrab with Wai or Sembah (the act of joining your hands like Indian had done in Namaste).

I think Sembahyang also may have the same meaning with Wai Prahk. Hyang is an old Malay word for the world in the heaven or sky. Check the word Kayangan or Kahiyangan. It is the world of fairies in Malay mythologies. I personally think that as long as the connotation of the word is correct, it is not wrong to use traditional word.

For the place of worship, Buddhist Thai pray at a place called Wat. It means Buddhist temple. Muslim Thai pray at Masjid and Naksah or Musolla.
 
malayloveislam said:
:sl:

Here is some useful phrases used in the villages

Kin Kau [GeeN GaO] : eat rice
Kin Nam [GeeN nAm] : drink water
Kin Nam Ron [Geen nAm rOhN] : drink coffee
Kin Nam Cha [Geen nAm tcHa] : drink tea

Sieo Pla [Si-uhr PlA] : buy fish
Sieo Phak [Si-uhr pHak] : buy vegetable
Sieo Sing Khong [Si-uhr Seeng KhOng] : buy things

Pai Nai : Where are you going? or Pergi mana?
Pai Talad : go to market
Pai Hong Rian [Pai HouNg Rie-yarn] : go to class
Pai Rong Rian : go to school
Pai Ab Nam : go to bath
Pai naksah [Pai Nark-Soh] : Go to musolla
Pai an jahama [Pai ArN Tcha-Ha-Mo] : go to read Muqoddam or Beginning
Surahs

Ta Na Ban : Village headman or Tok penghulu

Rian is a verb. It means study or learn. Hong means room. and Rong means a hall as in Balai Rong (a place where King meets his ministers and listening to complaints of his subjects), thus Rong Rian means study hall or school.

Jahama is probably coming from Persian, it is used by Muslim who speak Thai or Malay alike in the northern part of Kedah.

Ta have several meaning. In this term it is a title, equivalent with Malay Datuk or Tuk. Na means the front and Ban means village. We call the male elders with this respect title such as Ta Chan for Tuk Hassan or Ta Chein for Tuk Hussain.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
Click to expand...

I've heard some Kedahans calling "Musolla" as "Naksah"...

In Penang, "Jahama" is known as "Juhama"
 
What's the difference between Thai, Lao, Khmer and Vietnamese?

I've heard Vietnamese, and it sounds like a "funny" version of Thai, especially the intonation is too "funny"...

And the Cambodians living in Kulim, speak Malay language just like the Thais...
 
north_malaysian said:
But, is it the right pronounciation?:-[



Koh Mark? ISland of Mark? Why Penang is known as "Island of Mark"?:?
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Kokdiang is the local pronunciation... it is still correct but Thai in Songkhla up to Bangkok can't understand it... it is like a slang, dont worry.

Koh Mark simply means Pulau Pinang (Island of the Betel Nut) :D

Kedah is known as Muang Sai, it was the name of Kedah while under Siamese rule around 18th century. The full name of Kedah is Monthon Saiburi, consists of Setul with the islands around, Kedah today, Pulau Pinang and Perlis if I am not mistaken. Songkhla was once under Kedah but it became a separate province after 19th century.


Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 
north_malaysian said:
What's the difference between Thai, Lao, Khmer and Vietnamese?

I've heard Vietnamese, and it sounds like a "funny" version of Thai, especially the intonation is too "funny"...

And the Cambodians living in Kulim, speak Malay language just like the Thais...
Click to expand...

Thai in Thailand down to northern Malaysia is categorized under Thai Kadai sub-group. As a fact Thai people migrated south from Yunnan province in China around 12th century. They established kingdoms such as Sukhothai in Thailand, Lanna Thai in Chiang Mai, Lao Thai Kingdom in Laos. Laos too is under Thai sub-group language. Lao people can speak and read Thai but Thai people hardly understand them.

For Vietnamese, I am not sure... I have heard about Thai Dam people in Vietnam. They speaks in a language which is close to Thai but with variation.

Khmer is under Proto-Malay sub-group language or Austroasiatic group. The related language with Khmer are Mon in southern Myanmar and the Orang Asli languages (native)such as Senoi in Malaysian peninsula. Khmer is a highly civilized language, Thai in Thailand absorbed many ancient Khmer words into their vocabulary. Their script also was modified as Thai script by Ramthibodi of Sukhothai kingdom in 12th century. I believe that Kedahan-Malay are from Khmer stock since Langkasuka is under Funan Kingdom in ancient era. In 13th century these kind of people are known as Siam asli or the native of Siam Empire, different from Thai who are known as Siamese.

Malay in Indonesia is categorized under Austronesian language or Deutro-Malay stock. Same goes to Javanese and other languages of Indonesia. Malay from Palembang was recorded attacking Langkasuka Kingdom in Kedah and Patani around 7th century. That makes Austronesian Malay expanded its wings in the Malayan Peninsula. History may sometimes make us dizzy +o(

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 
malayloveislam said:
Kokdiang is the local pronunciation... it is still correct but Thai in Songkhla up to Bangkok can't understand it... it is like a slang, dont worry.
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Ah...good.:)

malayloveislam said:
Koh Mark simply means Pulau Pinang (Island of the Betel Nut) :D
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Oh... "Mark" means "Betel Nut"... I thought the island was named after an Englishman....:exhausted

Is it true that the name "Perlis" originated from Thai language - "Phrau Loi"?
 
north_malaysian said:
Ah...good.:)



Oh... "Mark" means "Betel Nut"... I thought the island was named after an Englishman....:exhausted

Is it true that the name "Perlis" originated from Thai language - "Phrau Loi"?
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Hahahahah..... Mark means Pinang or Betel nut, yes... the same as Farang Mark [lit:French betel nut] means chewing gum.

I think so, many stories about the name of Perlis... one of them is that Phrau Loy... the floating coconut.

In local slang of Kedah Thai and Kedah Malay, Loy means going out without bringing or getting anything like an idiom.

e.g Mun orq Loy thuon
He goes out without bringing anything or unsatisfied
Dia kluaq loy saja
Dia keluar begitu sahaja
 
north_malaysian said:
Why the Malays hate the Thais so much? :?
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In 7th century, Sriwijaya Kingdom is a Buddhist Maritime Kingdom while Langkasuka Kingdom is a Hindu Kingdom. There are muslim subjects in Langkasuka Kindom eventhough the king is not a muslim starting 8th century AD.

In history, it is not because the Malay hate the Thai they attacked the Langkasuka Kingdom. It is because they want to conquer the business area. Langkasuka Kingdom in Kedah and Patani is not a Thai Kingdom. It is believed that the kingdom is a Khmer branch kingdom, means they are still Malay but the Proto one or the native of Malay Land.

After Sriwijaya attacked the Langkasukan, they established an administration center in the Malay Land. So, two administrations center were held. One in Palembang and one in Malay Land, maybe in Patani.

Around 11the century, the kingdom of Langkasuka facing its doom era, when Rajendra Cholawarman a Tamil King from India attacked the kingdoms in the coastal areas around the Malacca Straits. Cholawarman feels uneasy with the tax and business control by Sriwijayan empire. The event was carved in a plague which is now kept in a temple in Tajavur (Tanjore).

Thai just arrived in the south east asian mainland in 12th century. They were pressed to migrate south by the Han (chinese). They sometimes raging war with the natives of Thailand and Malay Land and sometimes live together. The native of Malay Land are the Proto-Malay stocks while the natives of Thailand are the Khmer tribe and the Mon tribe. Both are still proto-Malay stocks.

In 13th century, Thai established an empire called the Siam Empire. The dynasty that established the Empire is known as Sri Ayuttaya. While the previous Thai Sukhothai dynasty's power ceased to northern part, which is in Chiang Rai. Thai power under Sri Ayuttaya extends from Siem Riep in Cambodia until Singapore or Temasik and the islands near it.

This is some brief history of Thailand and northern Malay. Their history are co-joined and that makes the things blurry and confusing. Northern Malays history is not as easy as the history of Malaccan :phew
 
In 18th century many Thai from Saturn (Setul), Songkhla, and Nakorn Si Thammarat (Ligor) migrates south to Kedah for better life. Most of them are buddhists, but in late 19th many of them become Muslim when married to the locals or through their contact with the locals.

Some of them were bandits, they were called by locals in Kedah as Kawaq (thief of the cows and buffalos) and Siam Perut Hijau (Thai with green stomach). They are previously buddhists but some become muslims, but the religious comprehension is not deeply rooted in their selves. Maybe this is why Malays hate Thai :exhausted

Muslim Thai also exist at that time until now. They live their life the same way as other Malays or locals had. You still can find this religious people in Pendang, but they will not feel comfortable to be called Siam (Thai). For me, I feel it is better to be known as Kedahan who speaks Thai beside Malay as mother tongue. In Thailand, they call themselves Thai according to their nationality while in Malaysia they call themselves Malay. It is just the national identity. Not tribal like in Indonesia.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 
malayloveislam said:
In local slang of Kedah Thai and Kedah Malay, Loy means going out without bringing or getting anything like an idiom.

e.g Mun orq Loy thuon
He goes out without bringing anything or unsatisfied
Dia kluaq loy saja
Dia keluar begitu sahaja
Click to expand...

We Penangites use the term "Loy" too..

"Dea mai loy saja" (He came without bringing anything)
 
malayloveislam said:
This is some brief history of Thailand and northern Malay. Their history are co-joined and that makes the things blurry and confusing. Northern Malays history is not as easy as the history of Malaccan :phew
Click to expand...

Yeah... we dont have any mousedeer kicking dogs history...:exhausted
 
malayloveislam said:
Some of them were bandits, they were called by locals in Kedah as Kawaq (thief of the cows and buffalos) and Siam Perut Hijau (Thai with green stomach).
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I've heard my classmate (a Penangite) calling another classmate (a Kedahan) "Siam Perut Hijau"...

For God's sake.. I dont know what the heck it is.... and now.. I know that it's racists.
 
north_malaysian said:
I've heard my classmate (a Penangite) calling another classmate (a Kedahan) "Siam Perut Hijau"...

For God's sake.. I dont know what the heck it is.... and now.. I know that it's racists.
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Gosh, that sounds harsh, not all Kedahan with Thai ancestry are bad. My father told me a story related to this idiom "Siam Perut Hijau". My father is a local Kedahan from Kokdiang but with Indian ancestry.

One day at nat [nut] or a morning market, there is an event in the 60s where a Siamese guy [Thai] snatching a local merchant's money and run unstopably. Unfortunately that guy was catched and beaten by the villagers near the nat area. That guy finally swallow the money and that is how the idiom "Siam Perut Hijau" starts. It means the Thai is stubborn.

This is why we feel ashame to speak in Thai in the public, because others may misunderstood us as the people without manner. To the extend where one of my friend from Kampung Asun in Jitra ridicule his own ancestry and I have to convince him that we are all muslim, have nothing to be ashame of :cry:

One of my friend who speak in Kedahan Thai is very religious. He is from Pendang, I can see that his manner's good when talking to others. Well, my mother too speak Thai and almost all of her neighbors in the village speak in Thai beside Kedahan-Malay.

Love to brothers and sisters in faith
 

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