Many Christians are Converting to Islam

[Ramadhan]

I just don't see how it has more to offer than Christianity.

There are plenty more that Islam offer than christianity does.

For one thing, we don't worship creation.

 

[Burninglight]

Why are you twisting my words?
For what purpose?

If you claim to have the truth, you don't need to twist anyone else's words.

I didn't twist your words I ask you a question for clarification. If you are speaking truth, you would see I didn't twist your words but asked is that what you are saying. Read and see the question mark after my comment and look to see what you said that cause me to ask the question.

Now, I have given you contemporary examples about child abusing christians priests who are regarded by christians as Jesus' representatives.

What examples have you given of true Christians that really know the Lord Jesus as their Lord and Savior. You have mentioned nominal Christians. That means Christians that are in name only or wolves dress in sheeps clothing. You will not find a true adherhent of Jesus' teachings commit terrorist acts. In the Bible, Jesus teaches love your enemies. What does Muhammad say about your enemies or the infidel?

So you CLEARLY and EXPLICITLY judge the truth from the action of people who claim to follow the truth.

I clearly judge truth by peoples actions? No, I judge the actions not the truth. Jesus said a good tree produces good fruit and a bad tree brings bad fruit. A tree is known by it's fruit. A good tree cannot bring bad fruit nor can a bad tree bring good fruit. Religion is not a good thing to me, because I believe it nailed Jesus to the cross. A person's religion is what they do. To be a true Biblical Christian one must have relationship with God not religion. Religion is dangerous in my opinion, and it has been the result of more blood shed in all the world wars combined.

Now you keep quoting something I said when I tried to clarify what I meant several times. You don't mention my clarification. I didn't say most Muslims are terrorist. I said that I cannot deny that most terrorist in my worldview have been Muslims, but what is 100 Muslims out of 2 billion. It is almost insignificant, but you are trying to make a mole hill into a mountain and that bothers me. But I cannot help but think that the 100 Muslims terrorist I read and heard about through my life time were trying to follow in Islam as one of the elect by giving their lives for Allah. What are they understanding from Islam that can cause them to think they had no other recourse like maybe pray to God instead of taking matter into their own hands. Yes, things like that made me doubt Islam for myself over Christianity.

You said my quote is what I believe in even after I said I may have been brainwashed by the media. My quote is not what I believe in. I don't believe in my quotes. I believe in Jesus' quotes.

 

[Burninglight]

You keep contradicting your own beliefs and truth.

You kept saying that the truth can be judged by their followers, and you belief that Islam is not the truth because you believe that there are now muslim terorrists

I said no such thing. You are making inferences of what I said, meant and believe. Let me explain, it is what is true of ones actions as they practice their faith that is the fruit of what they follow, and that can be use to make a judgment regardless what religion one tries to follow. The religion in this case is the tree. The fruit determines whether the tree is good or bad.

I am turning the table on you: there are christians terorrists and there are christians killers and you asked for contemporary examples.

I gave you christian priests child abusers, are they not contemporary enough for you?

If there are Christian terrorist, they are not following the teaching of Jesus that says to love your enemies. IOW, they are not doing it as a result of trying to obey Scriptures or practice their faith; they do it in spite of it. And the same with Catholic priest that are pedophiles; you will find them in every religion but they don't do that because there religion teaches them that; they do it because they are depraved and given to lust and sin. And those types of sins have no place in Christianity or Islam!

You keep throwing out false statements without evidence about Islam, and when we refuted with evidence, your only reply is: "I don't clealry see what Islam does"

What false statments?

and when we gave you statements WITH evidence about christianity, such as contradictions in bible, evidence of christian terrorists, child abusers, your response is: "Only God clealry sees and knows".

Contradictions you speak of doesn't prove wholesale corruption of the Scriptures. Muhammad never said they were corrupted. I have explained to you about child abuse. You will find that everywhere and in all religions, but people don't do that because they think it pleases God or Allah! It makes a difference, if you didn't know

 

[Ramadhan]

I didn't twist your words I ask you a question for clarification. If you are speaking truth, you would see I didn't twist your words but asked is that what you are saying. Read and see the question mark after my comment and look to see what you said that cause me to ask the question.

You should read what I wrote. Did I ever say that muslim terrorists represent what is contained in Islam and commanded by God (swt) through Islam.
You yourselves are insinuating that.

Please do not twist my own words.

What examples have you given of true Christians that really know the Lord Jesus as their Lord and Savior. You have mentioned nominal Christians. That means Christians that are in name only or wolves dress in sheeps clothing. You will not find a true adherhent of Jesus' teachings commit terrorist acts. In the Bible, Jesus teaches love your enemies. What does Muhammad say about your enemies or the infidel?

Ok, so according to you, every single christian who commit evil and perform crimes are not true christians?
So these millions christians are christians in name only?

So these christians organizations in the USA who supported evil acts of christians in places such as sulawesi tengah, Sudan, maluku, etc are not real christians?

can you tell me an example of one single true christian?

because I cannot find any single christian who would be willingly to offer their left cheek.

does a "true christian" even exist?

God (swt) through His prophets (pbut) taught us to be just with our enemies, that we must not transgress, and that forgiveness is much more honorable.

I clearly judge truth by peoples actions? No, I judge the actions not the truth.

That's not what you said. Let me copy paste again what you wrote:

Now I know that not all Muslims are terrorist, but I couldn't deny that most terrorist in my life time have been Muslims and that bothered me especially when I think about what Jesus said, "Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them" Verses like that would repell me from considering Islam over Christianity.

You do not want to even consider that Islam may be the truth just because the actions of people who claim they are muslims.

Jesus said a good tree produces good fruit and a bad tree brings bad fruit. A tree is known by it's fruit. A good tree cannot bring bad fruit nor can a bad tree bring good fruit.

I have shown you that people whom christians consider as God and Jesus' representatives are child abusers.
They are the fruit. so according to your own belief, christianity must be bad tree, because it produced bad fruits.

I am only giving you your own medicine and applying your own principles to what you believe in.

To be a true Biblical Christian one must have relationship with God not religion.

Can you give me who/what is true biblical christians?
So catholics, orthodox, baptist, protestants, etc are not true biblical christians?

Now you keep quoting something I said when I tried to clarify what I meant several times. You don't mention my clarification. I didn't say most Muslims are terrorist. I said that I cannot deny that most terrorist in my worldview have been Muslims, but what is 100 Muslims out of 2 billion. It is almost insignificant, but you are trying to make a mole hill into a mountain and that bothers me.

It's your won statement.
You did not ask for clarification. If you did, you would have asked questions, but that's not what you did. And if you were truly asking for clarification, you would have opened a thread in the clarification about Islam by now.
You clealry said that you do not even consider that Islam is the truth because the actions of a few people who claimed they were muslims.
Please do not twist this around.

But I cannot help but think that the 100 Muslims terrorist I read and heard about through my life time were trying to follow in Islam as one of the elect by giving their lives for Allah. What are they understanding in Islam that can cause them to think they had no other recourse like pray to God instead of taking matter into their own hands. Yes, things like that made me doubt Islam for myself over Christianity.

You claim you do not judge the truth, and only the actions.
and yet again and again, you judge Islam by the actions of few people whom media reported as blowing up buildings and killing innocents as muslims.
You have no evidence at all that those muslims did those things in the name of Allah or that the perpetrators were even muslims.

I don't know how you "true biblical christians" behave, but in Islam, we must believe/do based on evidence, lest we wrongly accuse and punish innocent people.

And yet you objected when I was giving you examples how christians performed unspeakable crimes in the name of jesus.

Here's how George Bush killed a million innocent people in Iraq and Afghanistan because Jesus told him so:

"President Bush said to all of us: 'I am driven with a mission from God'. God would tell me, 'George go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan'. And I did. And then God would tell me 'George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq'. And I did."
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/special/wariniraq.htmlhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/oct/07/iraq.usa

 

[Ramadhan]

Burninglight Can you please respond to my questions in the other threads?

 

[Ramadhan]

It is what is the truth of ones actions that is the fruit of what they follow and that can be use to make a judgment regardless what religion one tries to follow. The religion in this case is the tree. The fruit determines whether the tree is good or bad.

So based on this, you agree that christiniaty is a bad tree, agree?

If there are Christian terrorist they are not following the teaching of Jesus that says to love your enemies. IOW, they are not dong it as a result of trying to obey Scriptures. And the same with Catholic priest that are pedophiles; you will find them in every religion but they don't do that because there religion teaches them that they do it because they are depraved and given to lust and sin. And those types of sins have no place in Christianity or Islam!

So we agree that we cannot judge a religion based on individual actions, am I right?
Then why did you say that the actions of media-reported terrorism repel you from even considering that Islam may be the truth?

What false statments?

This is among false statements about Islam that you spew here
(by the way, what Islam-hating sites have you been reading lately?)

Contradictions you speak of doesn't prove wholesale corruption of the Scriptures that Muhmmad never said were corrupted.

Narrated Ubaidullah: "Ibn 'Abbas said, 'Why do you ask the people of the scripture about anything while your Book (Quran) which has been revealed to Allah's Apostle is newer and the latest? You read it pure, undistorted and unchanged, and Allah has told you that the people of the scripture (Jews and Christians) changed their scripture and distorted it, and wrote the scripture with their own hands and said, 'It is from Allah,' to sell it for a little gain. Does not the knowledge which has come to you prevent you from asking them about anything? No, by Allah, we have never seen any man from them asking you regarding what has been revealed to you!' (Translation of Sahih Bukhari, Holding Fast to the Qur'an and Sunnah, Volume 9, Book 92, Number 461)"

You keep quoting false statements from anti-Islam sites without verifying it first.

And do not tell me that you are seeking clarification, because you have been saying the above statements several times and no asking if it were true.

I wonder if "true biblical christian" is allowed to speak without proof and give false claim?

good tree or bad tree?

 

[Burninglight]

There are plenty more that Islam offer than christianity does.

For one thing, we don't worship creation.

I am about to go night night. But let me speak to this. You have brought one thing here that does not conflict with my beliefs. To worship God's creations is a sin! True Biblical Christians don't do that. You won't find any. Show in the Bible where Christians have done that or where it is taught in the Bible to worship God's creation. We worship God alone. He is good. He alone created us and the world and all that is in it. IO only worship my Creator NO ONE ELSE!
Good night over and out

 

[Ramadhan]

I am about to go night night. But let me speak to this. You have brought one thing here that does not conflict with my beliefs. To worship God's creations is a sin! True Biblical Christians don't do that. You won't find any. Show in the Bible where Christians have done that or where it is taught in the Bible to worship God's creation.

If you follow Jesus' teaching then you will not worship creation, but if you follow paul's teaching you are worshipping creation.

And please have some courtesy and respond to my points in the above posts.

 

[Burninglight]

So based on this, you agree that christiniaty is a bad tree, agree?

No

So we agree that we cannot judge a religion based on individual actions, am I right?
Then why did you say that the actions of media-reported terrorism repel you from even considering that Islam may be the truth?

Yes and no it depends. I gave a thorough explaination on the conditions. About the repel thing, I said that because I was getting a baised view from the media, but I coupled that with what my experience and worldview had been, but if it were just for that, now it wouldn't repel me from Islam. I also didn't word that comment well. So my education on the forum has helped me see differently, and teach others not to judge Islam by the media or hate sites!
My biggest obstacle is not terror issues; that was the past. It is now theology differences!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Who Am I?]

Powerful testimony. I guess you can understand me except I am not extreme as you were, but I do find testimonies like yours interesting, because I am trying to understand what you see and others like you that I don't about Islam. I just don't see how it has more to offer than Christianity. I denfintely don't hate Muslims. I can say I never did; thank God for that.

I don't know if I can really explain what it is about Islam that I like over Christianity, but I can try.

For me, the beauty of Islam is in its simplicity. There is a direct connection between me and God, something I never really felt when I was a Christian. I have always prayed directly to God, and never invoked the name of Jesus even when I prayed as a Christian. Some of my Christian friends never understood this, but all I could tell them was that it felt right to pray this way.

Islam makes me want to become a better man. I feel more at peace with myself now than I ever have before. For a long time I hated who I was, and nothing I did or said could change that. I felt lost, alone, confused... and I never thought I could find my way out. I realized that I couldn't keep living my life the way I was living it, and I knew that changes had to be made.

This search for the truth is what led me to Islam. A lot of what I read made sense, and overturned my previous convictions about Islam.

 

[Burninglight]

I don't know if I can really explain what it is about Islam that I like over Christianity, but I can try.

For me, the beauty of Islam is in its simplicity. There is a direct connection between me and God, something I never really felt when I was a Christian. I have always prayed directly to God, and never invoked the name of Jesus even when I prayed as a Christian. Some of my Christian friends never understood this, but all I could tell them was that it felt right to pray this way.

Islam makes me want to become a better man. I feel more at peace with myself now than I ever have before. For a long time I hated who I was, and nothing I did or said could change that. I felt lost, alone, confused... and I never thought I could find my way out. I realized that I couldn't keep living my life the way I was living it, and I knew that changes had to be made.

This search for the truth is what led me to Islam. A lot of what I read made sense, and overturned my previous convictions about Islam.

You, IMO, do more to promote Islam to me than my being drilled about what I once felt and believed about Islam. Your testimony is interesting. But I have a peace as a Christian too and I don't have praying problem accept not doing it enough. Sometimes, I struggle with my feelings, but I try not to be led by them. I think they make a good servant but a poor leader if you know what i mean. It is written that the just shall live by faith

 

[Who Am I?]

You, IMO, do more to promote Islam to me than my being drilled about what I once felt and believed about Islam. Your testimony is interesting. But I have a peace as a Christian too and I don't have praying problem accept not doing it enough. Sometimes, I struggle with my feelings, but I try not to be led by them. I think they make a good servant but a poor leader if you know what i mean. It is written that the just shall live by faith

Well it is not for me to say that this faith is right or that faith is wrong. That is only for Allah to decide. For me, Islam is right, and so that is the path that I follow.

I know what you mean about not being a leader though. I am learning that sometimes I have to be a leader, emotionally, spiritually, etc, and it's not something I am used to doing. I've become too accustomed to this selfish and lazy society in which we live. For too long I did things my own way, and I was content to let the world pass me by so long as it left me alone.

Eventually I realized that I can't stay on the fringe forever. At some point, I have to man up and get in the game. I have to learn how to become the right kind of man. These are not easy lessons to learn, and I struggle with this every single day.

 

[Burninglight]

Well it is not for me to say that this faith is right or that faith is wrong. That is only for Allah to decide. For me, Islam is right, and so that is the path that I follow.

I know what you mean about not being a leader though. I am learning that sometimes I have to be a leader, emotionally, spiritually, etc, and it's not something I am used to doing. I've become too accustomed to this selfish and lazy society in which we live. For too long I did things my own way, and I was content to let the world pass me by so long as it left me alone.

Eventually I realized that I can't stay on the fringe forever. At some point, I have to man up and get in the game. I have to learn how to become the right kind of man. These are not easy lessons to learn, and I struggle with this every single day.

I really believe that Muslims and Christians go through similar struggles in life. We are all fighting a tough battle so it pays to have love and understanding. My heart goes out to you. We do share all the same OT prophets and the most important NT ones. So we both love Jesus in our own way.

I can only pray that God delivers me out of any deception, because I am just as convinced of my path as you are of yours maybe more. Many Christians are converting and I purposely don't use the word revert, but this Christian doesn't understand why a Christian would forsake the teaching in the Bible. I can see them leaving certain demoninations or the Catholic Church but why leave Christ as the only hope of our salvation?

I like your name."Who am I?"

 

[MustafaMc]

this Christian doesn't understand why a Christian would forsake the teaching in the Bible. I can see them leaving certain demoninations or the Catholic Church but why leave Christ as the only hope of our salvation?

I get this question all of the time. This morning I actually sent a lengthy response to this question in a FaceBook message from a high school classmate I haven't seen in 33 years.

 

[Burninglight]

I get this question all of the time. This morning I actually sent a lengthy response to this question in a FaceBook message from a high school classmate I haven't seen in 33 years.

I am all ears

 

[MustafaMc]

I am all ears

It is impossible for one who had converted from Christianity to prove that he was ever a 'real' Christian. I know this woman to be a devout Christian who I knew in high school and I chose to share my religious journey with her. I choose not to do so here.

 

[Burninglight]

okay, that's fine

 

[Scimitar]

No it's not... I wanna know... (ok call me nosey)

Scimi

 

[Burninglight]

No it's not... I wanna know... (ok call me nosey)

Scimi

Me too. I am nosey; if we start a petition he might comply

 

[Scimitar]

We can always bring in ED209 ...

"Please put down your weapon, you now have 20 seconds to comply... you are in direct violation of penal code 113 section 9" looool

hehe... sorry couldn't resist

Scimi