Mujahideen Literally Walk Over Mines To Save People - Bravery!

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we could take this logic further and say the whole of america, russia, israel etc. are evil because they re-instated proven child-killers and murderers into power like bush and putin.

you should really be concetrating on these evil nations first :rollseyes

This thread is not about any of those. Start another thread so we can bash those too.

Once you go through what I have been through meaning losing family and friends in war, not being able to return to your country for 7 years not see your family for 7 years and many other things which I can't tell you, you start to have phsycological problems and you can't control your anger or hate and you no longer can see who is your friend and who is your enemy. Most Chechens suffer from this kind of stuff and they're ready to do ANYTHING to stop all of this because we're going crazy. And I also live abroad imagine for the ones who live there. Who have to hear the sound of bombs everyday. Who have family and friends who constantly die. Who see dead corpses lying around in the street. And the children see these things too and they grow up with hate in them. Chechens, even myself, once we see a Russian be he a soldier or not we feel terrible rage and are ready to jump on him and rip him apart. It's hard for you to understand these things because you don't know what war is. You haven't experienced it. Our life has been spoiled and we suffer everyday just because the Russians want more money!
This is awful. You should have grown up with balloons and birthday parties, not bombs and gunfire. And like I've been saying all along, all children are innocent and should never have to see the things you have. Believe me, I know. A child is never the same after seeing brain material mixed with chunks of skull. It changes you. But this has been my point. No matter what the cause, taking those children was inexcusable. Whatever has happened in chechnya does not make it right.
You are not the only ones to have lived in a warzone, and been robbed of childhood. Many people have. And yet they still do not support violence toward children. All children are innocent. Any person that attacks children is pure evil.
 
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These arguments are circular and somewhat heated. You might want to think about agreeing to disagree on this one.
 
I have never seen this. Personally, I don't think chechens are evil. I know two chechens (related to one) that are wonderful. Not evil.

I think that Shamil Basayev and anyone that supports the terrorizing of children are evil.


And your 2 friends they don't support Basayev?
 
He shot kid's fathers right in front of them, first thing when he took the school. He took hundreds of children and put their lives in danger. He threatened their lives and terrorized them. He gave no food or water, the children had to drink urine.


Yes of course he did...
 
Becareful brother not to hold these prophets up as idols. Even though they are chosen they were still just men. They had flesh as we do. We might not be able to reach their level of unsderstanding but we must strive for it.

Dont accuse me of portarying these men as idols please. Yeah and Ibn Abdul Hakim said the highest heaven is reserved for those with the most patience. We just have to make Dwa that Allah strenghtens the people who are going through great hardship. They will recieve there reward in the after life. When i start thinking about the pain they go through it makes me sad. But to make myself happy again i think of the reward that these people will recieve Inshallah in the hear after.

If the world wants to ignor let them, let us Muslims read our sallah and make Dwa for the people that are suffering due to occupation and other stupid reasons.
 
Shamil Basayev was not a nasty person. My father was very good friends with him. Shamil was an honest and brave person. Always ready to answer for his mistakes that's why he even offered to go on trial. Do you see Putin or Bush offering to go on trial? I was forced to flee from my country and end up in another country where I'm being treated like a dog. I have lost many family members and friends that have been killed by Russian soldiers. I have friends that have been tortured by Russian soldiers. And I am not the only one. Every Chechen family has been affected. So has Shamil. Shamil fought against the Russian oppressor and fought succesfully. But the Russians have a lot bigger army than us. They have more people than us. Meaning that when we kill all of their soldiers they just send more they don't care cause they have a lot but our people are dying every day. The Russian soldiers only attack civilians and kill many of them. And the mujahideen don't have many weapons. While the Russians have tanks, planes, helicopters and everything they need. So the mujahideen cannot carry out big operations. They have to wait till they have enough weapons. Shamil had no choice because this war has to stop as soon as possible. Everyone in Chechnya is dying and there is not a single healthy person in Chechnya because there are all sorts of unexplainable sicknesses going around. 300 000 people have died. 50 000 children. Maybe for you guys it's not enough yet maybe you want to see us all dead but for us it's ENOUGH. A Chechen's blood is more precious for me than a Russian kafir's blood. If we have to do cruel things to stop this war then we will do cruel things. Because the whole world has been cruel towards us so if to stop the war we have to be cruel towards them then fine. It's them that chose it that way. We're only avenging our children's blood. Now you people can think what you want of me, I don't care. I only care what Allah thinks of me and he knows what I've been through.

You are wrong brother, shamil was not a good person, he used innocent chldren in a bad way for something that was good, but it was still a horrible thing to do to children. MAybe it was for good, but it was still a VERY wrong way to do it. I put him in the same place in my mind as both putin and bush. And for you to say that a chechens blood is more precious than a russians is a very bad thing to say:thumbs_do :rant: . Nobody is worth more than others because of what country they comefrom. The way that you say such a thing is in a very nationalism way, but is that allowed in islam:uuh: ? I don't think so.
 
No way can i put Shamil on the level of Bush or Putin! They have killed more children than anyone else. Dont believe everything you hear about these men. It might be true to a certain extent, but most of it is propaganda. This propaganda is used as leverage for the attacks in Chechnya.
 
You are wrong brother, shamil was not a good person, he used innocent chldren in a bad way for something that was good, but it was still a horrible thing to do to children. MAybe it was for good, but it was still a VERY wrong way to do it. I put him in the same place in my mind as both putin and bush. And for you to say that a chechens blood is more precious than a russians is a very bad thing to say . Nobody is worth more than others because of what country they comefrom. The way that you say such a thing is in a very nationalism way, but is that allowed in islam ? I don't think so.

Since you have proven you know nothing about him, why even bother commenting?

In 1996 Shamil saved hundreds of thousands of lives by ending a brutal war - and the mass-murder and rape of his people - through his military brilliance and bravery.

Can anyone name me ANY Muslim today who has done that for our Ummah?

Anyone?????

He wasnt perfect - he made mistakes. In Beslan he made the biggest mistake of his life - he himself said he regretted it and offered to pay with his life for it.

And yet we still have some people who have the nerve to come on and slander him - i advise you to find out about Chechnya and Shamils life before commmenting.

Please take the advice.
 
Since you have proven you know nothing about him, why even bother commenting?

In 1996 Shamil saved hundreds of thousands of lives by ending a brutal war - and the mass-murder and rape of his people - through his military brilliance and bravery.

Can anyone name me ANY Muslim today who has done that for our Ummah?

Anyone?????

He wasnt perfect - he made mistakes. In Beslan he made the biggest mistake of his life - he himself said he regretted it and offered to pay with his life for it.

And yet we still have some people who have the nerve to come on and slander him - i advise you to find out about Chechnya and Shamils life before commmenting.

Please take the advice.

Very true nicely said
 
You are wrong brother, shamil was not a good person, he used innocent chldren in a bad way for something that was good, but it was still a horrible thing to do to children. MAybe it was for good, but it was still a VERY wrong way to do it. I put him in the same place in my mind as both putin and bush. And for you to say that a chechens blood is more precious than a russians is a very bad thing to say:thumbs_do :rant: . Nobody is worth more than others because of what country they comefrom. The way that you say such a thing is in a very nationalism way, but is that allowed in islam:uuh: ? I don't think so.


I didn't just say that a Chechen's blood is more precious than a Russian's or anybody else's blood, I said that for me a Chechen's blood is more precious than a Russian's blood meaning that if a Chechen dies I'll be sad but if a Russian kafir dies you think I'm going to be sad for him? I never said we were superior I just tried to say that I'm sad when I see Chechens dying but don't care at all if I see a Russian kafir dying. I have the right to love my country and love my countrymen. And as for you talking bad about Basayev, you should go try and put the world's second most powerful army on its knees with only 1500 men who are carrying nothing but AK's while the enemy has 30 000 men with tanks, planes, helicopters etc, once you end a genocidal war that has costed the death of 300 000 people which among are 45 000 children and 80% of Grozny being completely destroyed. Once you achieve all of that you might be able to come back and talk about Basayev but for now you can't say anything about him.
 
I didn't just say that a Chechen's blood is more precious than a Russian's or anybody else's blood, I said that for me a Chechen's blood is more precious than a Russian's blood meaning that if a Chechen dies I'll be sad but if a Russian kafir dies you think I'm going to be sad for him? I never said we were superior I just tried to say that I'm sad when I see Chechens dying but don't care at all if I see a Russian kafir dying. I have the right to love my country and love my countrymen. And as for you talking bad about Basayev, you should go try and put the world's second most powerful army on its knees with only 1500 men who are carrying nothing but AK's while the enemy has 30 000 men with tanks, planes, helicopters etc, once you end a genocidal war that has costed the death of 300 000 people which among are 45 000 children and 80% of Grozny being completely destroyed. Once you achieve all of that you might be able to come back and talk about Basayev but for now you can't say anything about him.

I'm sad when I see Chechens dying but don't care at all if I see a Russian kafir dying.
OMG brother!?! You are being just awful to say this!:embarrass Such words are embarassing. No life is worth more than another just because one is a russian or not a muslim. thats just awful for you to say:thumbs_do . and I dont care what you say Basaayev acomplished, he still did things in a very bad way. you should never take innocent babies lives hostage for any reason, those poor kids:'( . And you say that you have the right to love your country, but you forget that islam does not permit nationism.
 
Since you have proven you know nothing about him, why even bother commenting?

In 1996 Shamil saved hundreds of thousands of lives by ending a brutal war - and the mass-murder and rape of his people - through his military brilliance and bravery.

Can anyone name me ANY Muslim today who has done that for our Ummah?

Anyone?????

He wasnt perfect - he made mistakes. In Beslan he made the biggest mistake of his life - he himself said he regretted it and offered to pay with his life for it.

And yet we still have some people who have the nerve to come on and slander him - i advise you to find out about Chechnya and Shamils life before commmenting.

Please take the advice.

Brother, I have the right to coment about what ever I please, who do you think you are to say what I can talk about!? Why even comment on what I have said without even knowing anything about me?! and brother you say he made a mistake, but a mistake is like dropping ice cream or driving the wrong way on a road, he planned something awful, that was much more than a mistake. poor kids should be left out of such disputes.
 
Brother, I have the right to coment about what ever I please, who do you think you are to say what I can talk about!? Why even comment on what I have said without even knowing anything about me?! and brother you say he made a mistake, but a mistake is like dropping ice cream or driving the wrong way on a road, he planned something awful, that was much more than a mistake. poor kids should be left out of such disputes.

Yes you can comment about what you like - my question to you was why slander a brother whom you seem to know nothing about?

Why not just remain silent if your unsure on what is actually happening?

A mistake is a mistake - he offered to die for it, what more do you want from him?

Again if you know about the situation in Chechnya, you would know that killing anyone in the school would have been the last thing they wanted and he said he regretted it, He accepted his role ( though it was the russians who did the killing) and offered to go on trial.

You act like no-one is allowed to make mistakes. Even Khalid bin Waleed (ra) made mistakes in war - on one occasion he killed innocents and the Prophet (saw) said "i am free from what Khalid did".

So the Prophet (saw) distanced himself from Khalids (ra) actions in that particular event - but not distance himself from Khalid Bin Waleed (ra) himself who was a proven war leader - nor did he slander him.

and I dont care what you say Basaayev acomplished,

I think im beginning to understand your position on this.

You dont care about the hundreds of thousands of Muslim women and children he saved - but you do care about the 300 that died in Russia as thats what you keep refering too.

If you dont care about Muslims - our brothers and sisters who are being slaughtered and raped like animals for the last decade - then i cant say im too interested in what your opinion is.

You must be from one of the Arab countries, they all seem to support Russia too :rollseyes
 
OMG brother!?! You are being just awful to say this!:embarrass Such words are embarassing. No life is worth more than another just because one is a russian or not a muslim. thats just awful for you to say:thumbs_do . and I dont care what you say Basaayev acomplished, he still did things in a very bad way. you should never take innocent babies lives hostage for any reason, those poor kids:'( . And you say that you have the right to love your country, but you forget that islam does not permit nationism.


Wait you expect me to be sad when a Russian kafir soldier ,who slaughtered muslim brothers and sisters, dies? I may be wrong and I hope to be wrong but you seem to support the kafir more than your muslim brothers and sisters because here you are defending kafirs who slaughtered thousands of your brothers and sisters. You're sitting here bashing Basayev when you obviously know nothing about him. You're defending people who have killed 300 000 people and complaining about people who killed 300 people even though they weren't the ones that killed those people. And I have all the right to love my country and protect it, there's nothing bad about that. You are the first person from who I ever heard this from. Allah made me a Chechen and a muslim and I thank him for that. If that is wrong then please prove it to me because this is the first time I hear this in my life.
 
Yes you can comment about what you like - my question to you was why slander a brother whom you seem to know nothing about?

Why not just remain silent if your unsure on what is actually happening?

A mistake is a mistake - he offered to die for it, what more do you want from him?

Again if you know about the situation in Chechnya, you would know that killing anyone in the school would have been the last thing they wanted and he said he regretted it, He accepted his role ( though it was the russians who did the killing) and offered to go on trial.

You act like no-one is allowed to make mistakes. Even Khalid bin Waleed (ra) made mistakes in war - on one occasion he killed innocents and the Prophet (saw) said "i am free from what Khalid did".

So the Prophet (saw) distanced himself from Khalids (ra) actions in that particular event - but not distance himself from Khalid Bin Waleed (ra) himself who was a proven war leader - nor did he slander him.



I think im beginning to understand your position on this.

You dont care about the hundreds of thousands of Muslim women and children he saved - but you do care about the 300 that died in Russia as thats what you keep refering too.

If you dont care about Muslims - our brothers and sisters who are being slaughtered and raped like animals for the last decade - then i cant say im too interested in what your opinion is.

You must be from one of the Arab countries, they all seem to support Russia too :rollseyes

I am comenting about something that I do know about thank you very much. Mistakes are ok when it is a mistake,but this was too much, this involved children that should be left out of violent disputes. How dare you say that I dont care about muslim women or children! You should watch what you say, as you are speaking now as a liar about me. I care about all the children everywhere and I dont care if they are muslim or not, I love em all! and any country, all kids are precious and should never be brought into a violent dispute like this and used like this.

You must be from one of the Arab countries, they all seem to support Russia too :rollseyes
This is a very racist thing to say and I think that a mod should speak to you about being a racist in the forum. I too dont think I am very interested in your opinion as well, as I don't like racist opinions that think it is ok to harm some children just because they are different from you.
 
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