News 4m Pakistan
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What about foreign aid and influx of weapons and ammunition coming into troubled areas, since the entire western border can't be guarded manually. Its next to impossible. These are real issues and can't be resolved in one night. On the other hand, Pakistan Govt is reluctant to launch clean up operation with desired force, simply because that would lead to chain reaction and people of settled areas adjacent to tribal areas would also stand up against the Govt. No country wants to face an insurgency, which is worse than a conventional war. In war, you are free to exercise as many options as possible, but here you have to take into account the innocent law-abiding citizens of your own country, who will be affected the most, since insurgents keep changing their places frequently and losses are suffered by the natives of troubled areas.
Mere use of brutal force is a recipe for disaster.
snakelegs
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i honestly don't know what or how pakistan should deal with this. but it has to be dealt with or it will lead to areas breaking away from the state.
i would not like to be president musharraf!
wilberhum
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Then there would be peace in the North? :hmm:Say good-bye to US
wilberhum
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I can hope global warming will stop too.I can hope so
But hope is not a plan. :hiding:
snakelegs
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Say good-bye to US
do you really think that he has that option?
just for the sake of discussion - pretending that he did, and the u.s. co-operated, do you really think that all of pakistan's problems would be solved? it might help, but i think you know that the problem is bigger than that.
currently mushraf is too disrepected to ever regain his respect. personally i believe that even if he said bye to the US, the tribal north will not accept it. they will think he has another plan with the US behind his back or something. they will create some story and continue their pursued actions against musharraf. i think musharraf himself should walk out of politics and military and live a secluded life some where far away before he gets overthrown and arrested
Why not? but the mere idea of losing US support haunts him, since he wants them to remain at his back and overlook all his actions, being taken to ensure that he is legitimised by the Supreme Court as President for a term of another five years.
I can say with conviction, if Pakistan leaves US unholy alliance in the war against terror, that will bring internal stability and the country doesn't have to deal with civil war, as the existing situation suggests.
However an overall stability in the region is conditional to the restoration of peace in Afghanistan, which is conditional to Taliban's demand for the US and NATO forces to leave their country.
Four killed in Pakistan bomb explosion
Associated Press
Friday November 9, 2007
Guardian Unlimited
A bomb explosion at the home of a Pakistani government minister, in the northwestern city of Peshawar, killed at least four people today, police said.
The attack, which also wounded three people, occurred at the residence of the minister for political affairs, Amir Muqam, said Aslam Khan, a local police official.
Police said the bombing was a suicide attack.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/pakistan/Story/0,,2208404,00.html
Associated Press
Friday November 9, 2007
Guardian Unlimited
A bomb explosion at the home of a Pakistani government minister, in the northwestern city of Peshawar, killed at least four people today, police said.
The attack, which also wounded three people, occurred at the residence of the minister for political affairs, Amir Muqam, said Aslam Khan, a local police official.
Police said the bombing was a suicide attack.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/pakistan/Story/0,,2208404,00.html
wilberhum
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Militants occupy more installations
SWAT, Nov 8: Armed militants captured more government installations in Swat on Thursday and announced a punishment of 15 lashes for anyone not offering prayers in Matta tehsil.
Sources said the militants took over a police post on the Shangla hills, some 35km north of Mingora.
In Charbagh, Maulana Fazlullah’s supporters took over the Pakistan-Austria Training Institute for Hotel Management. The centre was established with the financial assistance of Austria in 2003 at a cost Rs150 million. It is the only training facility in the country for hotel management and tourism in the private sector.
In Khwazakhel area, militants set on fire the police station.
A tense calm prevailed with military helicopters hovering over the area. Security forces were consolidating their positions in and around Mingora amid reports that an operation was likely.
A handout issued in Peshawar said the overall situation in Swat was under control and no untoward incident had been reported over ‘the past 48 hours’. Paramilitary forces were on high alert and educational institutions remained open.
http://dawn.com/2007/11/09/top9.htm
SWAT, Nov 8: Armed militants captured more government installations in Swat on Thursday and announced a punishment of 15 lashes for anyone not offering prayers in Matta tehsil.
Sources said the militants took over a police post on the Shangla hills, some 35km north of Mingora.
In Charbagh, Maulana Fazlullah’s supporters took over the Pakistan-Austria Training Institute for Hotel Management. The centre was established with the financial assistance of Austria in 2003 at a cost Rs150 million. It is the only training facility in the country for hotel management and tourism in the private sector.
In Khwazakhel area, militants set on fire the police station.
A tense calm prevailed with military helicopters hovering over the area. Security forces were consolidating their positions in and around Mingora amid reports that an operation was likely.
A handout issued in Peshawar said the overall situation in Swat was under control and no untoward incident had been reported over ‘the past 48 hours’. Paramilitary forces were on high alert and educational institutions remained open.
http://dawn.com/2007/11/09/top9.htm
i can't believe this. it is soo not Islam. Allah is the judge and he will reward whom he wants and punish whom he wants. he says that several times in the Qur'an. We should encourage our Muslim brothers and sisters to pray Salaat, preach them the importance of salaat, but we should not beat them for not praying. we have no right to beat our own poeple. The Prophet SAW did not beat people for not praying salaat with Jamaat, why should we??
May Allah guide Muslims to the true path which leads us to Jannah and help Islam. Ameen.
snakelegs
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General’s troops routed by zealots imposing Sharia on tourist haven
Zahid Hussain in Islamabad
Dozens of Pakistani security forces policing a former tourist haven surrendered to militants yesterday, raising the stakes in the country’s political crisis. The police officers and troops, outnumbered and demoralised, laid down their arms before hundreds of pro-Taleban extremists who are imposing Islamic law in an area beloved of Western hikers.
The surrender, in the scenic Swat Valley, was deeply symbolic at a time when President Musharraf is pleading for continued Western support as a key regional ally.
General Musharraf argued last week that he was imposing martial law to help the fight against extremists. Yesterday’s cave-in illustrated the limits of Pakistan’s efforts to combat the spread of militancy. And the unwillingness of those in uniform to fight allies of al-Qaeda in northern Pakistan contrasted with the brutal repression by the security forces of lawyers on the streets of the capital.
“The security forces and intelligence agencies are fighting the people instead of the militants,” Benazir Bhutto, the former Prime Minister, said yesterday.
Three main towns have fallen to the followers of Maulana Fazlullah, a radical Islamic cleric, over the past three days. Residents said that heavily armed militants were patrolling the towns of Madayan, Matta and Kwazakhela, which had been favourite destinations for Pakistani and foreign tourists until recently.
They added that the Islamic militia, who called themselves Taleban, had hoisted their flag inscribed with verses from the Koran above government buildings and established Islamic courts. Government officials have fled and police stations are now manned by militants.
Television and music have been banned and barbers ordered not to shave beards. Through an FM radio station, the militants have urged schoolgirls to wear all-covering burkas. They have warned women that their marriages would be annulled if they did not force their husbands to grow beards.
Several development organisations have been forced to close their offices, accused of spreading immorality because they employed women staff. Last week the militia publicly beheaded 12 soldiers.
The region used to attract foreign tourists to its Buddhist heritage and archaeological sites. It is now one of the main centres of al-Qaeda activities, a sign of the growing influence of Islamic radicals in northern Pakistan.
Pakistani security officials said that the militia had the backing of al- Qaeda and included Arab and Uzbek fighters who had set up training camps in the mountains near Kwazakhela, which fell this week. Many members of militant outfits from other parts of the country are also reported to have joined the fighting.
Mr Fazlullah is also a leader of Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi (TNSM), which was banned by General Musharraf in 2002 after it sent more than 10,000 volunteers to fight in Afghanistan against US forces. The cleric, who is also known as Mullah Radio for his fiery speeches delivered from an illegal FM radio station, declared jihad against the Government after Pakistani security forces raided the Red Mosque in Islamabad in July, killing a rebel cleric and scores of seminary students.
Pakistani security officials said that the movement presented the most potent threat to national security because it had developed firmly into a satellite of al-Qaeda.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article2827700.ece?print=yes&randnum=1194637166713
Zahid Hussain in Islamabad
Dozens of Pakistani security forces policing a former tourist haven surrendered to militants yesterday, raising the stakes in the country’s political crisis. The police officers and troops, outnumbered and demoralised, laid down their arms before hundreds of pro-Taleban extremists who are imposing Islamic law in an area beloved of Western hikers.
The surrender, in the scenic Swat Valley, was deeply symbolic at a time when President Musharraf is pleading for continued Western support as a key regional ally.
General Musharraf argued last week that he was imposing martial law to help the fight against extremists. Yesterday’s cave-in illustrated the limits of Pakistan’s efforts to combat the spread of militancy. And the unwillingness of those in uniform to fight allies of al-Qaeda in northern Pakistan contrasted with the brutal repression by the security forces of lawyers on the streets of the capital.
“The security forces and intelligence agencies are fighting the people instead of the militants,” Benazir Bhutto, the former Prime Minister, said yesterday.
Three main towns have fallen to the followers of Maulana Fazlullah, a radical Islamic cleric, over the past three days. Residents said that heavily armed militants were patrolling the towns of Madayan, Matta and Kwazakhela, which had been favourite destinations for Pakistani and foreign tourists until recently.
They added that the Islamic militia, who called themselves Taleban, had hoisted their flag inscribed with verses from the Koran above government buildings and established Islamic courts. Government officials have fled and police stations are now manned by militants.
Television and music have been banned and barbers ordered not to shave beards. Through an FM radio station, the militants have urged schoolgirls to wear all-covering burkas. They have warned women that their marriages would be annulled if they did not force their husbands to grow beards.
Several development organisations have been forced to close their offices, accused of spreading immorality because they employed women staff. Last week the militia publicly beheaded 12 soldiers.
The region used to attract foreign tourists to its Buddhist heritage and archaeological sites. It is now one of the main centres of al-Qaeda activities, a sign of the growing influence of Islamic radicals in northern Pakistan.
Pakistani security officials said that the militia had the backing of al- Qaeda and included Arab and Uzbek fighters who had set up training camps in the mountains near Kwazakhela, which fell this week. Many members of militant outfits from other parts of the country are also reported to have joined the fighting.
Mr Fazlullah is also a leader of Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi (TNSM), which was banned by General Musharraf in 2002 after it sent more than 10,000 volunteers to fight in Afghanistan against US forces. The cleric, who is also known as Mullah Radio for his fiery speeches delivered from an illegal FM radio station, declared jihad against the Government after Pakistani security forces raided the Red Mosque in Islamabad in July, killing a rebel cleric and scores of seminary students.
Pakistani security officials said that the movement presented the most potent threat to national security because it had developed firmly into a satellite of al-Qaeda.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article2827700.ece?print=yes&randnum=1194637166713
snakelegs
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i agree with you that u.s. has made everything worse and if the u.s. left, it would help a lot. but i disagree that all the problems are due to the u.s. - and even those that can trace a lot of their causes back to the u.s. (at least partially) would not vanish if the u.s. did.
that aside, if president musharraf told bush to leave the area - what make you think bush would obey? what makes you think he would hesitate to drop daisy cutters on pakistanis like he did on the afghans?
what makes you think that the u.s. would respect pakistan's sovereign rights?
it is a fairy tale.
as far as i'm concerned, the u.s. has done more to feed the extremists than they could possibly have dreamed - i have no doubt about that.
but the problems in the north and in the country in general go much deeper.
the people who are taking over the northern areas will not stop there. they don't give a ____ about pakistan, any more than the u.s. does.
Peace snakelegs.
The guy is 32 years old and doesn't hold any degree from any recognised madrassa (religious institution). So don't get carried away with the word Maulana, which he likes to attach with his name
Long ago, TNSM declared its dis-association with him, in view of his militant activities, though he happens to be son-in-law of TNSM founder Soofi Muhammad, a moderate scholar, currently in jail.
wilberhum
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I don't think we have to worry about snakelegs getting carried away.Peace snakelegs.
The guy is 32 years old and doesn't hold any degree from any recognised madrassa (religious institution). So don't get carried away with the word Maulana, which he likes to attach with his name
Long ago, TNSM declared its dis-association with him, in view of his militant activities, though he happens to be son-in-law of TNSM founder Soofi Muhammad, a moderate scholar, currently in jail.
I think we are worried about the fact that Pakistani's are getting carried away.:raging:
snakelegs
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Peace snakelegs.
The guy is 32 years old and doesn't hold any degree from any recognised madrassa (religious institution). So don't get carried away with the word Maulana, which he likes to attach with his name
Long ago, TNSM declared its dis-association with him, in view of his militant activities, though he happens to be son-in-law of TNSM founder Soofi Muhammad, a moderate scholar, currently in jail.
this was from the article - i didn't use the term. i think it's irrelevant, although actually, this is part of the problem. i suspect that some of these self-styled mullahs do not really have much of an islamic education, but the people, knowing even less, accept their authority. there seems to be no shortage of "mad mullahs".
the point is, the pakistani flag has been taken down in some villages, they are setting up their own government. there is no way the central gov't can allow this.
Taliban threaten Mir Shakil, Jang Grouphttp://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2007\11\09\story_9-11-2007_pg7_6
KARACHI: The All Pakistan Newspaper Society (APNS), the Council of Pakistan Newspaper Editors (CPNE) and the Pakistan Broadcasters Association (PBA) have all condemned the intimidation and threats directed against Mir Shakilur Rehman, owner and chief executive of Jang Group, the country’s largest media group.
Rehman is the chairman of the PBA and former president of the APNS and the CPNE.
Briefing members of these organisations, Rehman said he had been subjected to great pressure and threats since the beginning of 2007, including an attempt on his life, for which he had filed a criminal complaint in a city police station in Karachi. He said that he had faced the pressures and challenges to the best of his ability but found it necessary to inform the media community of the threatening situation faced by him.
Rehman said the latest threat to the Jang Group was an email by a Taliban outfit, which had threatened to blow up the printing press and the staff of the Jang publications unless they stopped printing photographs of young women. online
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