Paedophilia

[Umm Abed]

While it is acceptable that they may be forgiven I can understand why you feel like that, and I agree that they shouldnt be given high position due to the actions they committed.

 

[hisnameiszzz]

Thank you. You are right.

I just find it hard because I work with the victims. Not my family or my kids but my clients and I just feel so badly for them. Hence having strong feelings.

 

[Serinity]

Under Sharia law the man would have been guilty of Zina and so too the girls he had sex with. This hysterical problem with sex under a certain age is a modern Western concept first instigated by feminists in 19th century England. The reason then was money, as the old prostitutes had too much competition with the young ones, so they petitioned the government to put age restrictions on prostitution. The same happened with labour laws when things got tough later on, so children were banned from working. If you study modern Western culture you will find the answer to everything is money not morality or ethics. Of course they will play all morality and ethics but this is all lies and deceit.

Unless the girls were raped or had no judgment. Or were ignorant, I assume? Or coerced.
If raped, only offender gets the punishment, not the victim.
Allahu alam.

 

[muslim brother]

this forgiveness idea is so misused and abused nowadays
first of all as this is a case of huqooq ul ibaad..right of creation..
then the decision is left to the victims not even allah taala.
there is a difference in rights of creation and rights of creator in islam.

i have a question
would you let these individuals babysit your children?


as for the mosque and imam..seriously!

the reason we are battered by the far right and the media
is precisely becauses of cases and outcomes like this.

in islam there is also a system of reparations,ex communicating,boycotting

for too long weve been burying our rubbish under the proverbial rug

im afraid the rug is not big enough and itself is now rotten too

lets start to deal with these community issues like men
forget izzat,respect,braaderi and popularity
think true effective justice.

what message does this send out to the victims families?
not to mention people just waiting for negative news stories

 

[fromelsewhere]

Under Sharia law the man would have been guilty of Zina and so too the girls he had sex with. This hysterical problem with sex under a certain age is a modern Western concept first instigated by feminists in 19th century England. The reason then was money, as the old prostitutes had too much competition with the young ones, so they petitioned the government to put age restrictions on prostitution. The same happened with labour laws when things got tough later on, so children were banned from working. If you study modern Western culture you will find the answer to everything is money not morality or ethics. Of course they will play all morality and ethics but this is all lies and deceit.

There are rules to follow in every country. If you don't like the rules in a given "Westernized" country, you don't have to live there. There are plenty of other countries out there where children are treated like slaves and little girls get married off to much older men. I suggest you would be much happier in such a place.

 

[fromelsewhere]

I understand your concern and also possible emotional reaction of the families of his victims but... I see this is one of the biggest lessons of the life, called forgiveness. Should people forgive him and the most hard, should his victims forgive him his awful crimes? Yes, they should even it´s hard and may feels almost impossible. It´s easy to say they should I know. When someone hurts us very deeply we still shouldn´t live in hate and anger as it hurts mostly just ourselves, it´s like an endless hunger what eats us inside until we are just only an empty shell.

It´s a good idea to ask this matter from imam. Maybe he also could keep a sermon that deals with the importance of forgiveness.

I am all for forgiveness too (even of pedophiles under certain circumstances), but the person to be forgiven should first demonstrate by acts of kindness (giving to charities, helping poor people, perhaps paying the medical/counselling bills of his victims) that he genuinely repents from his past crimes and that he will NOT do it again. That does not erase the evil he has done, but it definitely helps.

The sad reality however is that a lot of pedophiles never learn, and they are at a high risk of abusing kids again once they get out of jail. Yes people can change, but often, people choose not to. Now let’s have a thought for the victims and their families for a moment. We are talking about girls aged 12 and UNDER having sex with a much older man. What are these girls going to do now? Imagine if a few of them got pregnant and had to go through a traumatizing abortion or give birth and put the baby up for adoption. This is a very embarrassing and traumatizing experience for any young girl to have to go through, the type that haunts you for the rest of your life.

So maybe I am of the minority opinion here (I hope not), but I would also feel quite uncomfortable with having such a man giving Adhaan so soon after his jail sentence. Not that he should be shunned forever, but I am sure there are better people who can give Adhaan for the time being until he proves himself to be deserving of trust.

 

[Karl]

Unless the girls were raped or had no judgment. Or were ignorant, I assume? Or coerced.
If raped, only offender gets the punishment, not the victim.
Allahu alam.

Yes females have to protect themselves from being the victims of being raped by never being alone in public or around males and always cover up because if God wont stop a rapist how will the law? Also she will not have any witnesses to being raped, how can she prove she did not consent? Also if a female is too loose and then cries rape it can bring dishonour to the family.

 

[fromelsewhere]

Yes females have to protect themselves from being the victims of being raped by never being alone in public or around males and always cover up because if God wont stop a rapist how will the law? Also she will not have any witnesses to being raped, how can she prove she did not consent? Also if a female is too loose and then cries rape it can bring dishonour to the family.

Why do you feel the need to post the same comment twice? Either way, fact of the matter is that regardless of what females in 'Westernized' countries "should" or "should not" do in their country, we have a case here of an old pedo who clearly did things that are extremely immoral and pervy. The fact that you are putting the blame more on the female victims rather than on the old male pedo makes me blush for your sake. :embarrass Now the last sentence, that's a good one, shifting all the blame on the "loose provocative women" as if men had no control of their body parts. Haha, funny in a twisted way. ;D

Now, I am curious about 2 things in your post: (1) what do you mean by "too loose"? Is a hijab ok or do you need the full burka? Then (2), I quote you: "if God wont stop a rapist how will the law?" What do you mean by this? There are a lot of bad things that God doesn't stop. Do I need to give examples? Failed logic.

 

[Search]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

(Peace be upon you)

Yes females have to protect themselves from being the victims of being raped by never being alone in public or around males and always cover up because if God wont stop a rapist how will the law? Also she will not have any witnesses to being raped, how can she prove she did not consent? Also if a female is too loose and then cries rape it can bring dishonour to the family.

A victim is never at fault for another person's crime. The moment we internalize this truth society and its people can stop trying to understand what the victim did to deserve x, y, z and instead focus on what allowed the perpetrator to go through with committing a crime against another human being. And rape is one of the worst crimes against a human being, not anything which we should discuss casually without any thought to the victim's feelings. In an incident in which a woman was walking from the mosque and was raped, what stood out to me from that incident was Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) did not inquire into matters like why she was walking alone to the mosque and instead simply asked her to identify the man who did this to her so that justice could be done.

As to the OP's question, there is of course a time and place for mercy and forgiveness in the spiritual realm. However, in the realm of reality, as someone who works in the dependency process in the legal field, essentially part of the process of advocating for children's rights and representing their voice, that is, specifically children who have been mentally, physically, or sexually abused, I do believe that perpetrators who have in the past sexually abused children should not be allowed to be anywhere near children because they have proven themselves to be specifically unreliable as to controlling their sexual impulses and cannot be trusted to be around what seems temptation to them.

When I say this, I don't mean to say that any sinner cannot privately ask Allah for forgiveness and mercy; every sinner can no matter how heinous or evil his/her sins. However, that is not the same thing as allowing a person in essentially what is a position of trust to abuse that trust; having faith in other peoples' ability to reform themselves is a great thing, but it is extremely naive and irresponsible to assume that risk on behalf of other people's children.

:wa: (And peace be upon you)

 

[Grandad]

:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)

(Peace be upon you)



A victim is never at fault for another person's crime. The moment we internalize this truth society and its people can stop trying to understand what the victim did to deserve x, y, z and instead focus on what allowed the perpetrator to go through with committing a crime against another human being. And rape is one of the worst crimes against a human being, not anything which we should discuss casually without any thought to the victim's feelings. In an incident in which a woman was walking from the mosque and was raped, what stood out to me from that incident was Prophet Muhammad :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) did not inquire into matters like why she was walking alone to the mosque and instead simply asked her to identify the man who did this to her so that justice could be done.

As to the OP's question, there is of course a time and place for mercy and forgiveness in the spiritual realm. However, in the realm of reality, as someone who works in the dependency process in the legal field, essentially part of the process of advocating for children's rights and representing their voice, that is, specifically children who have been mentally, physically, or sexually abused, I do believe that perpetrators who have in the past sexually abused children should not be allowed to be anywhere near children because they have proven themselves to be specifically unreliable as to controlling their sexual impulses and cannot be trusted to be around what seems temptation to them.

When I say this, I don't mean to say that any sinner cannot privately ask Allah for forgiveness and mercy; every sinner can no matter how heinous or evil his/her sins. However, that is not the same thing as allowing a person in essentially what is a position of trust to abuse that trust; having faith in other peoples' ability to reform themselves is a great thing, but it is extremely naive and irresponsible to assume that risk on behalf of other people's children.

:wa: (And peace be upon you)

Exactly.