Right Ho! Paradise...Now what?

[truemuslim]

Yes, Muslims will have physical bodies, becuase being human, is being physical and Spiritual at the same time, you see thats why humans are higher then any other creature created.

true ^^^ and qingu, you are considered dead anyway...no off.

 

[Qingu]

They stuff in Paradise only share their names with the stuff of earth, but they are far more superior.

Okay ... I'm having trouble following you. In what ways would heavenly gold be "superior" to earthly gold? More shiny? More malleable?

No, its great food, non-intoxicating wine, servants, not slaves, and the women (specifically wives) are not simply attractive, but they are beautiful, more so than any human can imagine.

Wow, this sounds exactly like a Roman orgy.

There is. I don't know if they are 'fair-eyed' though.

Really? Where are these attractive heavenly husbands for Muslim women mentioned in the Quran or the hadith?

If they're not mentioned anywhere, how do you know they exist? Seems consistent with Muslim theology that men get this perk of multiple sex partners in heaven and women do not.

Of course we have a body!

Then why is almost every single dead Muslim's body currently rotting underground?

Have they not gone to heaven yet?

Or do you get a duplicate body in heaven? What age is the body?

Since your mind is wholly tied to the physicality of your brain, is the heavenly Muslim brain different than the brains of Muslims who died?

I'm sorry, but are you being silly on purpose?

I'm not being silly at all. My questions are intended to be serious.

 

[truemuslim]

you know qingu you are so right, muslims just don't understand the fun of killing, the fun of robbing, family issues (guessin u got som), going crazy in a club drinkin then leavin drunk, feelin afrain after watchin a sick scary HARAM movie like f-final destination 1, 2, and 3..( i only saw 5 min... i aint bad) not feelin afraid of someone breakin in through weak normal area of da u.s witout cages and killin you family? i mean, who still even wants to live in peace? its sorta boring, you know like watchin grass grow, or paint dry, u kow, not lookin for anythin scary, bad, sick, painful... think a lil..


lol i really got u thinkin i on uz side qingu ditnt i? lol

 

[Qingu]

P.S STOP SAYING MUSLIM MEN ENJOYING VIRGINS,

Why?

Do you deny that Muslim men will get to enjoy multiple, beautiful, virgin wives in heaven? That is exactly what the Quran says; Truemuslim quoted the verse.

its disrespectful the way you said it, Allah enjoins to souls and makes them ONE, a man and a woman, just like Allah created for Adam, Eve He created for every human, its soulmate,

I'm not trying to be disrespectful, nor do I see how it's disrespectful. Besides, Allah obviously doesn't think that souls are wholly joined between man and wife, because you can have multiple wives according to the Quran. Muhammad had twelve wives, did he not? And the passage describes multiple attractive virgin wives in heaven, not one.

(Though I understand that this is not the case for women and multiple husbands.)

If you truly ever loved someone you should know that you will have the tendencies to hide her/him away from anyone else,

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here...?

 

[Qingu]

you know qingu you are so right, muslims just don't understand the fun of killing, the fun of robbing, family issues (guessin u got som), going crazy in a club drinkin then leavin drunk, feelin afrain after watchin a sick scary HARAM movie like f-final destination 1, 2, and 3..( i only saw 5 min... i aint bad) not feelin afraid of someone breakin in through weak normal area of da u.s witout cages and killin you family? i mean, who still even wants to live in peace? its sorta boring, you know like watchin grass grow, or paint dry, u kow, not lookin for anythin scary, bad, sick, painful... think a lil..


lol i really got u thinkin i on uz side qingu ditnt i? lol

I'm not sure how anything you've just said relates to anything I've said in this thread, or to the discussion of heaven. What is your point, exactly?

 

[truemuslim]

Then why is almost every single dead Muslim's body currently rotting underground?

Have they not gone to heaven yet?

Or do you get a duplicate body in heaven? What age is the body?

Since your mind is wholly tied to the physicality of your brain, is the heavenly Muslim brain different than the brains of Muslims who died?


I'm not being silly at all. My questions are intended to be serious.

OMG ARE U FREAKIN KIDDIN ME?????? HAHA I cannot believe what me readin.... ok so you ACTUALLY think that when a person ACTUALLY dies, they stay in the grave, and ACTUALLY stay EXACTLY the same, i mean seriously, they dead, in heavan they still dead...(hope u know sarcasism, sorry if i cant spell that word, i juss never had to ACTUALLY use it to some one in ma lyf yet) and they juss get they dirt bones up and go to heavan, all dirty, and sickening lookin... oh please gimme a freakin break... i could sit here and typin all night long...but u aint worth ma time:enough!:


sorry ppl like u sorta make me mad...:raging:

no off....again...hehe:-[

 

[truemuslim]

I'm not sure how anything you've just said relates to anything I've said in this thread, or to the discussion of heaven. What is your point, exactly?

yah dude u defidently dead so whered they bury ur grave i might need to go to it and read suraht al mulk....

 

[Qingu]

OMG ARE U FREAKIN KIDDIN ME?????? HAHA I cannot believe what me readin.... ok so you ACTUALLY think that when a person ACTUALLY dies, they stay in the grave, and ACTUALLY stay EXACTLY the same,

Not exactly the same. They rot.

Which is why I'm asking about the bodies in heaven. They obviously are not the same bodies that believers have on earth. Do you get a duplicate body, like a clone?

Or will all the believers' corpses regenerate one day in the future and ascend up to the sky?

sorry ppl like u sorta make me mad...:raging:

Apparently. I'm wondering if I should interpret your "dude u definitely dead" comment as a threat!

 

[truemuslim]

nah please dude... dont take it the wrong way...

it aint a threat...it a fact...

 

[truemuslim]

btw when you said they go to heavan when they die.... i dont blame u...i dont think ur religion even got a judgement day...im so sorry man

 

[Malaikah]

Okay ... I'm having trouble following you. In what ways would heavenly gold be "superior" to earthly gold? More shiny? More malleable?

Everything is superior. For example, we can talk about mangos in paradise. In earth you can get crappy mangoes that are all bruised and have black dots on them and stuff, or you can get really yummy perfect looking mangoes... in paradise the mangoes are ever better in every respect, taste, size, everything.

Wow, this sounds exactly like a Roman orgy.

Why? Never heard of a person having a beautiful wife? Odd.

Really? Where are these attractive heavenly husbands for Muslim women mentioned in the Quran or the hadith?

It is mentioned in the hadith. The men who enter paradise marry the women who enter paradise. And both the earthly men and women are superior and more beautiful than the women who only ever lived in paradise. (I do knot know if there are men who only ever lived in paradise).

Seems consistent with Muslim theology that men get this perk of multiple sex partners in heaven and women do not.

No it doesn't, for it to be consistent than women must have a husband (which they do). And if you are going to make a big deal about teh fact that men get more than one wife but women only get one husband, then don't- God has made it that way, and God always knows best. Whether it is because He knows it is inappropriate for women to have multiple husbands, or because He knows men like it and women do not, or whatever reason, it doesn't matter because the fact is that everyone is happy in paradise, so in the end it makes no difference.

Then why is almost every single dead Muslim's body currently rotting underground?

It's called resurrection. We will be raised from the dead, our bodied just like how they used to be. That included all people. Now if you want to know whether every single atom will be the same, I can't help you with that one.

Have they not gone to heaven yet?

No, people only enter Paradise after the Day of Judgement. The exception is he martyrs, they enter paradise as soon as they die, but their souls only. They get their bodied back on the Day of Judgement.

Or do you get a duplicate body in heaven? What age is the body?

No duplicate, the original. And the age is 33.

Since your mind is wholly tied to the physicality of your brain, is the heavenly Muslim brain different than the brains of Muslims who died?

I don't understand this question.

 

[Qingu]

Everything is superior. For example, we can talk about mangos in paradise. In earth you can get crappy mangoes that are all bruised and have black dots on them and stuff, or you can get really yummy perfect looking mangoes... in paradise the mangoes are ever better in every respect, taste, size, everything.

I'm curious as to how the mangoes taste better in heaven, since taste is a physical reaction between chemicals.

And I'm still curious as to how gold is "superior" in heaven.

Why? Never heard of a person having a beautiful wife? Odd.

Roman emperors and noblemen would often throw parties where they had sex with a lot of beautiful women, ate the most delicious food imaginable, and bathed in pleasing baths attended by their slaves.

Your description of heaven sounds exactly like this, except without the diarrhea afterwards.

It is mentioned in the hadith. The men who enter paradise marry the women who enter paradise. And both the earthly men and women are superior and more beautiful than the women who only ever lived in paradise. (I do knot know if there are men who only ever lived in paradise).

So let me get this straight.

Muslim men get a cadre of beautiful virgin women in paradise, in addition to their earthly wives.

Women, on the other hand, only get what they come in with.

Do women get slave-boys too, like the men? Can they have sex with them?

What if you're an unmarried woman and you die and go to heaven?

It's called resurrection. We will be raised from the dead, our bodied just like how they used to be. That included all people. Now if you want to know whether every single atom will be the same, I can't help you with that one.

So what happens in the meantime, before your bodies are raised?

No, people only enter Paradise after the Day of Judgement. The exception is he martyrs, they enter paradise as soon as they die, but their souls only. They get their bodied back on the Day of Judgement.

Okay, but without their bodies, how are the martyrs' souls going to enjoy all the delicious fruit and virgin women in heaven? It seems like all the pleasures in your heaven are physical, so why would you want to go there without a body?

No duplicate, the original. And the age is 33.

What happens if you die before you're 33?

I don't understand this question.

You can lobotomize someone and completely change their personality. People with brain damage, Alzeihmers, etc. have different minds than when before they had their disease. And as you learn things growing up, your brain physically changes too.

Since the mind, or the soul, seem wholly tied to the physicality of the brain, I'm curious as to what is the default "brain state" in heaven.

I'm also very curious as to WHERE your heaven is. It's obviously a physical place, and people go there with bodies. Is it like a floating continent in the sky? Is it on another planet? Does Earth magically turn into Heaven on the Last Day? I'm mostly familiar with Christian conceptions of heaven as a "spiritual" place (whatever that means), so this is all very new to me.

 

[Malaikah]

I'm curious as to how the mangoes taste better in heaven, since taste is a physical reaction between chemicals.

And I'm still curious as to how gold is "superior" in heaven.

They just DO. I'm sorry I don't know details so I really can't help you with that.

Roman emperors and noblemen would often throw parties where they had sex with a lot of beautiful women, ate the most delicious food imaginable, and bathed in pleasing baths attended by their slaves.

Your description of heaven sounds exactly like this, except without the diarrhea afterwards.

Right, well they sleep with their wives one at a time, not all at the same time, theres nothing wrong with good, and the servants are mentioned in the context of bringing them food, not bathing them.

So let me get this straight.

Muslim men get a cadre of beautiful virgin women in paradise, in addition to their earthly wives.

Women, on the other hand, only get what they come in with.

Do women get slave-boys too, like the men? Can they have sex with them?

SERVANT boys, and yes men and women get them and NO they don't sleep with them (boys, not men, BOYS!)

What if you're an unmarried woman and you die and go to heaven?

You are given a husband.

So what happens in the meantime, before your bodies are raised?

You hang out in your grave where your soul is either punished or rewarded.

Okay, but without their bodies, how are the martyrs' souls going to enjoy all the delicious fruit and virgin women in heaven? It seems like all the pleasures in your heaven are physical, so why would you want to go there without a body?

They hang out in the bodies of green birds, if I remember correctly.

What happens if you die before you're 33?

You are raised at 33 regardless, though I think there might be a exception for children who die before puberty but I'm not sure.

You can lobotomize someone and completely change their personality. People with brain damage, Alzeihmers, etc. have different minds than when before they had their disease. And as you learn things growing up, your brain physically changes too.

Since the mind, or the soul, seem wholly tied to the physicality of the brain, I'm curious as to what is the default "brain state" in heaven.

No idea, all I know is that we are raised how we are born- "naked, barefoot and uncircumcised". In other words, if you lost an arm in life you are raised with that arm etc. And you are raised with your normal memory and functioning and all that, don't ask me how that works, Allah did not give us the details.

I'm also very curious as to WHERE your heaven is. It's obviously a physical place, and people go there with bodies. Is it like a floating continent in the sky? Is it on another planet? Does Earth magically turn into Heaven on the Last Day? I'm mostly familiar with Christian conceptions of heaven as a "spiritual" place (whatever that means), so this is all very new to me.

It is a physical place, outside the universe.

 

[truemuslim]

Qingu heavan is undiscribable, we can't describe exctly how it looks, its too good, no one can even imagine how it is... of course, some stubborn people think they can ....ahem...ahem...gee.i wonder who that is hehe... anyway malaikah isnt heavan boring... i want to go to hell (staghfirallah al atheem) so badly... its much more action than heavan..ya know? i mean the great challenge in staying and burning and the challenge of trying to find food that isnt painful and on fire...the challenge of holding the pain in... so much anger of remembering why you got this... because you did wrong in the other short life...

cuz seriously who on earth would want to go to that boring place with no anger, that means no shaitan, no fun of evil... what is that?!?! sooo boring... OMG THE HORROR OF HEAVAN...AAAAAAAHHHHHHHH... so os so horrible...

here on earth... what most people call heavan is a club wit a bar inside...yea nice aint it?


i wonder if they sell brains in stores or somthin... i might actually be kind enough to buy one for u..hehe..not u malaikah btw

 

[DAWUD_adnan]

Does anyone else think this debate is fundamentally too metaphysical to be taken seriously for any substantial length of time? I mean no disrespect to any participants, it's just the topic is becoming understandably farcical.

Next up: Angels. How do they get their wings so fluffy?

Lol I wouldn't say they are fluffy, because if you think about it... they are made of light.. right? ( lol ..that rhymed ) hahah that two!

anyway...

I think their wings are like straight rays of light not featherish, but Allah Knows Best.

 

[syilla]

lol...this thread is so funny.

As if the hardship is fun enough...

 

[جوري]

I haven't had a chance to read through all the replies, so will address the first poster only, in hopes I can kill the last 8 mins before I make isha prayer and dindin is ready..

A great deal of your happiness or myriad of other emotions in this world depends on its contrast to things you find to be their opposite.. it is simply the way you were created..

You know why something is evil by having experienced something that is good... You know what black having seen white, you only know of day time because you have experienced night...

When you dream at night, do you feel boredom in a dream? You are in a completely different state.. I have never heard anyone state, I was so boared in my dream last night, sleep is an opposite state to wakefullness and in its own right completely strange and different not bound by laws of our physical world.

Anyone who will listen to a sura such as say Suret Al'waqi3a

[media]http://youtube.com/watch?v=VlgC5CKh26U[/media]

will develop a great understanding from Allah's words..

عَلَى أَن نُّبَدِّلَ أَمْثَالَكُمْ وَنُنشِئَكُمْ فِي مَا لَا تَعْلَمُونَ {61}​

[Pickthal 56:61] That We may transfigure you and make you what ye know not.

وَلَقَدْ عَلِمْتُمُ النَّشْأَةَ الْأُولَى فَلَوْلَا تَذكَّرُونَ {62}​

[Pickthal 56:62] And verily ye know the first creation. Why, then, do ye not reflect?

I suggest you listen to all of it, it is actually translated...
Those of us who believe, recognize, we will be of a different creation...
that which we know of heaven, is only limited to our understanding to things we can relate to it this life, just like punishment we can only relate to punishment received here on earth.. it doesn't seem terribly exciting or terribly frightful because you've not carried the thought to abstraction and I suspect that on a human level it would be very difficult to carry the thought through without experiencing what you have in fact stated. "tis beyond your scope, because what you have written is all you know, and all you will know so long as you are bound by laws of this world!
hope that is of help?


cheers!

 

[Qingu]

I suggest you listen to all of it, it is actually translated...
Those of us who believe, recognize, we will be of a different creation...
that which we know of heaven, is only limited to our understanding to things we can relate to it this life, just like punishment we can only relate to punishment received here on earth.. it doesn't seem terribly exciting or terribly frightful because you've not carried the thought to abstraction and I suspect that on a human level it would be very difficult to carry the thought through without experiencing what you have in fact stated. "tis beyond your scope, because what you have written is all you know, and all you will know so long as you are bound by laws of this world!
hope that is of help?


cheers!

Except that it's not really abstracted because you apparently believe you will have a physical body in heaven, nearly identical to your current physical body. In heaven, Muslims will experience physical comforts, physical pleasures, physical sex, and eat physical food. There's no abstraction at all, we're talking about electrochemical nerve messages indicating pleasure and (in hell) pain in a physical body.

The other option, which Christians believe, is that only your spirit goes to heaven (whatever that means) and thus whatever pleasure you get there is "abstracted" (again, whatever that means). While I think this makes more sense than the Islamic proposition of heaven, it's rather incomprehensible.

 

[Talha777]

The other option, which Christians believe, is that only your spirit goes to heaven

Its strange Christians believe only the "spirit" goes to Heaven, since they also believe like us in the resurrection of the BODY. Even the New Testament condemns the Sadduccee sect because they didnt believe in a bodily resurrection.

 

[جوري]

Except that it's not really abstracted because you apparently believe you will have a physical body in heaven,

So?-- what does having a physical body have to do with abstraction?

nearly identical to your current physical body. In heaven, Muslims will experience physical comforts, physical pleasures, physical sex, and eat physical food. There's no abstraction at all, we're talking about electrochemical nerve messages indicating pleasure and (in hell) pain in a physical body.

Not nearly identical, where did you get that from? how we are resurrected will be as we last left this earth, how we enter heaven or hell will be of a different creation any superficial research in Muslim text would have clarfied that to you.. nor can you claim with like bravado that it will be an 'electrochemical' event to translate to us pleasure or pain --did you bother listen to the sura at all before writing this?

we won't be bound by earth's rules or physical laws, no sun, no moon no death no sleep. This is a very expansive topic and what we know if it, is still limited to what we were allowed to know and in accordance with how far we can imagine. I can say there is such a thing in hell called Zaquoum, how would you know what that is? or a place in heaven called tasneem? again, How can you begin to imagine that? It might be assimilated to you, so your fancy head can awaken some horrifying or gratfying image based only on things you are familar with on this earth and have made an impact on you. If you can conceive that there are things on this very earth that you don't know shape, name or function of, it isn't so difficult to believe that there will be life after in a different realm, following a different set of rules and physical laws!

Can you hear sounds that are ultra or infra to the human audible frequency? can you understand speech that is between 17 to 30 Hz in range? it is possible you know they exist, but can't comprehend them. And still this is something within the realm of our knowledge to know whales communicate at that level, which is unintelligible to humans ... there is much we don't know and much we can't fathom, we'd be a completely different life form if we lived on the bottom of the ocean than in a fresh water pond.. people differ from region to region, climate, temperature even individual weight differs from planet to planet and as perceived by the same individual-- why then is it so incomprehensible that we'd be a different creation, that would feel satisfaction, pleasure, immortality with no pain, suffering or lowely desires?

The other option, which Christians believe, is that only your spirit goes to heaven (whatever that means) and thus whatever pleasure you get there is "abstracted" (again, whatever that means). While I think this makes more sense than the Islamic proposition of heaven, it's rather incomprehensible.

How exactly does being an apparition make more sense, perhaps you can elaborate on that? or actually don't bother, I don't care to waste my time on atheist antics.. my response was to the original poster and to briskly cover Islamic perspective, I don't expect that it should have an effect or impact on you... Perhaps the mods can erect a section for the lot of you to convey your insults, scorn and dismay with religion until you are all completely purged


cheers!