Saheeh hadeeth are wahy?

[Ümit]

Selamün aleyküm brothers and sisters,

I stumbled upon this question lately, and I'm struggling to find a satisfying answer to this.
I always thought that the Quraan is wahy (divine revelation) and the hadeeth can be hasaan (good) at best but it is not wahy (a divine revelation).

The difference, at least what I thought that the difference is:
that the Quraan comes from Allah (cc) and dictated by Muhammad (sas) so it is perfect to the last letter.
Hadeeth are just recordings from ordinairy humans of the prophet (sas) and cannot be perfect to the letter.
Besides especially the saheeh hadeeths have multiple recordings with slight variations because they come from different chains.
This last fact makes hadeeth more reliable because multiple people record the same event which makes it more evident that it is true.
but it also means that it is not perfect to the last letter
conclusion: hadeeth cannot be wahy.

So, my viewpoint on this was pretty clear and logical. And I thought all sunni's (or at least all of the four madhabs) share this opinion and viewpoint.
now I'm hearing that some scholars, especially from the shafi corner who say that saheeh hadeeth are wahy? This confused me.
can someone please elaborate on that? The only thing I found is that once, Muhammad ibn Idris al-Shafi'i declared that saheeh hadeeth were considered wahy to avoid some juridical dilemma. or something like that. Is it nowadays still the case? and with what reasoning?

My intention is not to confront any shafi brothers or sisters...or any brother or sister who have this opinion...I just want to learn. Please help me find an answer to this.

Aleyküm selam

 

[AabiruSabeel]

The Qur'an is wahy in literal sense, as in every letter is exactly how it was revealed to the Prophet , since it is the speech of Allah .
The Hadith is also revealed but spoken by the Prophet in his own words, because Allah says:

مَا ضَلَّ صَاحِبُكُمْ وَمَا غَوَىٰ
وَمَا يَنطِقُ عَنِ الْهَوَىٰ
إِنْ هُوَ إِلَّا وَحْيٌ يُوحَىٰ
عَلَّمَهُ شَدِيدُ الْقُوَىٰ
Your companion [Muhammad] has not strayed, nor has he erred,
Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination.
It is not but a revelation revealed,
Taught to him by one intense in strength - [Surah An-Najm: 2-5]

 

[Ümit]

Thank you for your answer brother,

but I think I dont quite find this answer satisfying.

The Prophet (sas) did not record any hadeeth as far as I know. So it cannot be his words.
The hadeeth are recorded by the companions and in their own words. Pretty obvious, because as I mentioned before, the same hadith can be recorded from different chains of narrations from different companions and can have a slight variation in the wordings.
Enough proof to say that the hadeeth are in the words of the companions and not in the words of Muhammed (sas).

my opinion: calling this wahy is the same mistake that christians made by declaring various writings as their Bible.
It's a slippery slope.
Surely Muhammad ibn Idris al-Shafi'i realized this too, but he still declared it wahy...so what am I missing?

I'm sorry brother, I am not trying to be rebellious...just asking to understand.

Aleyküm selam

 

[AabiruSabeel]

If you are talking about the actions of the Prophet that are recorded by the Sahabah , then yes, they are sayings of the Sahabah. But again, since the Prophet was always guided by Allah , all his actions are directly based on Wahy.
If you are talking about the sayings of the Prophet , then there is very little difference in how the Qur'an was recorded and the Hadith was recorded.
The Sahabah transmitted his sayings verbatim, as they transmitted the Qur'an, but the only difference is, the Qur'an was written down during the lifetime of the Prophet while the Hadith was written down later. Earlier the Prophet stopped the Sahabah from writing down the Hadith to prevent it from being mixed with the Qur'an. After he passed away, there was no such danger left and the Sahabah transmitted the Hadith by narrating to the future generations.
So once again, the Sahabah were very particular about narrating the exact words and actions of the Prophet, as we know from several Ahadith where they acted in the same way the Prophet acted while saying a Hadith.

Some of Ahadith have minor differences in wording in different chains. This could be due to many reasons. The Prophet might have said those words multiple times in different sittings with different Sahabah. Of course, we don't say that the Hadith is also direct wahy similar to the Qur'an. But Hadith are based on wahy from Allah , since the Prophet was taught by Allah to say what he said and to do what he did. In short, Hadith are an indirect form of wahy.

Also, consider the case of Hadith Qudsi, in which the Prophet relates what Allah says, but in his own words. So it is different from Qur'an but holds a higher status than other Ahadith.

 

[Ümit]

OK, I'm starting to understand now.
If I may summarize it in my own words, you are saying (please correct me if I'm wrong):

Just like the ayahs who were dictated to the sahabah, and they went on to memorize it and write it down, the same method was used with the hadeeth.
The difference is, that the ayahs come from Allah, and the hadeeth come from Muhammed (sas)...
However, since Muhammed (sas) is in direct control of Allah, and would not do or say things of his own desire, this means it is therefore considered wahy.

The speech of Muhammed (sas) can be transferred letter for letter on paper, so there can be little to no differences between the sahabas, but the recordings of the actions of Muhammed (sas) is dependent on different factors like which sahabah recorded it, his/her observation skills, how far was the observer at that point, etc.

Thank you very much for your answer.