The Marriage Thread

[Italianguy]

lololol. ;D I was kidding.

But anyway, iono. Is it just me or does it seem like it's hard to find people within your own race?

That raises another question. How well does it work out to marry someone from another race? There's a language and culture barrier, among other aspects.

It isn't hard to find someone within your own race in a family like mine. The women are picked for you, and if they are not to your liking you may find one yourself as long as the family approves first. NO ONE in my family as deviated from this tradition.

My first wife was a Greek woman. We didn't want to marry each other (it was arranged when we where 17) we wedded when we where 20. It only lasted 1 year as she was seeing someone else the whole time. The only reason we were arranged was for our 2 families to be joined together (it was good for the elders)? She left me for that man and now has a child by him. The only reason I am blessed from that marriage is my 7 year old son Cico.

I met my second wife (the Indian) at the accounting firm i used for my business. She was completeing her studies and internship at one of the big 4 accounting firms. I saw her one day (she was in charge of my account) and asked one of her coworkers if she was married, and if she was Christian. I didn't hear anything back for a week so i didn't pursue because i figured she was already married. Her boss called me one day and asked if I could come into the office and discuss a return. Her boss and I were talking and he just blurted out that she was single and a Christian........thats all i needed;D The next day i sent my brother to her with my cousin (a woman) to ask her if i could come to her place and speak with her and her father. My brother went to her house first and talked to her parents. 3 days later i got a call from her father requesting me to meet with him. We spoke for 2 days and after much debate he aggreed to let me ask her for her hand in marriage. Keep in mind i had only talked to her for no more than 5 minutes to say hello here is my paperwork;D

I asked her to marry me at a park where all of our parents followed us:hmm: while we spoke. It was good because we where from 2 totally different cultures, she being south Indian, me being Italian. So the families got allong greatttttt:raging: yeah right:hiding:

We don't have to much of a language barrier, she speaks Tamillian, Hindi and Urdu. I speak Italian, some Spanish and some Greek. So as you can tell.........were all screwed up;D I have learned Tamil....somewhat? But she has a very hard tie with Italian.....Her Indian accent is extremelly strong....but it sounds cute when she tries

The only problem we really have to deal with is others who don't understand us. We get allot of staresoh:oh:oh::coolious: especially from other Indians!imsad But other wise no one can understand us any way so they just think we are "Sum kinda foureners";D yeeeeeeeeeeee hawwwwww rid'em cowboy!;D we live in Virginia remember?! Home of the redneck;D

 

[★ηαѕιнα★]

That's nonsense. Not all sisters in the West are as you describe them...:skeleton:

I second that!:skeleton:
Well hmm shall I make up a topic then: Honeymoons. You know the travelling together to a cool country to spend some time together. Are they allowed in Islam or is it just something taken over from the western culture?

Ohh yea I forgot. Sorry I forgot as well...anyway this thread just died. I guess everyone ran out of juice :skeleton:

Ohhh boy, the talks I'm having with my mom lately....about this...:/

Getting very curious btw.. Is it female only thread material or appropriate for this thread as well?

 

[Insaanah]

I second that!:skeleton:
Well hmm shall I make up a topic then: Honeymoons. You know the travelling together to a cool country to spend some time together. Are they allowed in Islam or is it just something taken over from the western culture?

There are two opinions on the honeymoon. Most scholars state it is disallowed, some allow it.

First the ahadeeth:

Saheeh al-Bukhaari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 140:
Narrated Anas: The tradition, (of the Prophet) is that if someone marries a virgin and he has already a matron wife (with him), then he should stay with the virgin for seven days; and if someone marries a matron (and he has already a virgin wife with him) then he should stay with her for three days.

Saheeh al-Bukhaari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 141:
Narrated Anas: It is the Prophet's tradition that if someone marries a virgin and he has already a matron wife then he should stay for seven days with her (the virgin) and then by turns; and if someone marries a matron and he has already a virgin wife then he should stay with her (the matron) for three days, and then by turns.

In other words in the presence of a pre-existing wife, you need to spend more time with your new wife, even if it had been the previous wife's turn, and then by turns.

Islamqa says this:

What may be said about the honeymoon is that it is worse and more hateful, because it is an imitation of non-Muslims, and it wastes a lot of money. It also leads to neglect of many religious duties, especially if this time is spent in a non-Muslim country, because they come back with habits and customs that harm them and their society. These are things which we fear will adversely affect the ummah. But if a man travels with his wife for ‘umrah or to visit Madeenah, there is nothing wrong with that, in sha Allaah.

From: http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/87823/honeymoon

Islamonline says this:

Name of Questioner
Sa`ed - Egypt

Title
Can Muslims Go on Honeymoon?

Question
Scholars of Islam, As-Salamu `Alaykum wa Rahamtullah wa Barakatuh. Many Muslims go on honeymoon, but I see no evidence for this in the Qur'an or the Prophet’s hadiths. Isn't this blind aping of the West or are there benefits attached to such a practice?

Date
27/Feb/2003

Topic
Customs & Traditions

Answer

Wa `alaykum As-Salamu wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh.

In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Brother, first of all, let’s commend your deep reflection on the Book of Allah, the Qur’an, and the Sunnah of His Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) which is manifested in your question.

Islam is a practical religion; it does not float in the stratosphere of imaginary ideals but remains with the human being on the ground of realities and day-to-day concerns. It does not regard people as angels but accepts them as mortals who eat food and walk in the marketplace. Islam does not require of Muslims that their speech should consist entirely of religious utterances, that their silence should be a meditation, that they should listen to nothing except the recitation of the Qur'an, nor that they should spend all their leisure time in the mosque. Rather, it recognizes that Allah has created human beings with needs and desires, so that, as they need to eat and drink, they also need to relax, and to enjoy themselves.

Focusing more on the question in point, we’d cite the following fatwa issued by the late Sheikh Sayyed Mutawalli Ad-Darsh, former Chairman of the UK Shari`ah Council:

“First, we should not expect the Glorious Qur'an to be a prescription for every detail of things that happen in our day-to-day life. The Glorious Qur'an deals essentially with Allah's attributes and our relationship with Him. As it sets universal moral precepts that regulate life affairs, it also guides us to what will grant us salvation in the life to come. So, the Glorious Qur’an is mainly for the moral enhancement of society. The Sunnah of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) takes care of so many things.

There are many practices, customs and habits in Muslim societies, which change from time to time. As long as they don't encroach into the area which is Haram (unlawful), there is no restriction on them and we say they are subject to the changing requirements of society.

Things invented shortly after the time of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) include soap, new methods of sifting flour, the table and towels. These weren't considered bad because they are dealing with our ordinary day-to-day affairs.

As regards honeymooning, if a couple would like to relax and be far away from the distractions of family and friends, there is no harm. In fact, we can say that Western society is aping the Muslims on this, for we have a basis for honeymooning. It is Sunnah for the newly-married couple to spend seven days together, and it is beneficial for them to go out and enjoy this period of their life together to build a basis for all the trials and difficulties they will experience later on.”

Excerpted, with slight modifications, from: http://www.iol.ie/~afifi/Ad-Darsh/16.8.96.htm

From: http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaE&cid=1119503545216

I think the real issue is that honeymoon have become part of the marriage procedure in the west. i.e. marriage is followed by a honeymoon, and that's the norm and expected. Muslims, historically, have not felt the need to get on a plane and go somewhere as part of the after marriage process as that has not been prescribed for us in the sunnah and we have been encouraged to keep marriages simple. The fact that Muslims are doing it now, is, undoubtedly an imitation of the west. And it leads to more cost.

Those who have adopted non-Islamic rites in marriage, indulge in
extravagant expenses up to the point where financial loans are
necessary. Thousands of pounds are spent without thought or
consideration. A wedding dress alone can cost over five hundred
pounds and the same amount for a cake and if one were to add the
expense for rings, parties, hire of a hall, photographic expenses, the
honeymoon, meals and decoration of the home these can easily add
up to several thousand pounds.

If you look at the fact that it incurs more cost, as well as being an imitation of the non-Muslims, which are both things that we have been warned against, then the view that it should not be done is most in accordance with the sunnah. There is no doubting that the newly weds need to spend time together (no one disputes that fact), resting relaxing, maybe going on outings, but that does not necessitate a honeymoon as non-Muslims go on.

It is a blessing and one of countless mercies of Allah I that he has
made the deen simple and easy for us. However we have imposed
difficulties upon ourselves by incorporating rites and duties that have
no basis in the Shari'ah. Most people follow rites simply because their
ancestors, friends or people of the community do so. Anas (May Allah be pleased with him) reports that the Prophet :saws: said, "Do not put any hardship on yourselves, otherwise Allah will put hardship on you. Any nation which followed the path of hardship was put to hardship by Allah." Abu Dawud

If we look at our activities closely and in particular at weddings, we
will find that we have succumbed to our personal desires. Every rite is
conducted to please the wife/husband, children, parents, community,
friends and, above all, Shaytan. It is Allah the Creator and Sustainer we
fail to please. We have become so absorbed in the rituals of the non-Muslims that we consider them as our own

Those who have adopted non-Islamic rites in marriage, indulge in
extravagant expenses up to the point where financial loans are
necessary. Thousands of pounds are spent without thought or
consideration. A wedding dress alone can cost over five hundred
pounds and the same amount for a cake and if one were to add the
expense for rings, parties, hire of a hall, photographic expenses, the
honeymoon, meals and decoration of the home these can easily add
up to several thousand pounds.

This great burden of a wedding event which we put upon ourselves is a self-imposed hardship and is also depriving us of the mercy of Allah

Above quotes from: Wedding Customs, published by Fisabilillah publications

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

I second that!:skeleton:
Well hmm shall I make up a topic then: Honeymoons. You know the travelling together to a cool country to spend some time together. Are they allowed in Islam or is it just something taken over from the western culture?



Getting very curious btw.. Is it female only thread material or appropriate for this thread as well?

I'm not sure about the honeymoon thing unfortunately :skeleton:

And no it's not F-rated (Femaled rated) lollllll. It's appropriate I suppose

 

[Ibn Abi Ahmed]

Just a reminder to please avoid off topic posts and idle chit chat. This thread has potential to be really good..let's make it that way.

 

[S<Chowdhury]

We don't have to much of a language barrier, she speaks Tamillian, Hindi and Urdu. I speak Italian, some Spanish and some Greek. So as you can tell.........were all screwed up;D I have learned Tamil....somewhat? But she has a very hard tie with Italian.....Her Indian accent is extremelly strong....but it sounds cute when she tries

The only problem we really have to deal with is others who don't understand us. We get allot of staresoh:oh:oh::coolious: especially from other Indians!imsad But other wise no one can understand us any way so they just think we are "Sum kinda foureners";D yeeeeeeeeeeee hawwwwww rid'em cowboy!;D we live in Virginia remember?! Home of the redneck;D

Nice Bollywood story :statisfie ;D................ I got my lil own country western one haha my fiancee side like i said is full of red-necks and Red Indians (Native Americans correct terminology lol) so you can obviously assume when its family gathering time its a bit like cow boys and indians and then there is me :exhausted haha ........i think I'm the only South Asian guy there actually its a fact though her uncles wife is Greek lool real diverse family.

So i don't go fully of topic in terms of the question brother Rashad had about barriers between cultures its only a barrier if you let it be. Language hasn't been an issue for us though she has that American oops sorry Canadian accent( i can't tell the difference between the two though). So my future wife won't be able to cook the foods i enjoy and I'm use to though im willing to adapt plus with the invention of the rice cooker hard not to go wrong with the rice though the curry could do with a bit of work but im not to fussy ;D. Just a few examples but like i said it doesn't have to be a barrier you learn from each others cultures which i enjoy.

 

[S<Chowdhury]

On another note i just wanted to clarify whether a Muslim can marry a Christian?
I read that The marriages between Muslim men and CERTAIN non-Muslim women is allowed. However, certain restrictions exist on such marriages, especially if they occur in non-Muslim lands where Islamic law and religion is not
prevailing. If what i read is correct then what are those restriction that exist on the marriage?

Anyone direct me to a respectable source where i can find those answers? Much appreciated :statisfie

 

[-Fallen Angel-]

So my future wife won't be able to cook the foods i enjoy and I'm use to though im willing to adapt plus with the invention of the rice cooker hard to go wrong with the rice though the curry could do with a bit of work but im not to fussy ;D.

Maybe it's time for you to learn how to cook (if you don't already know).;D
But i agree whether or not a husband and wife are of similar culture or not, you can still enjoy life. It does not have to be an issue, unless you make it so.

 

[★ηαѕιнα★]

Maybe it's time for you to learn how to cook (if you don't already know).;D
But i agree whether or not a husband and wife are of similar culture or not, you can still enjoy life. It does not have to be an issue, unless you make it so.

Yeah I was wondering..How important is it for a man for his wife to be able to cook good food? Like could it be a reason for him to refuse marrying her??
Was wondering that for quite a while.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

^^But that would be silly no? :X

 

[Getoffmyback]

Actualy the best chefs in the world are men.

And its really nice for a man to learn how to cook . ? Guys? Do you know how to cook? Fried eggs are not considered cooking . Ok.

 

[S<Chowdhury]

Yeah I was wondering..How important is it for a man for his wife to be able to cook good food? Like could it be a reason for him to refuse marrying her??
Was wondering that for quite a while.

Again we are going back to culture ........in many south Asian culture its a necessity for a women to be able to cook.Yh i find it silly to not marry someone because they can't cook yet i think i need my future wife to cook I'm terrible at it :hmm:

 

[Italianguy]

Yeah I was wondering..How important is it for a man for his wife to be able to cook good food? Like could it be a reason for him to refuse marrying her??
Was wondering that for quite a while.

No it's not a good reason not to marry a woman because she can't cook:hmm:


.....There's always McDonalds;D

 

[Italianguy]

Again we are going back to culture ........in many south Asian culture its a necessity for a women to be able to cook.Yh i find it silly to not marry someone because they can't cook yet i think i need my future wife to cook I'm terrible at it :hmm:

Oh yeah! South Asian women can cook:statisfie.......If not for my wife's cooking, i would shrivle up and die:skeleton:.....I think i may be the only man on the planet that can burn water:embarrass

 

[Italianguy]

Nice Bollywood story :statisfie ;D................ I got my lil own country western one haha my fiancee side like i said is full of red-necks and Red Indians so you can obviously assume when its family gathering time its a bit like cow boys and indians and then there is me :exhausted haha ........i think I'm the only South Asian guy there actually its a fact though her uncles wife is Greek lool real diverse family.

So i don't go fully of topic in terms of the question brother Rashad had about barriers between cultures its only a barrier if you let it be. Language hasn't been an issue for us though she has that American oops sorry Canadian accent( i can't tell the difference between the two though). So my future wife won't be able to cook the foods i enjoy and I'm use to though im willing to adapt plus with the invention of the rice cooker hard not to go wrong with the rice though the curry could do with a bit of work but im not to fussy ;D. Just a few examples but like i said it doesn't have to be a barrier you learn from each others cultures which i enjoy.

I think the mixture of 2 cultures, is cool especially on the culinary side of it!;D

I introduced my wife to REAL Italian food (no not me, Mia madre cooks for us:embarrass)

And she introduced me to REAL south Indian foodhew:exhausted, .....I mean after your tastebuds heal, it's really tasty

I love the rice cooker! Saved my life plenty of times:embarrass

She is trying to teach me to cook.....sometimes. It's a good way to spend time together, but she usually kicks me out of the kitchen pretty quick....whilst yelling at me in Tamil, for stealing samosas:raging:..........:shade:

Dude your family sounds like mine......just reversed. But at least yours has some Greek too...Baklava is awesome!

 

[S<Chowdhury]

I think the mixture of 2 cultures, is cool especially on the culinary side of it!;D

I introduced my wife to REAL Italian food (no not me, Mia madre cooks for us:embarrass)

And she introduced me to REAL south Indian foodhew:exhausted, .....I mean after your tastebuds heal, it's really tasty

I love the rice cooker! Saved my life plenty of times:embarrass

She is trying to teach me to cook.....sometimes. It's a good way to spend time together, but she usually kicks me out of the kitchen pretty quick....whilst yelling at me in Tamil, for stealing samosas:raging:..........:shade:

Dude your family sounds like mine......just reversed. But at least yours has some Greek too...Baklava is awesome!

Yeah its interesting at times but you know how red necks get :exhausted....the first time i met them i felt quite fearful ;D but they are really soft once you get past the point of "So your marrying my niece are you ehhh (shot gun behind his back LOL) i joke but quite intimidating at times :hmm:.

Yeah Greek food is awesome (i picked up some words aswell as some nice food at a greek wedding , though i only remember 1 word now S'agapo) :statisfie.... my mum gave up trying to teach me to cook i kept on burning things aswell hehe, she always knew i needed a wife who could cook.

I think maybe marrying someone from a different culture is not for everyone though, if your not really interested in other cultures or experiencing other lifestyles and you just like the status quo meaning you want this-this-this and this type of attitude about it then marrying someone who's not from the same cultural background would definitely be out of the question

 

[S<Chowdhury]

Also found a article about


Does the wife have to cook?(Suni Path Online Islamic Academy)

"After marriage they are not obliged to cook for their husbands whatsoever, religiously, legally or morally. Rather, if the wife demands for prepared and cooked food, the husband will be responsible to bring her cooked food."

But we already knew that ^^^^^ Right?

 

[Italianguy]

Also found a article about


Does the wife have to cook?(Suni Path Online Islamic Academy)

"After marriage they are not obliged to cook for their husbands whatsoever, religiously, legally or morally. Rather, if the wife demands for prepared and cooked food, the husband will be responsible to bring her cooked food."

But we already knew that ^^^^^ Right?

It's a good thing I got my wife....if she depended on me to cook....you would be reading our obituary in the local paper:skeleton:

Obituary:

" On this day, 2/22/2010, we have the passing of to good people." "They died because the wife depended on the husband to cook." "After 5 days of the husband staring at the oven (trying to figure out how to turn it on) and staring aimlessly into the cubbards." "They soccumbed to starvation."......"Idioto's" The end

 

[Ummu Sufyaan]

Actualy the best chefs in the world are men.

And its really nice for a man to learn how to cook . ? Guys? Do you know how to cook? Fried eggs are not considered cooking . Ok.

i think its important for husbands to know how to cook. not to the extent where he takes over her role, but just enough to know what to do if she was to fall sick, be taken to hospital (and getting a 2nd wife doesn't count) or just to cook her a surprise meal. i really do think a man can cook good if he just made the effrt and had the confidence in himself.
sure, you maybe can go to your sisters and ask her for advice and all, but its best not to bother people if you can plus your wife would appreciate much much more if you (the husband) took it upon yourself to put in the effort and make her the meal yourself.

 

[Italianguy]

i think its important for husbands to know how to cook. not to the extent where he takes over her role, but just enough to know what to do if she was to fall sick, be taken to hospital (and getting a 2nd wife doesn't count) or just to cook her a surprise meal. i really do think a man can cook good if he just made the effrt and had the confidence in himself.
sure, you maybe can go to your sisters and ask her for advice and all, but its best not to bother people if you can plus your wife would appreciate much much more if you (the husband) took it upon yourself to put in the effort and make her the meal yourself.

Your totally right....I wish I could suprise my wife with a meal i prepared one dayimsad But i really stink at cooking, I never had to cook for myself, I am good at cleaning and doing dishes....but men in my family are never made to cook.

It would be nice to do that for my wife. I know she would appreciate it. Sometimes she cooks for so long in a day, she doesn't take the time to eat herself! I asked her the other day before we went to sleep what she ate...and she said "I was to busy, i forgot to" I would be soooo cool to make her dinner by myself:statisfie you know....without unpacking it from a resteruant;D