The sudden death

Interesting way to prove a point.
"Yeah I have the evidence, but I'm not going to show you"
 
^even if you were given evidence, would you evn take a bar of it....hmmm...
 
Are we debating that people dropping dead suddenly is a sign of the end times?

Diddnt they have heart attacks in the 1900's or 1800's, did strokes only occour in the late 20th century?

This is definatly one of those "chew your knuckles with your hands over your eyes "threads.
 
:salamext:

^ So are most threads where atheists come "debating"... *sigh*
 
ranma1/2 said:
So i gues thats a no.

Ill give you the criteria for evidnec.

Scientific.

There you go.
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dont twist my words. i didnt say it was a no. in fact if you look at my answer a lil more carefully, you'll realise that evidence is there, the 'even if you were given evidence' part. my question was would you take it, not if its there.
 
Ramlah said:
dont twist my words. i didnt say it was a no. in fact if you look at my answer a lil more carefully, you'll realise that evidence is there, the 'even if you were given evidence' part. my question was would you take it, not if its there.
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Im not twisting your words, im assuming that since you seem to be refusing to provide evidence or a link to one that you have none.
We will always except scientific evidence. So please provided it.

Perhaps in your answer you could highlight that evidence of yours, we seem to have missed it.
 
It was last year matey. check out Strong City/ michael travasser. the worlds only living current prophet.
The world ended in October last year.
 
# The disappearance of knowledge and the appearance of ignorance (Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn Majah, & Ahmad)
# Books/writing will be widespread and (religious) knowledge will be low (Ahmad)
# Adultery and fornication will be prevalent (The Prophet, peace be upon him, said that this has never happened without new diseases befalling the people, which their ancestors had not known.) (Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn Majah, & Al-Haythami)
# When fornication becomes widespread among your leaders (The Prophet, peace be upon him, said that this will happen when the people stop forbidding evil) (Ibn Majah)
# Adultery and fornication will be performed in the open
# The consumption of intoxicants will be widespread (Bukhari & Muslim)
# Women will outnumber men……eventually 50:1 (Bukhari, Muslim, & Ahmad)
# Killing, killing, killing (Bukhari, Muslim, Ibn Majah, & Ahmad)
# The nations of the earth will gather against the Muslims like hungry people going to sit down to a table full of food. This will occur when the Muslims are large in number, but “like the foam of the sea”.
# People will beat others with whips like the tails of oxen (Muslim) ?The Slave Trade
# The children will be filled with rage (at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# Children will be foul (at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# Women will conspire (at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# Rain will be acidic or burning (at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# Children of fornication will become widespread or prevalent (at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# When a trust becomes a means of making a profit (at-Tirmidhi, Al-Haythami)
# Gains will be shared out only among the rich, with no benefit to the poor (at-Tirmidhi)
# Paying zakat becomes a burden and miserliness becomes widespread; charity is given reluctantly (at-Tirmidhi & Al-Haythami)
# Miserliness will be thrown into the hearts of people (Bukhari)
# Episodes of sudden death will become widespread (Ahmad)
# There will be people who will be brethren in public but enemies in secret (He was asked how that would come about and replied, “Because they will have ulterior motives in their mutual dealings and at the same time will fear one another.”) (at-Tirmidhi)
# When a man obeys his wife and disobeys his mother; and treats his friend kindly while shunning his father (at-Tirmidhi)
# When voices are raised in the mosques (at-Tirmidhi)
# People will walk in the marketplace with their thighs exposed
# Great distances will be traversed in short spans of time
# The people of Iraq will recieve no food and no money due to oppression by the Romans (Europeans) (Muslim)
# People will hop between the clouds and the earth
# A tribulation will enter everyone�s home (Ahmad)
# The leader of a people will be the worst of them (at-Tirmidhi)
# Leaders of people will be oppressors (Al-Haythami)
# People will treat a man with respect out of fear for some evil he might do (at-Tirmidhi)
# Men will begin to wear silk (at-Tirmidhi)
# Female singers and musical instruments will become popular (at-Tirmidhi)
# When singers become common (Al-Haythami)
# People will dance late into the night
# When the last ones of the Ummah begin to curse the first ones (at-Tirmidhi)
# People will claim to follow the Qur’an but will reject hadith & sunnah (Abu Dawood)
# People will believe in the stars (Al-Haythami)
# People will reject al-Qadr (the Divine Decree of Destiny) (Al-Haythami)
# Time will pass rapidly (Bukhari, Muslim, & Ahmad)
# Good deeds will decrease (Bukhari)
# Smog will appear over cities because of the evil that they are doing
# People will be carrying on with their trade, but their will only be a few trustworthy persons
# Wealth will increase so much so that if a man were given 10,000, he would not be content with it (Ahmad & Bukhari)
# A man will pass by a grave and wish that he was in their place (Bukhari)
# Earthquakes will increase (Bukhari & Muslim)
# There will be attempts to make the deserts green
# The appearance of false messengers (30 dajjals) (Bukhari)
# Women will be naked in spite of being dressed, these women will be led astray & will lead others astray (Muslim)
# The conquest of Constantinople by the Muslims (Ahmad)
# The conquest of India by the Muslims, just prior to the return of Jesus, son of Mary (peace be upon both of them)(Ahmad, an-Nisa’i, at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# When people begin to compete with others in the construction of taller buildings (Bukhari)
# There will be a special greeting for the people of distinction (Ahmad)
# The Euphrates will disclose a treasure (The Prophet, peace be upon him, said that whoever is present should not take anything from it) (Bukhari & Muslim)
# Two large groups, adhering to the same religious teaching will fight each other with large numbers of casualties (Bukhari & Muslim)
# Wild animals will be able to talk to humans (Ahmad)
# A man will leave his home and his thigh or hip will tell him what is happening back at his home (Ahmad)
# Years of deceit in which the truthful person will not be believed and the liar will be believed (Ahmad)
# Bearing false witness will become widespread (Al-Haythami & Ahmad)
# When men lie with men and women lie with women (Al-Haythami)
# Trade will become so widespread that a woman will be forced to help her husband in business (Ahmad)
# A woman will enter the workforce out of love for this world (Ahmad)
# Arrogance will increase in the earth (at-Tabarani, al-Hakim)
# Family ties will be cut (Ahmad)
# There will be many women of child-bearing age who will no longer give birth.
# There will be an abundance of food, much of which has no blessing in it.
# People will refuse when offerred food.
# Men will begin to look like women and women will begin to look like men Source.
__
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all of dese were from Hadith books so r u askin us to provide u the page number, hadith number...ext?
 
They just ask for evidence get the hint! I believe no evidence will be sufficient for you guys, so no point showing it.

You took it with a pinch of salt did you not?
 
Mu'minah421 said:
all of dese were from Hadith books so r u askin us to provide u the page number, hadith number...ext?
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Do you sincerly believe those are scientic evidence?
And hamada if you actually had scientific evidence i would think you would happily show us instead of rerfusing to. Heck provide the evidence so others can see it not just us. Imagine you could be showing other generations scientific evidence that your claims are true.
 
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ranma1/2 said:
Do you sincerly believe those are scientic evidence?
And hamada if you actually had scientific evidence i would think you would happily show us instead of rerfusing to. Heck provide the evidence so others can see it not just us. Imagine you could be showing other generations scientific evidence that your claims are true.
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I truely do not know how to provide scientic evidence for the above ahadith.

Just to pick one out.

# People will claim to follow the Qur’an but will reject hadith & sunnah (Abu Dawood)

Now ranma here is a hadith (Abu Dawood) I would not have a clue on how to scientifically prove this to you! This hadith is quite old about 1400 years old, that time people followed the prophets(pbuh) sunnah aswell as the Quran, however now alot of people just claim to follow the quran and don't follow the sunnah propally.

The only science here is just to switch on your brain and think common sense.
 
Hamada said:
They just ask for evidence get the hint! I believe no evidence will be sufficient for you guys, so no point showing it.

You took it with a pinch of salt did you not?
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I must be missing something on this thread.. everyone is digressing all over the place... but what do we need to provide evidence for exactly?

If it is 'signs of the end' I suppose the only way to provide evidence is, if what was written/said actually materialized..

Does a scientific approach and a published Journal need to be out for that? lol

I published with a colleagues of mine an Indian fellow with awful bad breath named Atul, on Genomic fingerprinting using arbitrarily primed PCR and another one CD117 and gastrointestinal stromal tumors but I couldn't tie that together 'scientifically' with how the sun twinkled over Piney Run lake saturday and made the water sparkle like golden Jewels all the while contrasting it to the level of sparkle over the Hudson, I don't even think there is any good reason to...Some of the requests here are incongruous to the subject matter and frankly can only invite ridicule.... strange 'logic' that does not follow from any premise except perhaps for the sake of being disagreeable?...

:w:
 
Eve Persephone said:
I must be missing something on this thread.. everyone is digressing all over the place... but what do we need to provide evidence for exactly?

If it is 'signs of the end' I suppose the only way to provide evidence is, if what was written/said actually materialized..

Does a scientific approach and a published Journal need to be out for that? lol

I published with a colleagues of mine an Indian fellow with awful bad breath named Atul, on Genomic fingerprinting using arbitrarily primed PCR and another one CD117 and gastrointestinal stromal tumors but I couldn't tie that together 'scientifically' with how the sun twinkled over Piney Run lake saturday and made the water sparkle like golden Jewels all the while contrasting it to the level of sparkle over the Hudson, I don't even think there is any good reason to...Some of the requests here are incongruous to the subject matter and frankly can only invite ridicule.... strange 'logic' that does not follow from any premise except perhaps for the sake of being disagreeable?...

:w:
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Simply because if the receptor had bound to SCF and not formed a dimer, the the water would have sparkled like radient sapphires over the Mersey.

Duh!
 
barney said:
Simply because if the receptor had bound to SCF and not formed a dimer, the the water would have sparkled like radient sapphires over the Mersey.

Duh!
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oh.. since you've put it that way, you really sound like you know what you are talking about (work on the acronyms though)... definitely a topic for NEJM .. I hope the Muslims take heed and learn from your lead .. next time they write of the science of religion it should be journal worthy...

cheers
 
Eve Persephone said:
oh.. since you've put it that way, you really sound like you know what you are talking about (work on the acronyms though)... definitely a topic for NEJM .. I hope the Muslims take heed and learn from your lead .. next time they write of the science of religion it should be journal worthy...

cheers
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Huh? I havnt a freaking scooby doo what it all means, I just WiKied the whole lot.:D
 
I figured you a bit dyslexic but then thought perhaps you are a man ahead of your time and your thoughts simply leap faster than you can get it down on paper err web.. then I quickly shrugged that thought off...

yes the time for ---

Sleep-1.jpg


is upon us again..with that I bid you (plural) g'night

peace
 
What people are getting at is that most of that list are things which Islam considers to be unrighteous or unholy. The rest of the world has not been righteous or holy according to those standards at any time in recorded history, they are just generic statements about human nature. If you can show us that people weren't greedy at any point, or didn't die from cardiac arrest, we're all ears.

As it stands, you might as well say that the prerequisites for the day of judgement are the sky being blue and the grass being green.
 
actually Abrahamiac religions make up a large chunk of the world's population and various ideologies share with us the 'universal truths' ahtiests in fact only make up 2% of the world's population, and I'd like to think that it is an essential constituent of human nature to at least try in part to be decent and adhere to the laws that govern what it means to be 'human' with or without God on board-- the point was never to show you that being greedy isn't a part of human nature, or being a sloth isn't part of human nature.. it is to have control over the desires of the lower self that elevates man's status and distinguishes him.. surely there is a difference between someone who studies hard and earns a B and someone who studies very hard and earns an A.. same thing with religion and morality..

this is from one of my previous posts..
there are gradtion of morality, that which is instinctive.. and that in and of itself is an expansive topic, for where has this inherent aptitude come from?
and there is the finetuned, calibrated sense of morality..
to make an analogy between surgery and pathology..
surgery is kind of a primitve art, the methods used today are really no different than those used in pharonic Egypt.. then there is pathology. A surgeon might take out that lump near your neck but it is the pathologist that tells you, this is a pleomorphic adenoma or this is warthin's tumor or this is an oncocytomas, not this is a lymphoepithelial lesion, it is an adenoid cystic, it is a mucoepidermoid carcinomas etc etc etc..
You can think of what religion is to morality as pathology is to surgery..
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as for your last comment on heart attacks.. I am not following really... what does having or not having a heart attack have to do with religion, morality or scientific truths?

try to focus on what it is, you want the reader to understand, so we are not all struggling to designate meaning to arbitrary and reasonless statements!


cheers
 

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