Things in Islam I am curious about...

[جوري]

As long as you don't let it could your judgment of Christians per se.

Peace

I have many christian friends.. none of them are practicing though, they do like Christmas. one prefers Thanksgiving to Christmas because it hasn't gotten commercial yet... though neither are 'Christian holidays' with respect to its inherent nature.. but I can't blame them for being on the bends after the opinion I formed from some of the folks here.. I must admit, for a while I was beginning to mistrust them, thankfully bonds of friendship are stronger than those of sanctimony or so I have chosen to believe!

all the best

 

[Grace Seeker]

Is a Muslim who does not actually practice Islam still a Muslim? Maybe they celebrate Ramadan and the Feast of the Sacrifice along with their Muslim family and neighbors, maybe they don't even eat pork. They also don't read their Qur'an or dress modestly or attend prayers or practice charity. They do listen to music, go out alone on dates with unrelated members of the opposite gender unescorted, and even occassionally drink alcohol like when they do all of the above while dancing at a nightclub. Yet, they are what most in the secular world would call "good people," and would check Muslim on a questionaire. Would they still be considered a part of the Ummah?

 

[Tony]

If you say the shahada then you are muslim. The rest is dgrees of imaan (righteousness and devotion to Allahs covenant). Only God knows who is true within their heart

 

[Uthman]

If one fulfils the conditions of the Shahadah then they are considered a Muslim. If they do not fulfil all of their obligations and if they commit major sins then they are a sinful Muslim, but a Muslim nonetheless. I hope that makes it clear.

 

[Uthman]

It is important to note that Prophet Muhamamad (peace be upon him) also said (which is recorded in Sahih Muslim) that: The line between Islam and Kufr is Salah.

This shows that not performing the Salah renders one a Non-Muslim.

 

[Tony]

It is important to note that Prophet Muhamamad (peace be upon him) also said (which is recorded in Sahih Muslim) that: The line between Islam and Kufr is Salah.


Thanks for posting this Osman, I was not aware of it. Will be good reminder when finding salah hard to complete. Peace

 

[Grace Seeker]

It is important to note that Prophet Muhamamad (peace be upon him) also said (which is recorded in Sahih Muslim) that: The line between Islam and Kufr is Salah.

This shows that not performing the Salah renders one a Non-Muslim.

And pardon my ignorace, but I don't always know all of the appropriate Islamic terminology. Remind me again what is Salah.

 

[Uthman]

And pardon my ignorace, but I don't always know all of the appropriate Islamic terminology. Remind me again what is Salah.

My apologies. The Salah is the prayer.

 

[Whatsthepoint]

My apologies. The Salah is the prayer.

which brings me to a thing in islam I am curious about: why are certain arabic words sometimes transsribed ending with -at and sometimes with -ah, like salah, surah etc.

 

[Grace Seeker]

This shows that not performing the Salah renders one a Non-Muslim.

But you also said:

If one fulfils the conditions of the Shahadah then they are considered a Muslim. If they do not fulfil all of their obligations and if they commit major sins then they are a sinful Muslim, but a Muslim nonetheless.

So, now I am more confused. On the one hand, if anyone says the Shahadah they are Muslim. Even if they don't fulfill all of their obligations (like the prayers that I mentioned) they are still Muslims. Yet, if they are not performing Salah (which you said are the prayers) this renders one a non-Muslim. Can you see how the apparent conflict between those two statements might leave me confused?

 

[Uthman]

I was going to clarify that actually. You are of course correct and that is why I hastened to add the point about the Salah after my initial post.

The answer to your question is that the specific rule regarding the Salah is an exception to the general rule. The Salah is the minimum obligatory act that one should perform, below which they are not a Muslim.

 

[Tony]

My understanding of this is that once shahada said its up to us to gain in faith as much as possible, there is only a matter of how much punishment we recieve before entering Jannah and it determines our status while there. The only unforgiveable sin is atributing others along with Allah (ie Jesus) once accepting Islam as our religion, I am probably wrong about it being THE only unforgiveable sin, but Shahada is just enough to tip the scales as far as I am aware. The not performing salat issue has really shook me tho, and Alhamdulillah for it

 

['Abd-al Latif]

which brings me to a thing in islam I am curious about: why are certain arabic words sometimes transsribed ending with -at and sometimes with -ah, like salah, surah etc.

The actual word is sala-tun. You can say Salat, or Salah (making the last tun silent) or you can say salatun but this is very rare during normal conversation, unless one is quoting a hadeeth or ayaat in arabic. Saying either doesn't really make a difference. Same with Surah and other similar words.

A student of the Arabic language will testify to the depth, vastness and preciseness of the Arabic language (and it's truely a wonder why Allah revealed the Qur'an in the Arabic Language) so these words will make more sense in arabic. There isn't really a perfect way of spelling the arabic words in english so sometimes the use of certain letters or words can confuse people. Don't let it. It's just the arabic words written in a litteral sense in english.

 

[Uthman]

I am probably wrong about it being THE only unforgiveable sin

You are not wrong akhee. Shirk is the only sin that Allah does not forgive. Unless we repent of course, fulfilling the conditions of tawbah (repentance) in which case Allah will forgive even this sin.

 

[Uthman]

I am unsure about whether one should satisfy all the conditions of the Shahadah to be a Muslim or whether it is sufficient just to satisfy some of them. Somebody please clarify Inshaa'Allah.

 

[Hugo]

You are not wrong akhee. Shirk is the only sin that Allah does not forgive. Unless we repent of course, fulfilling the conditions of tawbah (repentance) in which case Allah will forgive even this sin.

Just a thought but Shirk might in a general sense be called unbelief and it is only a sin deserving of eternal separation from God if you die in unbelief because then it cannot be forgiven. It follows that once you believe then you cannot be committing that sin so there is no need for forgiveness so God forgives your former unbelief or time of separation from Him? Is this how you understand it?

 

[Uthman]

Hi Hugo

Just a thought but Shirk might in a general sense be called unbelief and it is only a sin deserving of eternal separation from God if you die in unbelief because then it cannot be forgiven. It follows that once you believe then you cannot be committing that sin so there is no need for forgiveness so God forgives your former unbelief or time of separation from Him? Is this how you understand it?

Islam makes a distinction between Shirk (associating partners with Allah) and Kufr (disbelief) and the two are not to be conflated.

The scholars have classified Shirk into two types:

- Major Shirk
- Minor Shirk

As for Major Shirk, this expels a Muslim from the fold of Islam. Minor Shirk, on the other hand, does not expel you from the fold of Islam but it is a sin. An example of minor shirk would be Ar-Riyaa. Thus, a Muslim can commit minor shirk.

I'm not sure whether I completely answered your question, but please ask if you need clarification.

 

[Grace Seeker]

Hi Hugo Islam makes a distinction between Shirk (associating partners with Allah) and Kufr (disbelief) and the two are not to be conflated.

The scholars have classified Shirk into two types:

- Major Shirk
- Minor Shirk

As for Major Shirk, this expels a Muslim from the fold of Islam. Minor Shirk, on the other hand, does not expel you from the fold of Islam but it is a sin. An example of minor shirk would be Ar-Riyaa. Thus, a Muslim can commit minor shirk.

I'm not sure whether I completely answered your question, but please ask if you need clarification.

Don't know about Hugo, but I know you raised more questions for me.


You said above

Shirk is the only sin that Allah does not forgive. Unless we repent of course, fulfilling the conditions of tawbah (repentance) in which case Allah will forgive even this sin.

So, if one is expelled from the fold of Islam for Major Shirk, how does one repent and return to the Ummah? Would one have to say the Shahadah a second time?

If Allah knows our hearts, as others have expressed, then why would one have to do or say anything?


If one returns to belief in Allah in accordance with the ways of Islam, then how would one still be considered guilty of shirk? Would that not be, colloquially speaking, "water under the bridge"?

And what happens if the sin is only "minor shirk", but one dies in that state? Would one then be prevented from entering Allah's presence because one is guilty of shirk?


Sorry for so many questions at one time.

 

[Uthman]

Hi Grace Seeker

I'm going to be honest and say that I am not 100% sure about the answers to any of those questions. I am not ashamed to say this though because of this:

Once a person approached Imam Malik and told him that he had come from Marrakesh --- after a six month journey --- only to ask a question. "My people back home are waiting for your answer," he said. After hearing the question Imam Malik replied, "Please tell your people that I do not know the answer to your question." In one case he was asked forty-eight questions and in response to thirty-two of them he said, "I don't know." It was commonly said that if somebody wrote down Imam Malik's answers to questions, he could easily fill pages with "I don't know" before writing a real answer.​

The reason for this extraordinary care was nothing but a deep sense of accountability before Allah. It was the caution of a person who was standing between Hell and Heaven, fearful that one wrong step could lead him to the former. "Before you answer a question about religious law, visualize that you are standing at the gates of Hell and Heaven," he used to advise others.​

I wasn't actually sure what you meant by your second question so maybe if you clarified that, I could answer it. Otherwise, I would prefer to leave it to somebody more knowledgeable and learn from the answer myself.

Regards

 

[Grace Seeker]

I wasn't actually sure what you meant by your second question so maybe if you clarified that, I could answer it. Otherwise, I would prefer to leave it to somebody more knowledgeable and learn from the answer myself.

Regards

You and Imam Malik are very wise. It is better to say I don't know, than to give a faulty answer.

As regards my second question: I was trying to ask about the conditions of repentance. You mentioned something about "the conditions of tawbah (repentance) in which case Allah will forgive even this sin."

As I understand repentance, it is something that takes place first in the heart. If Allah reads our hearts, and I assume Allah does, then would not Allah know whether or not we had repented? And if we had repented in our hearts, what other conditions (actions, words, deeds, rituals) would make a difference in changing that heart condition? And if these other conditions can't or won't change our heart condition which is already bent back toward Allah in submission in Islam, then what is the purpose of any of the conditions you mention that might be required? Perhaps it is good to show obedience once again, but it can't really be that these acts in anyway earn Allah's forgiveness do they? Isn't forgiveness Allah's gift to those who have strayed from the straight path -- that he accepts them as having returned to attempt to walk it once again even though they may yet stumble? If forgiveness is a gift, then why the emphasis on what we do as if we are to earn it? And if what we do is really the key to forgiveness, then how is that it is called a gift when it depends not so much upon Allah's willingness to forgive but our willingness to do certain acts to merit it? And if we really do merit it, how is that any different than saying that Allah owes it to us? And there is just something wrong about thinking that Allah could owe us anything. So, I'm back to thinking that forgiveness must be a gift, and if so, then it also cannot be dependent on what we do or say, so I don't understand what you would mean by "conditions of tawbah" that wouldn't negate the essence of forgiveness being a gift.


Hope you could follow all of that. mg: