Things in Islam I am curious about...

:sl:

Thats a Good Question Grace Seeker. Shouldn't we proud of our faith? if we are proud of our faith then why should we hide it?

Well see, in Islaam it also encourages us to think of the consequences of our actions. Perhaps when this person announces his Islam to his family they will discriminate him, maybe harm him in some way, and by doing that it will be a big blow to him who is probably dependant on them.
It's not about being proud of our faith or not, but it's about considering the situation about you, If you feel that you are strong enough to face rejection from family and such, and you are capable to go out there on your own, then alhamdulillah, but for some people it is not such.

If you are strong enough for it then like you said, Come out with it and be open and give thanks to Allah that you are capable to give praise to him, but people vary.
 
[QUOTE=zinaa/adultery which may lead to baby born without marriage

whts the fate of a baby born without marriage? i knw many pple like tht. are they considered outcasts in the society or community?
 


Salaam/peace ,


zinaa/adultery which may lead to baby born without marriage whts the fate of a baby born without marriage? i knw many pple like tht. are they considered outcasts in the society or community?[/QUOTE said:
----Islam does not say that punish the baby for parents sin . So , no one should ridicule the baby who is totally innocent.
 
Oh no, you misunderstand me. You are talking to a woman that never leaves the house without her head covered - how much of a declaration of my faith is that? Nothing short of a neon sign over my head saying Muslim can top that one. And I am very proud that my head cover lets people know of my faith. I do not wear it to impress people, I wear it to please Allah but it certainly denotes my faith.

I was suggesting that in the beginning, when you are unsure of yourself it is enough that Allah knows your true heart. In time when you become more confident you inevitably declare your faith. The issue of declaring faith in Islam is difficult purely because of the media and political retoric and the labels put on us - 'fanatics', 'extremists' and "all muslims are suicide bombers". We know that peer pressure is difficult for young people, I am not saying do whatever pleases your friends but you must accept that it can be difficult for young people to 'go against the grain'.

If these labels were attached to your faith what advise would you, as a pastor, give to young people?


Actually sometimes some of those labels are attached to the Christian faith. Not usually "suicide bomber", but "fanatic", "extremist", "fundy", "holy roller". I've even seen others ask if a new Christian was going to start blowing up abortion clinics. What I counsel young people is to answer all questions, "I've pledged to serve Christ in whatever he calls me to." When pressed with accussations, to let it back on the oppressor, "If you think Christ would be have in such a manner, that is your problem. The Christ I know would not." But generally, young people are not challenged by those accussations as much as by peer pressure to not take their faith seriously. To "enjoy" things that in Islam you would call haraam.

I appreciate that as a woman who never leaves the house without her head covered, that you indeed let your faith show publically. I think of two stories on here, a boy that wanted to be able to pray at school, but couldn't ask his parents to go with him to talk with the principle because he didn't want his parents to find out that he was Muslim. A girl that would not put on her headscarf until she left home because she didn't want her mom to find out that she had become a Muslim. Doesn't something seem wrong when you can go through the motions, but have to live a lie at home. (And while not technically lying, going to this much effort to keep something hidden, is definitely an act of deception with regard to one's parents.)
 


Salaam/peace ,


.....Please can someone tell me how this could lead me to sin or how these beautiful sentiments are the tools of the devil? Listening to this makes me want to pray, not commit adultery. Please forgive me, I am not trying to be antagonistic, I just really cannot see how this hadith is so strictlly interpreted.



--i know of a hadith where Prophet asked why nobody sent any singer to a newly wed girl's in-laws res because it was their custom to sing songs on wedding day.

In another hadith , people of Madina welcomed the Prophet (p) cheering & singing ( Yusuf Islam sang a wonderful song on this ' Tala Al badru ' ) when he migrated from Macca.

So , i also don't understand why & how all kinds of songs can be Haram. Sis , did u hear the song the veil of Dawud/ David Whrisby Ali ? It's so beautiful :) . Surely it will encourage Muslim women to wear veil . Also , his Life returns song on a Quranic verse is really good.

Do u have the link of the Islamic song u mentioned ?

 
Last edited:


Salaam/peace ,


...... Doesn't something seem wrong when you can go through the motions, but have to live a lie at home. (And while not technically lying, going to this much effort to keep something hidden, is definitely an act of deception with regard to one's parents.)



--if someone does anything under compulsion , out of fear ....s/he has no intention to disobey God then it's not a sin.

During the time of Prophet Muhammed (p) , few Muslims were forced to eat pork & uttered bad things about God & the Prophet of God. when they were freed & they came to the Prophet crying , then the verse revealed ( not the exact words) that assured Muslims that they did nothing wrong as it was not their intention.


If a young person fears that his/her parent will force to change the religion or will stop financing or can force him/her to leave home , then it's allowed for him/her to hide the religion.

Of Cource , we must respect parent but God comes first . So , to my knowledge , for the time being , s/he can hide identity & and proclaim Shahada is not a must even in front of Muslims.....may be encouraged but not a must .

Just curious.....if any Muslim teenager comes to u & say , hi , i m goona be a Christian but i don't earn & dad will kick me out of home if he finds out that Jesus (p) is my Saviour ; So i want to do it secretly .... then what advice will u give him ?

 
It seems weak to me to say, "Well, if you don't feel comfortable letting people know that you have faith in Allah, it is OK, as long as you have faith".... I know no one has said that they can just copy kufr activitiy, but isn't being ashamed or afraid to recognize Allah as first place in your life, making Allah something less than first place in your life?

To me it cheapens the value of faith to say: "It's enough for me and God to know about my faith. No one else needs to know, because I'm afraid of what might happend if they did."

I translate that to be: "No one else needs to know, because I lack faith to believe God will given me the protection I need to live openly for him."
Having lived through what you are talking about, I refer you to the post that came up today of my conversion story (Discover Islam/Stories of Muslim Reverts! Post yours here!) I can't speak for others, but the transition to becoming a Muslim from being a Christian in the "Bible Belt" USA was not an easy one.

I converted at the age of 21 and immediately told my family. As expected, my family was not very accepting of my decision and could not understand why I would "reject Jesus as my Saviour". My relations with my family instantly became more distant. Parental ties are difficult ones to "loosen", particularly when one is financially dependent upon them.

Another difficulty was the rigors of Islamic worship and learning a new language. Christian (Baptist/Church of Christ) worship was relatively easy - I would go to church on Sunday sing some uplifting/emotionally inspiring songs, partake of "the Lord's Supper", listen to a sermon and pray along with someone else. As a Muslim, I had to learn a completely different means of praying in a language (Arabic) that I had no prior knowledge of. The prayer was much more ritualistic than I had ever encountered with prerequisite specific bodily washings, facing a specific direction, reciting previously memorized portions of the Quran, and performing prescribed physical actions of bowing and prostrating. To top it off, I had to perform this ritual prayer 5 times a day. The fasting during the day for a month was also more rigorous than any fasting that I had done previously.

You may call it prejudice (or perhaps it is the group survival instinct), but my opinion is that people are more comfortable with people who are more similar to them (race, nationality, national subgroup, education level, economic background, etc). I personally had major difficulty in being the only Caucasian American in a double row of 50 or so Muslims praying synchronously. I remember my Muslim brothers being kind and patient as I learned, but still they were different in significant ways from the people I grew up with.

Even as early as 1981, Islam was associated in the media with "terrorist" acts, particularly in Palestine & Iran hostage crisis. Sincere Christians are generally not violent people and abhore associating with them. Subconciously, I also did not want to be associated with people, as the media constantly reminded me, who did these acts.

It took me until the age of 41, which was 20 years after converting, that I was able to overcome all of these difficulties and make the final commitment to practice Islam. Perhaps, it was that my fear of Allah's eternal punishment overcame my worldly fears. I know that you did not mean it in a bad way, but, yes, each new convert in the West must overcome a certain amount of fear to openly practice Islam today.

Allah has willed that I have consistently (though imperfectly) practiced Islam since June 2001. Yes, I had to overcome the fear of being a social outcast, the fear of losing my job or not getting promoted, the fear of my marriage to a Christian breaking up, and the fear of being sent to prison (Patriot Act). I basically decided that regardless of the cost, I was going to practice the religion that I believed to be the Truth.

The point of this lengthy discussion is that if one chooses to keep his conversion private until his faith is strong enough to accept the rejection of his family and the other consequences of "going public" then I would encourage him/her to do so. The transformation to becoming a Muslim is not instataneous any more than a caterpiller becoming a butterfly is, but the process is certainly worth it and I would not want to compromise the end result.

I understand your point, but I would encourage patience and tolerance towards converts/reverts.
 


Just curious.....if any Muslim teenager comes to u & say , hi , i m goona be a Christian but i don't earn & dad will kick me out of home if he finds out that Jesus (p) is my Saviour ; So i want to do it secretly .... then what advice will u give him ?


I have already answered that above. I would remind them of the words of Jesus: "Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me." (Matthew 10: 37-38)
and
"If anyone is ashamed of me and my words, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when he comes in his glory and in the glory of the Father and of the holy angels." (Luke 9:26)


I have a friend who grew up a Christian in Malaysia, he said that the scenario you suggest is exactly what they lived with. That on more than one occassion police came into the church to arrest Muslims who had sought to convert to Christianity.

Not all Christians are asked to suffer, but many do --sometimes in big ways, sometimes in small ways. It is part of being in the world but not of the world. And so we are reminded: "If you suffer, it should not be as a murderer or thief or any other kind of criminal, or even as a meddler. However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name." (1 Peter 4:15-16)
 


Salaam/peace ,


I have already answered that above. (1 Peter 4:15-16)


There is a story in Bible like that.....i read about that long ago. Prophet Abraham (p) introduced his wife as sister to a king.

I read somewhere that he did that because it was the custom of that time or area that nobody assaulted sis in front of bro. so , to protect wife , he hide her that identity. Does not it mean that when u r in danger , u r allowed to hide info ?




 
Actually sometimes some of those labels are attached to the Christian faith. Not usually "suicide bomber", but "fanatic", "extremist", "fundy", "holy roller". I've even seen others ask if a new Christian was going to start blowing up abortion clinics. What I counsel young people is to answer all questions, "I've pledged to serve Christ in whatever he calls me to." When pressed with accussations, to let it back on the oppressor, "If you think Christ would be have in such a manner, that is your problem. The Christ I know would not." But generally, young people are not challenged by those accussations as much as by peer pressure to not take their faith seriously. To "enjoy" things that in Islam you would call haraam.

I appreciate that as a woman who never leaves the house without her head covered, that you indeed let your faith show publically. I think of two stories on here, a boy that wanted to be able to pray at school, but couldn't ask his parents to go with him to talk with the principle because he didn't want his parents to find out that he was Muslim. A girl that would not put on her headscarf until she left home because she didn't want her mom to find out that she had become a Muslim. Doesn't something seem wrong when you can go through the motions, but have to live a lie at home. (And while not technically lying, going to this much effort to keep something hidden, is definitely an act of deception with regard to one's parents.)

I was a christian for more than 30 years before I converted to Islam so am aware of the 'bible bashing' comments, my own father (a strict athiest) made awful fun of me as a child. So I think I am in a position to comment from both sides (only my personal opinions of course). From this comment you can take an educated guess at my age and even at the age I was when I converted I was terrified to tell my parents - Why? Because yes as a christian you can be taunted but family and friends are unlikely to exclude you or whisk you off to the psychiatrist (yes this has been done to a young convert I met).

I watched a UK documentary recently on the intigration of Muslims into US society, it was wonderful but it is not like that everwhere. Am I saying young people should hide their faith, No, I am just saying they should take their time. Take for example the issue of dress, if a young girl wishes to convert to Islam the first thing people will ask her about is the 'dress code'. Now if you read some of the threads on this site you can see clearly that women born Muslim still 'discuss' the rights and wrongs of the dress code, so how is a young girl with little knowledge of Islam going to answer this question?

I have not been a member long enough to know of the two stories you mentioned above. To be honest what I read shames me, as a convert it is incumbent upon me to assist in any way I can any person wishing to convert. These young people must have come into contact with other Muslims in order to wish to convert, so who is helping them? I don't mean teaching the Quran, that is for Islamic scholars to do but what about the social issues? My suggestion in such a case would be to get an older convert to go with the young person to discuss the issue with the parents. I have done this twice now and whilst it doesn't mean that the parents are delighted about the idea, it does give them a sounding board, I was able to answer some of the basic questions and I was living 'proof' if you like that just because you convert to Islam you do not automatically become a 'lunatic'. Of course the success of this would depend on the attitude of the older convert or it may just backfire.

My question to you is how would you have advised me as a young person, lets say I wanted to join your church but told you my parents would kick me out of the house because they are strict athiests.
 


Salaam/peace ,

Sis , did u hear the song the veil of Dawud/ David Whrisby Ali ? It's so beautiful :) . Surely it will encourage Muslim women to wear veil . Also , his Life returns song on a Quranic verse is really good.

Do u have the link of the Islamic song u mentioned ?


I haven't heard this singer before, thanks for the recommendation I will try to get hold of some of his music. Sami Yusuf also sings a wonderful song called Piece of Scarf which talks about the abuse we face by wearing the cover and explaining we do it for Allah - it makes me cry :statisfie

I am sorry but I don't have a link for the song I mentioned, I will try to find it but be patient I am not very computer literate.
 


Salaam/peace ,


I haven't heard this singer before, thanks for the recommendation I will try to get hold of some of his music.

links :D




Dawud Wharnsby

03.jpg


What Did I Do Today?

The Veil

The Everything Song

Life Returns


http://www.islamonline.net/English/ArtCulture/audio.shtml

http://www.unc.edu/depts/europe/conferences/Veil2000/lyrics/theveil.htm


'Hijab: An Act of Faith'
Real audio clip


Lyrics

They say, "Oh, poor girl, you're so beautiful you know
It's a shame that you cover up your beauty so."


She just smiles and graciously responds reassuringly,
"This beauty that I have is just one simple part of me.

This body that I have, no stranger has the right to see.


These long clothes, this shawl I wear, ensure my modesty.
Faith is more essential than fashion, wouldn't you agree?



This hijab,
This mark of piety,
Is an act of faith, a symbol,
For all the world to see.

A simple cloth, to protect her dignity.
So lift the veil from your heart to see the heart of purity.

 
Last edited:
Thank you sis that is wonderful. Try this one, you can listen to it free at www.lyricster.net/lyrics/Sami-Yusuf/Free/

Sorry it's such a long post and my apologies to those that think music is haraam.


What goes through your mind?
As you sit there looking at me
Well I can tell from your looks
That you think I’m so oppressed
But I don’t need for you to liberate me

My head is not bare
And you can’t see my covered hair
So you sit there and you stare
And you judge me with your glare
You’re sure I’m in despair
But are you not aware
Under this scarf that I wear
I have feelings, and I do care

CHORUS:
So don’t you see?
That I’m truly free
This piece of scarf on me
I wear so proudly
To preserve my dignity...

My modesty
My integrity
So don’t judge me
Open your eyes and see...
“Why can’t you just accept me?” she says
“Why can’t I just be me?” she says
Time and time again
You speak of democracy
Yet you rob me of my liberty
And all I want is equality
Why can’t you just let me be free?

For you I sing this song
My sister, may you always be strong
From you I’ve learnt so much
How you suffer so much
Yet you forgive those who laugh at you
You walk with no fear
Through the insults you hear
Your wish so sincere
That they’d understand you
But before you walk away
This time you turn and say:

But don’t you see?
That I’m truly free
This piece of scarf on me
I wear so proudly
To preserve my dignity
My modesty
My integrity
So let me be
She says with a smile
I’m the one who’s free
 


Salaam/peace ,





There is a story in Bible like that.....i read about that long ago. Prophet Abraham (p) introduced his wife as sister to a king.

I read somewhere that he did that because it was the custom of that time or area that nobody assaulted sis in front of bro. so , to protect wife , he hide her that identity. Does not it mean that when u r in danger , u r allowed to hide info ?





The event is described in Genesis 12:10-20. The reasons are not quite as you have given them. It was not to prevent Abraham's wife, Sarah, from being assaulted, but to prevent Abraham from being killed by the king who he assumed would want to take Sarah as his own wife because of her beauty. So, it is as you suggest that fear was the motivating factor.

Speaking for myself alone, I do not think that this was something admirable which Abraham did here, and do not lift it up as a model for others. For me, the recording of it in the Bible simply shows that even God's best were flawed humans just as the rest of us are, yet God was able to use them and thus he can use us also if we will but submit to him.
 


Salaam/peace ,


..... it is as you suggest that fear was the motivating factor.

Speaking for myself alone, I do not think that this was something admirable which Abraham did here....


so , u believe Abraham (p) should have told the whole but not the half :giggling: :p truth & let the king killed him & made Sarah (ra ) a widow ?

Is it a sin if out of fear for life , one hides info ?

 
A very interesting thread. I did not know musical instruments were considered harmful in Islam, or pork was forbidden.
I also did not know until doing some reading here men were forbidden to wear silk, or that the growing of a beard was commanded by the prophet(pbuh).
Praying five times a day, facing east, ceremonial washing, fasting during ramadan, pilgrimage....those that are reverts have undergone more of a transformation than I thought.
What other behavior things must be done and changes must be made.....or dare I ask?

Or perhaps to keep on topic I should say Grace Seeker, what other things have you wondered about in Islam?
 

Similar Threads

Back
Top