Was Muhammad (P.B.U.H) a True Prophet?

You said several isues would have arisen if all slaves had been freed abrubtly, bt I don't see why this would have the case. tehc apable ons could live as free men, even as servants if they wanted, whereas the less capable ones could stay with their masters and work in order to get food, clothing etc. Nothing would change except they'd be free!
what are you saying? They don't need to pay the ransom?
Well hadiths prophet (p) told people not call them slaves. Thats what I've been saying there is not much difference. Ransom issue is acceptable in that kind of economy, because if a person working in the house leaving it can cause problem for a household. But if person working house doesn't want to leave, then there is no point in asking to set him free and he/she will work for free (it is same thing).
 
I have read the script at the link you gave and of course it is a sanatised version put out to try and counter this unnacceptable aspect of the Qu’ran.

Below is the wikipedia version which, I would suggest, is unbiased. And please note that all references to Muhammed freeing slaves was only after they converted to Islam - (no conversion - no freedom).

Slavery in the Qur'an ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_and_slavery#Slavery_in_the_Qur.27an )

The Qur'an includes multiple references to slaves, slave women, slave concubinage, and the freeing of slaves. It accepts the institution of slavery. It may be noted that the word 'abd' (slave) is rarely used, being more commonly replaced by some periphrasis such as ma malakat aymanukum ("that which your right hands own"). The Qur'an recognizes the basic inequality between master and slave and the rights of the former over the latter. The historian Bruschvig states that from a spiritual perspective, "the slave has the same value as the free man, and the same eternity is in store for his soul; in this earthly life, failing emancipation, there remains the fact of his inferior status, to which he must piously resign himself."[3] [15] The Qur'an also recognizes concubinage.[16][17] A master may make his female slave as his concubine and, if she is a Muslim, he can marry her. Abstinence however is said to be a better choice.[2] The Qur'an urges, without commanding, kindness to the slave[18] and recommends, their liberation by purchase or manumission. The freeing of slaves is recommended both for the expiation of sins[19] and as an act of simple benevolence.[20] It exhorts masters to allow slaves to earn or purchase their own freedom (manumission contracts)."[16]
Slaves are mentioned in at least twenty-nine verses of the Qur'an, most of these are Medinan and refer to the legal status of slaves. The legal material on slavery in the Qur'an is largely restricted to manumission and sexual relations.[2] According to Sikainga, the Qur'anic references to slavery as mainly contain "broad and general propositions of an ethical nature rather than specific legal formulations."[21]
The Quran accepts the distinction between slave and free as part of the natural order and uses this distinction as an example of God's grace,[22] regarding this discrimination between human beings as in accordance with the divinely-established order of things.[2][23] "The Qur'an, however, does not consider slaves to be mere chattel; their humanity is directly addressed in references to their beliefs,[24] their desire for manumission and their feelings about being forced into prostitution.[25] In one case, the Qur'an refers to master and slave with the same word, rajul. Later interpreters presume slaves to be spiritual equals of free Muslims. For example,[26] urges believers to marry 'believing maids that your right hands own' and then states: "The one of you is as the other," which the Jalaalayn interpret as "You and they are equal in faith, so do not refrain from marrying them." The human aspect of slaves is further reinforced by reference to them as members of the private household, sometimes along with wives or children.[2] Pious exhortations from jurists to free men to address their slaves by such euphemistic terms as "my boy" and "my girl" stemmed from the belief that God, not their masters, was responsible for the slave's status.[27]
There are many common features between the institution of slavery in the Qur'an and that of neighboring cultures. However, the Qur'anic institution had some unique new features.[2] Bernard Lewis states that the Qur'anic legislation brought two major changes to ancient slavery which were to have far-reaching effects: presumption of freedom, and the ban on the enslavement of free persons except in strictly defined circumstances.[16] According to Brockopp, the idea of using alms for the manumission of slaves appears to be unique to the Qur'an, assuming the traditional interpretation of verses [Qur'an 2:177] and [Qur'an 9:60]. Similarly, the practice of freeing slaves in atonment for certain sins appears to be introduced by the Qur'an (but compare Exod 21:26-7).[2] The forced prostitution of female slaves, a Near Eastern custom of great antiquity, is condemned in the Qur'an.[14][28]Murray Gordon notes that this ban is "of no small significance."[29] Brockopp writes: "Other cultures limit a master's right to harm a slave but few exhort masters to treat their slaves kindly, and the placement of slaves in the same category as other weak members of society who deserve protection is unknown outside the Qur'an. The unique contribution of the Qur'an, then, is to be found in its emphasis on the place of slaves in society and society's responsibility toward the slave, perhaps the most progressive legislation on slavery in its time."[2]
Muhammad's traditions
The Islamic prophet Muhammad encouraged manumission of slaves, even if one had to purchase them first. On many occasions, Muhammad's companions, at his direction, freed slaves in abundance. Muhammad personally freed 63 slaves, and his wife Aisha freed 67.[30] In total his household and friends freed 39,237 slaves.[31] The most notable of Muhammad's slaves were: Safiyya bint Huyayy, whom he freed and married; Maria al-Qibtiyya, given to Muhammad by a Byzantine official, whom he freed and who may have become his wife;[32] Sirin, Maria's sister, whom he freed and married to the poet Hassan ibn Thabit[33] and Zayd ibn Harithah, whom Muhammad freed and adopted as a son.[3



A sanitized version?


So let me get this straight. You come here and inquire about the Islamic response to your slavery question. You then:

1. Get an Islamic answer
2. Dismiss it as a sanitized version and press your OWN opinion of the issue
3. Cite Wikipedia, which is available for ANYONE, scholar or not, as your PREFERRED answer which supports your own view.



So If you ask for our response, then dismiss our response, why ask for it in the first place?

Islam solves slavery in the most practical manner which is what matters if you want to see real life solutions.
 
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A sanitized version?


So let me get this straight. You come here and inquire about the Islamic response to your slavery question. You then:

1. Get an Islamic answer
2. Dismiss it as a sanitized version and press your OWN opinion of the issue
3. Cite Wikipedia, which is available for ANYONE, scholar or not, as your PREFERRED answer which supports your own view.



So If you ask for our response, then dismiss our response, why ask for it in the first place?

Islam solves slavery in the most practical manner which is what matters if you want to see real life solutions.
I accept your criticism; wikipedia has its place and value but for the discussion here I accept it’s not the most appropriate.
I am keen to stay on topic and the topic isn’t about how many slave Muhammad freed, in my view, it’s about whether God would have condoned the practice. It is clear that Muhammad enslaved people, kept slaves and bought and sold slaves, I believe he also married a few – that’s all fact. The question is, under those circumstances, when God was dictating verses on how people should lead their lives, for God to condone such practice contradicts the definition of God.

See here an hadith and tell me what crime the child in question did to make it right that he/she should be enslaved.

Book 11, Number 2126:
Narrated Basrah:
A man from the Ansar called Basrah said: I married a virgin woman in her veil. When I entered upon her, I found her pregnant. (I mentioned this to the Prophet). The Prophet said: She will get the dower, for you made her vagina lawful for you. The child will be your slave. When she has begotten (a child), flog her (according to the version of al-Hasan). The version of Ibn AbusSari has: You people, flog her, or inflict hard punishment on her.
 
Well hadiths prophet (p) told people not call them slaves. Thats what I've been saying there is not much difference. Ransom issue is acceptable in that kind of economy, because if a person working in the house leaving it can cause problem for a household. But if person working house doesn't want to leave, then there is no point in asking to set him free and he/she will work for free (it is same thing).
Why does god care more about the well being of a household, which is not really an issue, they can simply hire a new servant, than the freedom of an individual?
 
I accept your criticism; wikipedia has its place and value but for the discussion here I accept it’s not the most appropriate.
I am keen to stay on topic and the topic isn’t about how many slave Muhammad freed, in my view, it’s about whether God would have condoned the practice. It is clear that Muhammad enslaved people, kept slaves and bought and sold slaves, I believe he also married a few – that’s all fact. The question is, under those circumstances, when God was dictating verses on how people should lead their lives, for God to condone such practice contradicts the definition of God.

See here an hadith and tell me what crime the child in question did to make it right that he/she should be enslaved.

Book 11, Number 2126:
Narrated Basrah:
A man from the Ansar called Basrah said: I married a virgin woman in her veil. When I entered upon her, I found her pregnant. (I mentioned this to the Prophet). The Prophet said: She will get the dower, for you made her vagina lawful for you. The child will be your slave. When she has begotten (a child), flog her (according to the version of al-Hasan). The version of Ibn AbusSari has: You people, flog her, or inflict hard punishment on her.



It seems like you are confusing the western concept of slavery and their treatment with what the Quran calls slavery. Slave is a strange word to give a child whom you are responsible to take care of in health and sickness. Whom you are to provide an education. Whom you are to treat like a member of the family. And who, if they request freedom, you are to free and even give parting gifts if you so desire. I'd say the child got a good deal instead of being thrown in a dingy orphanage with noone to take personal care of them.






In addition to this, do you realize what he did with those slaves? They were more akin to the maids and butlers we have in present time. But he treated them better than people in modern times even treat their maids.

1. He never yelled at them.
2. He provided for them all the necessities of life and comfort.
3. He was friends with them and freed as many as he could after he bought them. He took their advice and accepted them as family.
4. In fact he bought slaves jsut to free them too.
5. he never overworked them at all and was always benevolent and fair to them and helped them get an education and learn islam too
6. If they asked for freedom he gave it but many preferred to stay with him while being servants and even after being free




QURANIC SLAVERY ISNT EVEN REAL SLAVERY! WHAT IS THE BAD PART HERE?????????????

Point out where these people are being degraded.


Face it. This discussion is not about the concept of slavery in Islam. It is about your dislike of the word slavery, your ideas on what that means, and your inability to comprehend that those negative ideas are not present in the way the Quran treats these slaves, maids, workers or whatever you want to call them.
 
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After being done with my above post, I hope you realize that a child deemed a ''slave" in Islam is basically treated like an adopted child with the burden of care that is assigned to the owner.

A woman or man deemed a "slave" is basically a member of the family and loses no honor or pride and is free to leave anytime they want.




You see the success of Islam? It has destroyed slavery by blurring the line between slave and family so much so that a man who adheres to the principles of the Prophet pbuh could pass his slave off as his child or sibling to a stranger.

There are other ways of breaking the shackels of slavery rather than brute force.
 
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See here an hadith and tell me what crime the child in question did to make it right that he/she should be enslaved.

Book 11, Number 2126:
Narrated Basrah:
A man from the Ansar called Basrah said: I married a virgin woman in her veil. When I entered upon her, I found her pregnant. (I mentioned this to the Prophet). The Prophet said: She will get the dower, for you made her vagina lawful for you. The child will be your slave. When she has begotten (a child), flog her (according to the version of al-Hasan). The version of Ibn AbusSari has: You people, flog her, or inflict hard punishment on her.


Peace

Look what is written regarding such hadith by the classic scholars:


Arabic:
قَالَ الْحَافِظ شَمْس الدِّين اِبْن الْقَيِّم رَحِمَهُ اللَّه : ‏
‏هَذَا الْحَدِيث قَدْ اُضْطُرِبَ فِي سَنَده وَحُكْمه , وَاسْم الصَّحَابِيّ رَاوِيه . فَقِيلَ : بَصْرَة بِالْبَاءِ الْمُوَحَّدَة وَالصَّاد الْمُهْمَلَة , وَقِيلَ نَضْرَة : بِالنُّونِ الْمَفْتُوحَة وَالضَّاد الْمُعْجَمَة وَقِيلَ : نَضْلَة , بِالنُّونِ وَالضَّاد الْمُعْجَمَة وَاللَّام , وَقِيلَ : بُسْرَة بِالْبَاءِ الْمُوَحَّدَة وَالسِّين الْمُهْمَلَة وَقِيلَ : نَضْرَة بْن أَكْثَم الْخُزَاعِيّ , وَقِيلَ : الْأَنْصَارِيّ , وَذَكَرَ بَعْضهمْ : أَنَّهُ بَصْرَة بْن أَبِي بَصْرَة الْغِفَارِيُّ , وَوَهِمَ قَائِله . وَقِيلَ بَصْرَة هَذَا مَجْهُول , وَلَهُ عِلَّة عَجِيبَة , وَهِيَ أَنَّهُ حَدِيث يَرْوِيه اِبْن جُرَيْجٍ عَنْ صَفْوَان بْن سُلَيْمٍ عَنْ سَعِيد بْن الْمُسَيِّب عَنْ رَجُل مِنْ الْأَنْصَار . وَابْن جُرَيْجٍ لَمْ يَسْمَعهُ مِنْ صَفْوَان , إِنَّمَا رَوَاهُ عَنْ إِبْرَاهِيم بْن مُحَمَّد بْن أَبِي يَحْيَى الْأَسْلَمِيّ عَنْ صَفْوَان , وَإِبْرَاهِيم هَذَا مَتْرُوك الْحَدِيث : تَرَكَهُ أَحْمَد بْن حَنْبَل وَيَحْيَى بْن مَعِين وَابْن الْمُبَارَك , وَأَبُو حَاتِم وَأَبُو زُرْعَة الرَّازِيَّانِ وَغَيْرهمْ ! وَسُئِلَ عَنْهُ مَالِك بْن أَنَس : أَكَانَ ثِقَة ؟ فَقَالَ : لَا , وَلَا فِي دِينه . ‏
‏وَلَهُ عِلَّة أُخْرَى : وَهِيَ أَنَّ الْمَعْرُوف أَنَّهُ إِنَّمَا يُرْوَى مُرْسَلًا عَنْ سَعِيد بْن الْمُسَيِّب عَنْ النَّبِيّ صَلَّى اللَّه عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ , كَذَا رَوَاهُ قَتَادَة وَيَزِيد بْن نُعَيْم وَعَطَاء الْخُرَاسَانِيّ . كُلّهمْ عَنْ سَعِيد عَنْ النَّبِيّ صَلَّى اللَّه عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ . ذَكَرَ عَبْد الْحَقّ هَذَيْنِ التَّعْلِيلَيْنِ , ثُمَّ قَالَ : وَالْإِرْسَال هُوَ الصَّحِيح .

English:

This hadith has problems in its chain of narrators (isnad),the name of its narrator is uncertain....it is said to be called (basra) or (nadra) or (nadla) or (nadra bin aktham alkhoza3i) or (alansari).....
others said he may be (basra ben abi basra alghafari)....
it is said that this (Basra) is unknown ..
the hadith has astonishing problem,it is the fact that it was narrated by Ibn Gareeh,who didnt hear Safwaan but heard it from Ibrahimbin safwaan...
and this Ibrahim is untrustworthy and been rejected by the scholars.......


http://hadith.al-islam.com/Display/Display.asp?hnum=1820&doc=4&IMAGE#Desc2
 
Why does god care more about the well being of a household, which is not really an issue, they can simply hire a new servant, than the freedom of an individual?
Where they would have hired new one? Slaves who were leaving wouldn't need to work as servant, who did need they weren't leaving.

It was practical for that times socio-economic situation. People who could freed slaves without anything at all. Many companions of prophet went extra mile and freed slaves paying out of their pocket for other people even if it meant that they had to spend everything they had. But many other people couldn't do that. There was no concept of paying for house work at that time, and poorer families would have suffered the most. It was a practical approach suited for that socio-economic situation.
 
It seems like you are confusing the western concept of slavery and their treatment with what the Quran calls slavery. Slave is a strange word to give a child whom you are responsible to take care of in health and sickness. Whom you are to provide an education. Whom you are to treat like a member of the family. And who, if they request freedom, you are to free and even give parting gifts if you so desire. I'd say the child got a good deal instead of being thrown in a dingy orphanage with noone to take personal care of them.
Your description of slavery makes it look quite appealing, I’ll bet there were kids back then who asked their parents “mum why can’t I be a slave, Ahmed’s a slave and he get’s everything”

Below is IslamQ&A view of the subject

Slavery in Islam was originally prescribed because of Kufr. If there is jihaad between the Muslims and the kuffaar, and a number of kuffaar are taken prisoner, the commander is given the choice of sharing them out, doing them a favour (by releasing them) or paying their ransom. If they are shared out as part of the booty, they become slaves, subject to the laws governing products which may be sold. But at the same time, Islam urges the freeing of slaves and makes doing so an act of expiation for numerous sins. In principle, slavery is not something that is desirable; what is encouraged in Islam is the freeing of slaves. If a woman is enslaved according to sharee’ah, it is permissible for her master to have intercourse with her. This is unlike prostitution or zinaa, which Islam has forbidden as a precaution against mixing lineages and other reasons for which it is forbidden. There is no comparison between the two, because if a slave woman becomes pregnant, the child belongs to the master and she becomes free when he dies, because she has become the mother of the master’s child (umm walad), and is subject to the same rulings as a wife. And Allaah knows best.

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/5707/slave
 
Your description of slavery makes it look quite appealing, I’ll bet there were kids back then who asked their parents “mum why can’t I be a slave, Ahmed’s a slave and he get’s everything”

Below is IslamQ&A view of the subject

Slavery in Islam was originally prescribed because of Kufr. If there is jihaad between the Muslims and the kuffaar, and a number of kuffaar are taken prisoner, the commander is given the choice of sharing them out, doing them a favour (by releasing them) or paying their ransom. If they are shared out as part of the booty, they become slaves, subject to the laws governing products which may be sold. But at the same time, Islam urges the freeing of slaves and makes doing so an act of expiation for numerous sins. In principle, slavery is not something that is desirable; what is encouraged in Islam is the freeing of slaves. If a woman is enslaved according to sharee’ah, it is permissible for her master to have intercourse with her. This is unlike prostitution or zinaa, which Islam has forbidden as a precaution against mixing lineages and other reasons for which it is forbidden. There is no comparison between the two, because if a slave woman becomes pregnant, the child belongs to the master and she becomes free when he dies, because she has become the mother of the master’s child (umm walad), and is subject to the same rulings as a wife. And Allaah knows best.

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/5707/slave


You are being silly here Thinker. First you think that slavery in Islam is the worst thing that can happen to a human but when we show you that that is far from the truth, you mock it?

A man is always supposed to take care of his children so I'm not sure why any child would ask that? If a child does, that does not show the superiority of slavery over anything, just that the parent of that child is failing in his/her duty towards them.
 

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