I'm not accusin' anything. To me, accussin' connotes to accusin with out any credible evidence which automatically leads you to discreditin' yourself.morrissey said:People accuse the Quran to have the same inconsistencies as you are accusing of the Jewish Torah.
What I've brought forth is not a accusation but rather a criticism (based on evidence) that the Torah is corrupted (i.e. mutli-autorship, inconsistencies, etc)
Those who criticize the Qur'an are those who provide no evidence for such claim. Like I previously stated, the authenticity of the Qur'an is based on indisputable evidence. And I could care less what kinda allegation these polemics charge against the Qur'an, as long as they do not contain any evidence for their ludicrous claim, I would not even examine it.
Written Torah = TaNaKhAnd when you say Torah, are you refering to the Torah or the TaNaKh?
Can you please stick to the topic, I rather do not wish to engage in futile discussions. All you seem to state are red herrings.About the people who criticise the Quran, you claim the same things that I claim about people who criticise the Torah.
You have re-iterated this statement atleast 3 times but yet you will not be bothered to examine the evidence that reveal the corruption of the Torah. Not fair-minded at all. Plain in-denial. Pity though since I really had the assumption that all your reasons for not acceptin' Islam were sensible and logical.Unless you can lay it out on the table, I aint buyin.
Conjecture upon conjecture. First, there were no Christian and Jewish sources in Mecca. The Arabic gospel appeared hundreds of years later after the advent of Islam.I am not trying to sell the Torah to you. But you are trying to sell the Quran to me. I have no reason to trust it. For all I know Mohammed could have copied stories that the Jews told - apparently he had contact with Jews in Medina. We cant know for sure. Maybe he just misinterpreted the meaning of 'Chosen' when it came to the Jewish people. Not realising they were 'chosen' for the hard graft, whilst we, the non-Jews get the easy life. Maybe he thought it wasnt fair, and thought he'd do something about it. I dont know. The Jews are always forthcoming about their human weaknesses. Even Moshe didnt make it into the Promised Land because he disobeyed G-d. Did Mohammed ever show human weakness?
The IA team writes:
Thus the first translations of the Hebrew Bible in Arabic appeared after the advent of Islam. In fact, the oldest dated manuscript of the Old Testament in Arabic as shown below dates from first half of the ninth century.

The Oldest Arabic Manuscript of the Old Testament (British Museum arab. 1475 [Add. 26116]).
The variety of Arabic versions of Job, of which a page of the oldest is shown here, is representative of Arabic versions of the Bible as a whole.
There are at least four different versions of Job, one of which is among the earliest documents of Christian Arabic literature. The manuscript Brit. Mus. arab. 1475, which contains extensive portions of it, was written in the first half of the ninth century, probably at the monastery of St. Sabas. The version itself is from a Syro-Hexaplar base. The author of another version of Job is known: Pethion (Fatyun ibn Aiyub), who was active as a translator in Baghdad probably about the middle of the ninth century; he is also credited with translations of Sirach and the Prophets. Pethion's text of Job is divided into fifteen chapters and (according to the London manuscript) claims to be translated from the Hebrew; actually the translator worked from a Syriac exemplar. Other versions of Job go back to the Pe****ta and to the Coptic (G. Graf 1944: 126).[16]
The IA team answers every allegation at:
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Sources/Bibindex.html
Also, it's worthy to mention that Prophet Muhammad (Peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was illiterate.
It's quite amusin' that you make alot of presumptions morrissey, while you simultaneously claim that you've found the Truth.
As Allah (Exalted is He) said in Surah Al-Baqara, verse 11:
And they say: "None shall enter Paradise unless he be a Jew or a Christian." Those are their (vain) desires. Say: "Produce your proof if ye are truthful."
A proof that you still haven't produced morrissey.
Islam is a religion of proofs, there is no blind faith. A good article to read is:I need to know things without a doubt. While ever 'what if's' and 'could have's' ring around in my head, I will not buy into it. When being brought up in a christian home, I was told never to question and ask what if's and could have's, as it was the devil trying to lie to me, and I just had to believe, and not be a doubting Thomas.
Islam: The Religion of Proofs
Many people follow their religions blindly without proof under the justification that they “have faith.” Having faith in ideologies, belief systems, or religions that are not based upon clear proof is a source of falsehood and submission unto the conjectures and whims of men. Islam is based upon proofs. In fact, throughout the Noble Qur’an, Allah directly addresses man’s reason, and discusses the ayaat(proofs, evidences) that would lead man to accept Islam as the religion of truth for all of mankind.
More at http://clearproof.faithweb.com/cgi-bin/framed/2672/book.htm
Then address these doubts based on proofs. Perhaps we can look at it. If you do not want to address them, then that is your choice which I fully respect, however, do not regard that these [doubts] are based on factual evidence.I am begining to find my experience on this forum here might becoming to an end. Nothing has come into fruition, I still am riddled with doubts about Islam. I am sorry. It is nothing against any of you all.
If those racism-quotes-in -the-Talmud allegation quotes offended you, then wouldn't you agree that you offended Islam by posting an anti-islamic fabrication?I have been offended on occasions, and I wish people werent so anti-Jewish. It is soooo 1942, so very outdated. Why cant people just get along?
Now you have addressed these quotes and I wouldn't let them get to your head. If someone levels a charge against any Judaism, then it's your job to refute it. If you cannot refute it, then you've to acknowledge it which you fail to demonstrate. Several points have been left unanswered regardin' the Torah which is disappointin'.
With you guys, I presume that you mean with Muslims? Since when was anti-semitism potrayed in my posts? Can you provide evidence that Islam teaches anti-semitism? I think this really ridicilous to make such bold accusations. It's safe to say that I really haven't gained any perspective in this discussions apart from accusations and insults that my posts contains traits of anti-semitism.The view you guys hold of the Jews just fits into the pattern that has been the view of Jews since they left Egypt. You are offering nothing new, with your anti-Jewish views. If anything, they couldnt expect anything different.
Surah al-Baqarah, verse 120,
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion. Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance." Wert thou to follow their desires after the knowledge which hath reached thee, then wouldst thou find neither Protector nor helper against Allah.
Peace