Why is there Distrust between Christians, Jews and Muslims?

[Clear]

1)

Perhaps you can elaborate on how we are less structured and organized? in which ways do Muslims differ from Christianity and Judaism (organization wise)

I am not Catholic, but perhaps I can use them as an example. They possess a great deal of doctrinal minutiae and tradition regarding almost every conceivable doctrine. The nature of the spirit; when the spirit enters the body, the nature of man’s fall, etc, etc, etc. These are all described in detail in a multitude of manuals that new converts may read and study and answer a multitude of questions.

When I ask a question on the Catholic forums I get a clear and concise statement (generally) with data and scriptures as to why they believe what they believe. I can ask the question : Is this “official” and they can generally affirm this though they may give me their opinion which is slightly altered from “officialdom”.

I am not saying they are correct in their doctrines (as I said I am NOT catholic and do not particularly believe in Catholocism), but they HAVE doctrines and they are fairly clear. I have not had this degree of problem getting clears statements from religionists in other forums. It is a new experience for me and I attribute it to less doctrinal definition, less structure and perhaps less doctrinal organization. I do not, in reality, know why I had such problems getting clear doctrine here. Perhaps it was me.

2)

There is only one way to interpret and that is from the Quran and the Sunna of prophet Mohammed PBUH... there is no other man with such an authority ( we seek council on difficult matters from scholars) but they are people who have received religious education-- and cannot interpret out of whim... They have to follow the Guidance of the Quran and the Sunna of the prophet PBUH when passing a ruling!.....

And yet there are many competing Islams who label the others as having incorrect interpretations. I am not saying this to be mean. The same situation exists in Judaism and in Christianity. It is simply the nature of imperfect people to have imperfect unity of doctrines. I have Christian friends who compulsively insist that their interpretation of the Scriptures are the correct ones (for a multitude of reasons) and they simply cannot see that others have different opinions yet are trying to be as honest as anyone else.

PurestAmbrosia. I am appreciative of all that you have tried to teach me but I do not think this forum is for me. I never mean to offend and yet that seems to be all I’ve done since I started posting. I feel I should leave the forum and try to find what I am seeking elsewhere. I truly am sorry if I offended anyone. And grenville, sorry to have changed the fairly calm nature of your thread.

Clear

 

[جوري]

^^^ I am sorry you are not getting the responses you'd hoped.. On some level I believe the nature of your questions are too abstract? or dealing with the unknown.. you can't really apply logic to some of the questions that you ask. There isn't a random double blinded study with visceral results that would give you the answers you seek, on a spiritual level.
It is a great sin in Islam to Innovate.. whereas I understand where your coming from as per the so-called organization of the catholic church.. I believe that many of their rulings from our view would be considered heretical.

in Islam a slight comfort you can take, is whether or not people give you an adequate opinion, you can find the answers you seek in the books the Quran hasn't changed though people's interpretations might change, thus you don't really need to be a religious scholar to understand, I believe it can be understood by scholars and lay men alike. If you'd just open the book and read it!

Most people are hesitant to pass a religious opinion simply out of whim since it is considered a cardinal sin to do so.. you might have a certain doctrine in Catholicism that discusses what traits are required to turn a man into a saint or to take a child out of limbo.. but that would be considered a transgression and unbefitting to the magistrate of G-D. I think perhaps if you have read the Quran and had specific questions that aren't dealing with this level of abstraction you might get better responses. Though personally, I believe it is better to say you don't know than to make something up for new converts
I am sorry you couldn't find what you are looking for here...
peace!

 

[ibrarfaiz]

Listen in islam christians and jews are also muslim brothers, since they can still be accepted into heaven so are our brothers, also considering that we can marry one of them also shows that we have a bond with these religions

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you Grenville, and welcome to the forum and thanks for starting this thread.

Regardless of what we choose to believe, we are all created by the same God, which makes us all brothers and sisters. Despite all our differences we should still be able get on with each other.

In the spirit of praying for peace on Earth.

Eric

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you daood416; and welcome to the forum

Maybe if the Bible upsets you so much you may be better off searching for what is best in the Quran.

In the spirit of praying to one God the creator of all that is seen and unseen

Eric

 

[daood416]

Asalamu Alaikum

Hello Eric,

I found some good stuff from the Quran for you. By the way the entire Quran is the literal speech of God and it is all good.


You will not find any people who believe in Allaah and the Last Day, making friendship with those who oppose Allaah and His Messenger…” [al-Mujaadilah 58:22]

“O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians as awliya’ (friends, protectors, helpers, etc.), they are but awliya’ to one another…” [al-Maa’idah 5:51].

“They wish that you should compromise (in religion out of courtesy) with them, so that they (too) would compromise with you.” [al-Qalam 68:9].

“O you who believe! Take not as (your) bitaanah (advisors, consultants, protectors, helpers, friends, etc.) those outside your religion (pagans, Jews, Christians, and hypocrites) since they will not fail to do their best to corrupt you. They desire to harm you severely. Hatred has already appeared from their mouths, but what their breasts conceal is far worse. Indeed We have made clear to you the aayaat (proofs, evidence, verses), if you understand. Lo! You are the ones who love them but they love you not, and you believe in all the Scriptures [i.e., you believe in the Tawraat and the Injeel, while they disbelieve in your Book (the Qur’aan)]. And when they meet you, they say, ‘We believe.’ But when they are alone, they bite the tips of their fingers at you in rage. Say: ‘Perish in your rage. Certainly Allaah knows what is in the breasts (all the secrets).’ If a good befalls you, it grieves them, but some evil overtakes you, they rejoice at it…” [Aal ‘Imran 3:118-120].

“It is not (proper) for the Prophet and those who believe to ask Allaah’s forgiveness for the mushrikeen, even though they be of kin, after it has become clear to them that they are the dwellers of the Fire (because they died in a state of disbelief).” [al-Tawbah 9:113]

As you can see it is part of our religion to not take the Jews and Christians as close friends. And now we some some muslims calling them our brothers?

May Allah Guide you to the Right Path.

 

[daood416]

Still, I'm not at all sure modern Qurans and islamic religion reflects the original Quran or original Islam in much the same way modern that orthodox Judaism and Christianity do not fully and accurately represent their originals.




Im sure nobody understands you at all.

 

[Woodrow]

Still, I'm not at all sure modern Qurans and islamic religion reflects the original Quran or original Islam in much the same way modern that orthodox Judaism and Christianity do not fully and accurately represent their originals.




Im sure nobody understands you at all.

I'm a little confused Brother. What do you mean by:

modern Qurans

 

[Umar001]

I have read the Bible about 20 times and the Koran 3 times. The evidence supports Mohammed being a Prophet sent by God - which I have come to believe. I have found that this belief does not conflict with my Christian beliefs. True Muslims must therefore be my brothers and sisters.

Howdy,

I am currently reading the first article, which has already raise some questions, but that will come later on, I am mainly concerned with the view above.

If Muhammad is a Messenger sent by God then how can his Message not conflict with the your Christian belief, this guessing your an average Christian.

Having completed the first article I propose some of my objections/questions;

Why are there not references which would make it easier for the audience to ascertain the level of knowledge and reliability the author has, for example when making such statements:

The Koran, while acknowledging exceptions, does not generally view most Jews and Christians positively, and Muslims are not encouraged to trust them. The Koran uses three main arguments to justify this apparent distrust.​

With regards to the comment:

He further admonished them to believe in the Jewish Torah and the Christian Gospels, and to believe in the Messiah Jesus who was born of the Virgin Mary.​

I found it obsurd that you claim that Muhammad admonished his followers to believe in the Christian GospelS, or even the Jewish Torah. Two points, never is the GospelS in plural spoke about, furthermore another grave mistake is the mention of the Jewish Torah and the Christian Gospels, what is the purpose behind giving those titles, Islam teaches belief in the Torah of Moses and Gospel of Jesus, writing the Jewish Torah and the Christian Gospels only serves to confuse the reader and mis represent the teachings of Islam.

Regards,
Eesa.

EDIT: Having now read the rest of the articles I seriously doubt your trustworthyness, I really do hope you are sincere, alot of the stuff you mentioned is totally illogical and borderline deciet.

 

[islamirama]

Still, I'm not at all sure modern Qurans and islamic religion reflects the original Quran or original Islam in much the same way modern that orthodox Judaism and Christianity do not fully and accurately represent their originals.




Im sure nobody understands you at all.

The one of the copies of original Quran is in turkey museum. Another one is being set up in UK i think. The religion and knowledge scholars possess today is the same knowledge passed down from teacher to student thru out the centuries to the point that the scholars can name their teacher and their teacher and their teacher all the way back to the first Muslim.

In addition to all that, Allah, Himself, promised to safeguard and protect this Book and this deen. He also sends a servant every 100 years to guide Muslims to this true deen from any deviations they fall into. So should not even utter such nonesense about Islam that could put them outside the fold of Islam.

The religion today is what it was 1400yrs ago. It is the people who are not the same as those even 200 or 100 or even 50yrs ago. So it is the people who represent Islam today are not the same as those in the past. Where as in Judaism and christianity, it is both the people and their religion that is not what it was at the time it was revealed.

Listen in islam christians and jews are also muslim brothers, since they can still be accepted into heaven so are our brothers, also considering that we can marry one of them also shows that we have a bond with these religions

Prophet (saws) said there will be 71 sects in judiaism, 72 in christianity and 73 in Islam, and only ONE will go to jannah from each faith. And we know from the first two faiths it has to be original followers for they followered their prophet as he preached, all the latters ones deviated. From Islam, it is the one that sticks to the Quran and sunnah.

with that said. Many Muslims are quick to say that you are allowed to marry from people of the book, but due to their lack of knowledge, they fail to see that a certain criteria must be fulfilled.

1. she has to be a chastie, good women, not the fornicators we have today who start at the age of 12.
2. she has to believe in ONE God, many today believe in trinity or other intermederies.
3. One is NOT allowed to marry them when you have unmarried Muslim women in the community/ummah that are needed to be wed.

And jews and christians and muslims are not brothers in Faith. Islam clearly stated the beleivers (muslims) are brothers in Faith. Allah says today i completed my favor upon you and choosen Islam as your religion. And also He says anyother religion of you will NOT be accepted.

Islam is a continuation of the previous faiths. First Judaism came to jews, then Jesus came to jews as well to soften their rigid hearts, but they rejected him and the new followers became christains. Then Islam came as the Final message to all of mankind. All the 3 faiths are Abrahamic faith, that is the bond they share. They brought Monotheism and the bringers were all descendents of Abrahim. But as older versions are no longer valid as new versions of software or anything comes out. So too is the same with religion, all previous books are nullified. we as Muslims believe in them as revealed books, but we have been given the Final version and now it's our job to convey the message.

 

[daood416]

Asalamu alaikum
Im sorry i was quoting someone who posted three days ago. hey did you see how they modded my post? This site is weird for sure

 

[daood416]

THe Christian envy us because of our Faith. They wish to compromise their religioin with us so that we may compromise.

 

[Philosopher]

THe Christian envy us because of our Faith. They wish to compromise their religioin with us so that we may compromise.

Why are you trying to start a flamewar?

 

[barney]

From a Agnostic point of veiw, I beleive that the mistrust stems from Islams early days where the Prophet's teachings were rejected by the Jews and Christians. A combination of Pagan's Jews and Christians were responsible for his flight to Medina. Later Mohammed accused them of breaking treatys and surahs were revealed to warn muslims of them.

 

[- Qatada -]

From a Agnostic point of veiw, I beleive that the mistrust stems from Islams early days where the Prophet's teachings were rejected by the Jews and Christians. A combination of Pagan's Jews and Christians were responsible for his flight to Medina. Later Mohammed accused them of breaking treatys and surahs were revealed to warn muslims of them.

Barney, stop making things up. Bring your proof if you're truthful. There weren't even any jews or christians in Makkah anyway, and there are many strong narrations to how the jews broke their pacts and treaties with Allaah's Messenger in Medinah.

 

[barney]

Well, there were a few jews in Mecca, but it wasnt a establishd community. I agree that the real mistrust occured in Medina following the Jews rejection of Mohammeds teachings. I stand corrected.

Sahih Muslim, Book 019, Number 4363: [NOTE: words in parenthesis are from the translator - Ahmad Sidiqqi].

It has been narrated on the authority of Abu Huraira who said: We were (sitting) in the mosque when the Messenger of Allah came to us and said: (Let us) go to the Jews. We went out with him until we came to them. The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) stood up and called out to them (saying): O ye assembly of Jews, accept Islam (and) you will be safe. They said: Abu'l-Qasim, you have communicated (God's Message to us). The Messenger of Allah said: I want this;accept Islam and you would be safe. They said: Abu'l-Qasim, you have communicated (Allah's Message). The Messenger of Allah said: I want this... - He said to them (the same words) the third time (and on getting the same reply) he added: You should know that the earth belongs to Allah and His Apostle, and I wish that I should expel you from this land Those of you who have any property with them should sell it, otherwise they should know that the earth belongs to Allah and His Apostle (and they may have to go away leaving everything behind).

A Jew dishonoured a muslim woman in a marketplace, her husband killed the jew and the jews freinds killed the muslim.This led to a confrontation between Muhammad and the Qaynuqa and the surah was revealed.

[3.12] Say to those who disbelieve: You shall be vanquished, and driven together to hell; and evil is the resting-place.
[3.13] Indeed there was a sign for you in the two hosts (which) met together in encounter; one party fighting in the way of Allah and the other unbelieving, whom they saw twice as.many as themselves with the sight of the eye and Allah strengthens with His aid whom He pleases; most surely there is a lesson in this for those who have sight.

Kitab al Tabaqat al Kabir", vol 2, page 32:

Then occurred the ghazwah of the Apostle of Allah against the Banu Qaynuqa on Saturday, in the middle of Shawwal, after the commencement of the twentieth month from the hijrah. These people were Jews and allies of Abd Allah Ibn Ubayyi Ibn Salul. They were the bravest of Jews, and were goldsmiths. They had entered into a pact with the Prophet. When the battle of Badr took place they transgressed and showed jealousy and violated the pact and the covenant. Thereupon Allah the Blessed and the High revealed to His Prophet: "And if thou fears treachery from any folk, then throw back to them (their treaty) fairly. Lo! Allah loves not the treacherous". [Sura 8:58] The Apostle of Allah had said: 'I fear the Banu Quynuqa' but after this verse it is stated that he marched against them.

This was followed by.

According to Ibn Sa'd:

They shut themselves up in their fortress, so he (Prophet) strongly besieged them, till Allah cast fear in their hearts. They submitted to the orders of the Apostle of Allah, that their property would be for the Prophet while they would take their women and children with them. Then under his orders their hands were tied behind their backs. The Apostle of Allah appointed al-Mudhir Ibn Qadamah al-Slimi, of the Banu al-Silm, the tribe of Sa'd Ibn Khaythamah to tie their hands behind their backs. Abd Allah Ibn Ubayyi had a talk with the Apostle of Allah about them and entreated him (to release them). Thereupon he (Prophet) said: Leave them, may Allah curse them and curse him who is with them! He abandoned the idea of their killing and ordered them to be banished from Madinah.

And so it all began!

 

[islamirama]

From a Agnostic point of veiw, I beleive that the mistrust stems from Islams early days where the Prophet's teachings were rejected by the Jews and Christians. A combination of Pagan's Jews and Christians were responsible for his flight to Medina. Later Mohammed accused them of breaking treatys and surahs were revealed to warn muslims of them.

The jews were influenential people and they didn't want their powers disappearing with these new tides as Muslims grew in numbers and becoming more powerful than the arab pagans. They made treaties with the Prophet *S* and when they thought Muslims would loose, they would side with pagans to help defeat the Muslims. They were opportunist and a danger to Muslims. They broke many treaties and therefore were banished for their treachery.

Chrisitans came later on into the picture as more and more the Islamic empire spread, christianity tried spreading against it. Real conflict is over Jurselem to which all 3 faiths hold some value.

The christians may have developed resentment and distrust and hatred and what not around this time, but the jews did it from day one. There is a hadith of a jewish women turned Muslim who tells about her father (i think) seeing the prophet and confirming with another jew that this is the Messiah mentioned in previous books, but they will despise and hate him.

And lastly, those two groups fear Muslims and Islam. They fear becuase they don't want Islam to become the dominate faith and Muslims to be the larger majority of beleivers. They want to be the number one believers and what not. They don't want to loose the power they had over the world to do as they please without being held accountable to it. So even today we see them working against Islam, this whole "war on terror" is war on Islam. A poll i posted here i think on this forum shows that over 25 countries polled and well over majority in all of them believe this war is on Islam.

 

[- Qatada -]

barney, stop playing games. You havn't quoted one shred of evidence to prove that there were any jews in Makkah, and regarding the act of treason the jews commited - why shouldn't they be expelled? When all they're doing is causing corruption in the land. I can assure you that other nations at that time, and even today did much worse than that when someone commited treason.


Anyway we won't go offtopic now.

 

[Walter]

Hi Everyone:

I was taking my wife on a cruise and must apologise for not responding sooner.

Clear:
The mistrust that I mentioned was not post Koran. As I sought to clarify with Purest Ambrosa earlier, the Koran does encourage the distrust of some Christians and Jews, and with some justification as I explained in the three articles that I wrote. I really should have titled the post "Why does the Koran teach Muslims to distrust Christians and Jews?" If the Forum Manager can do this to avoid further confusion, I would appreciate it.

Woodrow:
Thank you for the information on the additional Muslim texts. I will try to obtain and read them. If that additional knowledge justifies an amendment to any of the three articles, then this will be done.

Daood416:
Please note that the Koran also "speaks" positively about those Christians and Jews who follow their religion. What you have quoted applies to those who do not.

Al Habeshi:
Teenagers normally stop a debate with unfounded accusations and insults. That is not the way for mature adults. If you wish me to respond to any question, then please ask me without such erroneous and prejudicial remarks.

Islamirama:
Previous revelations are never obsolete like a software program. All revelation is valuable.

Now, revelation may be for an individual, or a specific community, or for all of mankind. To know the difference requires an unbiased read of the text and some wisdom which God will grant to all who ask Him.

There is much in the Bible that is beneficial to all of mankind but which is not found in the Koran. Similarly, there is much in the Koran that is beneficial for all of mankind that is not found in the Bible.

Regards,
Grenville

 

[islamirama]

Islamirama:
Previous revelations are never obsolete like a software program. All revelation is valuable.

Now, revelation may be for an individual, or a specific community, or for all of mankind. To know the difference requires an unbiased read of the text and some wisdom which God will grant to all who ask Him.

There is much in the Bible that is beneficial to all of mankind but which is not found in the Koran. Similarly, there is much in the Koran that is beneficial for all of mankind that is not found in the Bible.

Regards,
Grenville

Can you run windows 95 on any pc today? how beneficial and useful would that be?

Muslims don't deny the prevous books, in fact its is incumbant upon us to believe in their revelations to be Muslims. However, those books came for those group of people. Allah sends Messengers either for one group or more than one. Moses and Jesus came for the jews as well all other descendents of isaac. Lot came for his nation only, Adam was for all mankind since he was the Father. Mohammad came for the whole mankind since it was the final message. As for what is in those books, what agrees with the Quran is what we accept and what is contrary to quran is where believe the books were changed and went astray.

btw, if you look up on google. They are remaking the bible again in Germany, this time in a much much more simpler english so everyone can understand it. Also, they are going to take out anything that is against jews and gays, so how many times does the bible will change till it's no longer a revelation but a book of humans text only?