Why have we become such a disgrace that we dotn even carry out allahs punishment
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Skavau
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Muslims living in secular societies have become integrated and understand that Sharia Law does not exist, is not plausible and will not be supported there. You are in effect asking why Muslims in secular nations do not go vigilante and attempt to inflict punishment in spite of the law there.
asslamu alaikum
i understand where your coming from. but maybe we should see what teh schoalrs have to say about this...many punishments were carried out without the prophets permission, one is the case of the blind man...the prophet did not object to it
cat eyes
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prophet mohammad (saw) use to get abused and people use to throw stones at him when they saw him coming with his companions when one of them asked the prophet (saw) why are you just ignoring them, the prophet (saw) said maybe one of them will revert to islam.
So upon hearing this story i think we should not be so strict about talking about punishments for non muslims who do these things. maybe these people have there reasons and have the wrong idea about islam so its our duty to set them straight. imagine if we were to punish every one who mocked the prophet mohammad(saw) people are going to hate islam even more and deem it a barbaric religion and we are going to prove them right...
These are not excuses btw.
So upon hearing this story i think we should not be so strict about talking about punishments for non muslims who do these things. maybe these people have there reasons and have the wrong idea about islam so its our duty to set them straight. imagine if we were to punish every one who mocked the prophet mohammad(saw) people are going to hate islam even more and deem it a barbaric religion and we are going to prove them right...
These are not excuses btw.
what your reffering to is repentance? and giving the non-muslims a chance.
http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/22809
The idea that somone who mocks the prophet should nto be allowed to repent is based on hadith...
cat eyes
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that fatwa is talking about a muslim gone kufir. its not the same as a non muslim, a non muslim has not received the message yet so how can they get punishments?
prophet mohammad (saw) NEVER ordered the punishment of any non muslim who abused him. this prove still remains today.
and i think on that note this thread should be closed
how can you say such a thing? why do you reject the punishment for mocking the prophet? and you lie about the prophet by denying he punished anyone for this sin?
http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/22809
Ibn Taymiyyah says in “Mukhtasar As-Saram Al-Maslool `Ala Shatim Ar-Rasul (Summary of The Drawn Sword Against the One Who Curses the Messenger) Pages 31-33”
This is the methodology of the general scholars.
Muhammad Ibn Suhnoon said that:
Hanbal, Abus-Saqr, Al-Khallal, Abdullah, and Abu Talib –said that:
Source: http://www.islamicemirate.com/fiqh-...yah on Killing Whoever Curses the Prophet.pdf
cat eyes
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i think the thread over all is insensitive to the non muslims on the forum. there is many hadiths where punishments should not be carried out just like the story i had posted above!
It was not the character of the prophet (saw) to go punishing non muslims that quarrelled with him and that is not a lie because i can show you prove.
us laymen cannot say whether a shariah punishment should be carried out or not. this is not in your hands or mine!
It was not the character of the prophet (saw) to go punishing non muslims that quarrelled with him and that is not a lie because i can show you prove.
us laymen cannot say whether a shariah punishment should be carried out or not. this is not in your hands or mine!
cat eyes
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if a muslim has left the fold of islam and now he is abusing the prophet mohammad (saw) then yes there should be punishment this is what Allah is referring to but i am talking about a non muslim who dose not know the first thing about islam. you cannot put these both people in the same category. there is many things that has to be taken in to account even for a non muslim its not that easy to carry out a punishment
aadil77
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bro Quranalim i understand what you're saying, but again these punishments would only apply in a muslim country where they can be carried out by the state, think about it - if a kaffir comes to you tomorrow and says the prophet was 'pervert' astagfirullah would you kill him instantly?
you seem to be create your own image of islam, and following what you desire islam to be, rather than what it is
their is a different ruling on people who are insane? but if they are not insane, the schoalrs are clear on this...matter also heard the hadith
http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/22809
considered sahih by albani.
http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/22809
Salahudeen
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How can we carry out the punishment of Allah when our rulers are non Muslim and we're living in their lands. We haven't even got a leader or a system in place to implement shari'a. Forget implementing shari'a in the west, Muslim countries don't even have 100% sharia law, I find it comical when groups call for Islamic Law in the west when in their home countries like Pakistan there's brothels and alcohol being sold. No doubt every Muslim wants to live under sharia but untill there is a proper state we don't have the right to go round inflicting the punishment of Allah upon people.
Every scholar I've heard has said "live according to the laws of the land and do not take the law into your own hands" I've not heard one of them actually promote going round and stoning the adulterer while living in a non islamic country.
If someone mocked the prophet pbuh because all his life he had been fed bad information about the prophet and was none the wiser with regards to his actual personality are you just going to kill this person?
what if later in life he learns the truth about Islam and becomes Muslim, by killing him you take away that possibility.
Are you telling me if some 1 mocked the prophet pbuh infront of you in a non islamic country where there's no shari'a, you'd just kill them ? is that what you're saying? is that what you're promoting here? I'm abit unclear about what you're trying to get at. you're saying implement the punishment of Allah but you've jumped 2 steps down the road, the first step was Islamic state and actual shari'a law .
focus on them things before you start going round inflicting people who are non the wiser with sharia punishments.
Every scholar I've heard has said "live according to the laws of the land and do not take the law into your own hands" I've not heard one of them actually promote going round and stoning the adulterer while living in a non islamic country.
If someone mocked the prophet pbuh because all his life he had been fed bad information about the prophet and was none the wiser with regards to his actual personality are you just going to kill this person?
what if later in life he learns the truth about Islam and becomes Muslim, by killing him you take away that possibility.
Are you telling me if some 1 mocked the prophet pbuh infront of you in a non islamic country where there's no shari'a, you'd just kill them ? is that what you're saying? is that what you're promoting here? I'm abit unclear about what you're trying to get at. you're saying implement the punishment of Allah but you've jumped 2 steps down the road, the first step was Islamic state and actual shari'a law .
focus on them things before you start going round inflicting people who are non the wiser with sharia punishments.
brother/sister, you may view such a thign as extreme (outside the fold of islam) and wrong. but the hadith itself metions what you are talking about.
http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/22809
Salahudeen
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I read it, and where does it say Muslim's who are not living under shari'a should carry out these punishments? I see the fatwa, and the sheikh is out lining the shari punishment for the 1 who mocks the prophet pbuh. where does he say Muslim's should do this themselves living in non Muslim lands where there's no sharia?
as far as I understood it that entire article was based upon the assumption you're living under sharia law. I didn't see any mention of those who live in non muslim lands where there's no sharia.
Salahudeen
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You're quoting hadith but all the hadith are in the time of the prophet pbuh when there was an Islamic state and sharia was being implemented. show me a hadith that shows Muslim's carrying out the punishment of Allah whilst living in a non Muslim land under kuffar rulers. That will hold weight as that would be similar to our situation. But the hadith you're quoting were at the time of the Islamic state under sharia law.
so show me where the punishment of Allah was carried out under a non muslim ruler in a foreign land against the laws of that country and the prophet pbuh gave approval. I'm interested to know if such a hadith exists.
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