War against Hijab and Jilbab, now in Canada!

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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/dispute-reveals-quebecs-hardening-line-on-religious-displays/article1495610/

Ingrid Peritz

Montreal — From Wednesday's Globe and Mail Published on Tuesday, Mar. 09, 2010 9:59PM EST Last updated on Tuesday, Mar. 09, 2010 10:02PM EST

Naema Ahmed was writing a French exam in a Muslim face covering Tuesday morning when she was called out of class and presented with an ultimatum: the veil or school.

She chose her religious veil and went home. It was the Egyptian immigrant's second attempt to enroll in a government-subsidized French class and her second effective expulsion by Quebec authorities – part of a hardening line over religious headwear in the province.

“ There is no ambiguity on this question: If you want to [attend] our classes, if you want to integrate in Quebec society, here our values are that we want to see your face. ”— Immigration Minister Yolande James

Quebec says it is preparing new rules on religious displays for those seeking to use public services in the province. But yesterday the government made it clear there were no doubts about its intentions.

“There is no ambiguity on this question: If you want to [attend] our classes, if you want to integrate in Quebec society, here our values are that we want to see your face,” Immigration Minister Yolande James said.

Quebec has staked out an increasingly tough position on religious displays, at a time when the province faces a growing presence of Muslims and other religious minorities. Premier Jean Charest's Liberal government has come under pressure from the opposition Parti Québécois to adopt measures to protect Quebec secularism and the equality of men and women.

Ms. James promised the government would bring in tougher though unspecified measures: “We are working on appropriate action that we will take in the coming time.”

Ms. Ahmed's case has already reignited the explosive debate over the accommodation of religious minorities in Quebec. The 29-year-old had chosen to leave a government French class rather than expose her face at a Montreal college last fall; she said she turned to government-sponsored classes at a community centre in her neighbourhood because she was determined to learn French.

She said no one complained about her veil since she started attending classes in the new school in late January. But on Friday, after her story had gained widespread media attention in Quebec, a teacher at the school spotted her and alerted provincial officials, who dispatched a civil servant to the school. He was accompanied by an Arabic interpreter.

Ms. Ahmed said that when she saw the Quebec official, she started to cry.

“It wasn't fair for them to ask me to leave the exam,” she said in a phone interview. “I feel like the government is following me everywhere.”

While there is no law banning the wearing of religious headwear in Quebec, officials say they were acting yesterday on the basis of “pedagogical principles.” A student's mouth should be visible so the teacher can work on pronunciation, one official said.

Ms. Ahmed was told that she could follow French classes online. But the mother of three said she's feeling depressed and doesn't know if she'll pursue her lessons.

“I'll just stay in my house. This will solve the problem.”

On Monday, Christine St-Pierre, the Quebec minister responsible for the status of women, called the niqab and burka “ambulatory prisons” that violate a woman's right to equality.

“There are people in Quebec, in Canada, and other countries around the world, who have gone to Afghanistan and spilled their blood so that these things won't be tolerated,” Ms. St-Pierre said. “Here, we cannot tolerate this sort of thing.”

Ms. Ahmed's treatment has also sparked sharp divisions in the Muslim community over the wearing of the headwear. Salam Elmenyawi, president of the Muslim Council of Montreal, said Quebec is pushing Ms. Ahmed into isolation and depriving her of the ability to learn French and integrate into society.

“We're missing a good opportunity to educate this woman and let her learn our language and culture. We're telling her: Don't go out,” he said.

But the Muslim Canadian Congress, which has called for a ban, applauded Quebec's attitude toward the niqab and burka.

“This is an attire worn in the desert during sandstorms. It's got nothing to do with religion,” said Tarek Fatah, founder of the congress. “It's a very clear sign that women are the possessions of men, and it's being thrust on North America and Europe. Most Muslims are fed up with the niqab and burka.”

With a report from Rhéal Séguin
 
I think Quebec has always had a problem with the niqab and the hijaab (probably trying to be like France that does not even consider quebecers truly french) so this isnt new but some of the requests this lady was making in regards to the classroom were ridiculous.
Salam
 
If you want to [attend] our classes, if you want to integrate in Quebec society, here our values are that we want to see your face. ”—
i thought their values were freedom of speech and religion? in that case, if anything, they should be warming to the idea of it.



these things are just spiraling out of control, really :hmm:

freedom of speech and liberty? sure, pull the other one.
 
Yes this is double standards, but any less than a Shariah state which does not allow non-Muslims to display religious symbols?
 
Is it double standards? Do you really think I would be allowed to write that exam wearing a ski mask? No. She should not be given special treatment on religious grounds. If I can not cover my face during the exam, neither can she.
 
i thought their values were freedom of speech and religion? in that case, if anything, they should be warming to the idea of it.



these things are just spiraling out of control, really :hmm:

freedom of speech and liberty? sure, pull the other one.

Not out of control than any other period of history.. Islam by its nature is very magisterial and imposing.. all they do is create more publicity and more conversions.. it is a sad reality because the harder they push the more converts wal7mdlillah..

at the end it will wreak havoc on their heads insha'Allah as they push for a world war III, they create awareness and solidarity in the Muslim world and that is exactly what we have wanted all along no matter the drive behind it.. surely no unity will be established in splendor, but in hardship and strife -- Allah swt is creating the schism of the end in a seemingly natural manner.. and we know the outcome insha'Allah.. and pls allow me to quote the Noble Quran:

17-81 And say: "Truth has (now) arrived, and Falsehood perished: for Falsehood is (by its nature) bound to perish."


:w:
 
Yes this is double standards, but any less than a Shariah state which does not allow non-Muslims to display religious symbols?
im not sure your logic is holding up to scrutiny. at least we are honest and stick to our words, unlike these "democratic" "freedom-loving" countries who supposedly promote freedom and yet practically attack and target those who dont agree with their view. jokes on you guys.


Is it double standards? Do you really think I would be allowed to write that exam wearing a ski mask? No. She should not be given special treatment on religious grounds. If I can not cover my face during the exam, neither can she.
your logic is also flawed. what who wears and when is beyond the point here. why dont these so-called freedom loving countries welcome these things, instead of attacking them. its contradictory.
and i dont think anyone's ever forbidden anyone who wearing a ski-mask in an exam?
 
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Why do everyone make such big deal about women wearing hijab or headress?? I don't understand what is wrong with it? Why no one want this? It is up to that person to do this...right?
 
Why do everyone make such big deal about women wearing hijab or headress?? I don't understand what is wrong with it? Why no one want this? It is up to that person to do this...right?

The atheist fellow likes to hold on to extreme views and makes plenty of driveling non-points with them.. perhaps someone should define for him the difference between a head vs face scarf? a boycott vs. violent protest.. a fart from a hard core manure.. as he leans so much toward the latter and enjoys spreading it around ^o)
 
Is it double standards? Do you really think I would be allowed to write that exam wearing a ski mask? No. She should not be given special treatment on religious grounds. If I can not cover my face during the exam, neither can she.

Religious grounds and just plain crazy are 2 different things. If she want to wear hijab and take test...SO BE IT! It has religious ties and should be recognised! I wore my rosary beads to school around my neck when I was younger, and they said I can't pray and or wear them, it wasn't fair to others! I said "when these other kids pick up their sagging pants and the women put some more clothes on , you have a deal", "Until then, I will be praying for them...inschool!" I was suspended^o) When I came back...I had my rosary beads on and prayed during class quitely! They can't take away my religion and right to practice it!!!:raging::raging::raging:

Why does your opinion matter? You an athiest! Go ahead and wear ski mask. Sis will be sisting next to me in class with hijab on! And I will have my rosary beads on! And if you tell her to take her hijab off, I am going to defend her!
 
Enough with the angry emoticons lol. Calm down dude, you'll blow a gasket.

It has religious ties and should be recognised!

No, this is exactly the problem. Nothing should be recognized and allowed just because it has religious ties. No special rules or allowances because somebody has some religious view or another. That goes for everyone.

I have no issue with your rosary beads, as there's nothing stopping me from wearing friendship beads or any other kind of beads. Its a whole different category than face coverings or ceremonial daggers, etc.

Why does your opinion matter? You an athiest!

This exposes you completely. Indeed why should my opinion matter? Or that of anybody else who is being denied special rights due to not belonging to a particular religion? Perhaps because I am Canadian and actually have lived in Quebec and have family there and have voted there?

And if you tell her to take her hijab off, I am going to defend her!

Defend her how exactly? If she's asking for special rights and pointing to her religion she hasn't any ground to stand on. Quebec isn't a theocratic province, but a secular one. If you want theocracy go elsewhere.
 
I honestly never expected Canada to get involved in this. There's such a large active Muslim population there, masha'Allah. And I heard they were very cooperative. Insha'Allah, I'm pretty sure they will NOT follow through.
 
You cannot sit an exam with the face covered. If you could, then you could get an expert to take the exam in you're place!

-
 
I honestly never expected Canada to get involved in this. There's such a large active Muslim population there, masha'Allah. And I heard they were very cooperative. Insha'Allah, I'm pretty sure they will NOT follow through.

You may be thinking of the stories of the "sharia courts" in Ontario. A few years back us Ontarioans allowed muslims to settle some of their civil disputes with arbitrators who did their decision making based on sharia law. The big difference is that in that case no special rights are being given. Anybody can have an arbitrator using whatever agreed upon decision making system the two parties agree on (even flipping a coin). The decisions can only effect certain aspects of life and must not violate Canadian law.

There was a big stink raised over these "courts".... in the US. In Ontario nobody really cared. But down in the US where islamophobia was running much more rabid people had all kinds of crazy misunderstandings of how muslims were taking over Canada and imposing Sharia on us all.
 
You cannot sit an exam with the face covered. If you could, then you could get an expert to take the exam in you're place!

-

A woman wearing niqab should be able to take an exam with only women around, that way she can take it off for ID purposes.
 
Ummu Safayaan said:
your logic is also flawed. what who wears and when is beyond the point here. why dont these so-called freedom loving countries welcome these things, instead of attacking them. its contradictory.
and i dont think anyone's ever forbidden anyone who wearing a ski-mask in an exam?
I will qualify this and state that I am against the proposition that the niqaab or hijab ought to be forbidden in public. People ought to have the right to wear what they like in public, or in their own homes.

However if what someone wears flouts the uniform regulations of a location then they must comply if they wish for continued access to that location. I see no reason why hijabs in general cannot simply be incorporated to school uniform standards in any secular nation (although this is an ideal of mine). I do see a more difficult proposition in declaring that niqaabs also be accepted (as it does open up the floodgates for people to just wander in wearing ski-masks, or something stupid like wrapping bandages around their head).

In short and to more relevance to your point, it does matter in this instance what people wear. It has to matter to an educational establishment that wishes to propose specific uniform requirements cannot be hypocritical, or provide specific exemptions to a specific group. Decreeing that the Hijab or Niqaab in an educational (or any) establishment as reason to become exempt to uniform requirements is asking for treatment on religious grounds, which is frankly unwarranted.
 
:sl:
Why did the school take half an academic year to make a decision? I mean if it posed a real problem, they wouldn't have allowed her to start the year.

And they pulled her out of a class exam to discuss the issue? Seems kinda incompetent really.
 
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:sl:
Why did the school take half an academic year to make a decision? I mean if it posed a real problem, they wouldn't have allowed her to start the year.

Seems kinda incompetent really.

Yeah, it is.

They might have been worried about causing 'offence'. Reading the article, it appears its all be handled badly. The girl in question has been misled and probably feels confused.
 
A woman wearing niqab should be able to take an exam with only women around, that way she can take it off for ID purposes.

Quebec schools are partially and often entirely funded by tax dollars. Why should my tax dollars pay for an extra exam room and exam monitor to satisfy somebody's religious beliefs? Perhaps if she paid a fee for the extra costs. But even then it opens the doors to others who may want the same, on other personal and non-religious grounds. Should I as of right be entitled to write the exam in my own room and with my own monitor? Thats the question. If yes, then ok.
 
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Quebec schools are partially and often entirely funded by tax dollars. Why should my tax dollars pay for an extra exam room and exam monitor to satisfy somebody's religious beliefs?
Because you're a kind, considerate and understanding person? :D
 
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