Hi everone, I am a Christian investigating Islam.

  • Thread starter Thread starter dcalling
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies Replies 36
  • Views Views 11K
Status
Not open for further replies.
D

dcalling

Well-known member
Messages
60
Reaction score
3
Gender
Male
Religion
Christianity
I was an atheist, after years arguing with my Christian friends, became a Christian, and then a semi devoted Christian, and started to study Islam a few month ago, just to make sure not to dismiss something before investigate it myself. Been over different websites (primarily answering-Christianity and answering-islam), did a lot of reading and they hurts.

I was pretty much made up my mind that Christianity is the true religion of God, alone with other evidences, it allows a sinner on death bed to enter heaven through grace of God because Jesus died for us, and in Islam that's not possible because he won't have any deed to back it up.

However yesterday night I was listening to a radio debate between Nabeel Qureshi and Yaha, and Yaha claimed that Islam is not a work based religion, contrary to what I have researched before (on several Islam website, which said Muhammad said at the end of days God will use something to weight a person's good deeds against his bad ones). But after search there are statements in Quran support both views.

So instead of keep doing research, I will just get on here and throw the questions myself. I will not hide my intensions, I still think Christianity is the true religion of God, and I am here to try to convince you (if God allows), and I have prayed many times to have the God's word shine through.

This is life and death. If Christianity is true, you guys can't enter heaven and be with God except through Jesus ("I am the way, truth, life, no one comes to the Father except through me"), so no matter how many good deeds you do, if not through Jesus you are not saved. However if Islam is true, then I can't enter heaven because I don't believe in Muhammad (even though I did most God's commandments and prayed to him through Jesus).

And I am not sure if it is too late if we change our minds upon the day of judgment, after finally seeing the truth.
 
Welcome to the forum,

I hope this will not be your only post. Do feel free to browse through the site. Your first post is really about introduction so I won't go into commenting as yet. But as you quite rightly put it, this is life and death .....
.. and there is only one truth.

Peace :shade:
 
Hi dcalling,

Welcome to the forum. I hope this will be a little of help. Please don't hesitate to ask any clarification if you don't understand, or any other questions if you have.



Worship is not the introduction to additional rewards, but the result of previous bounties. Yes, we have received our wage, and are accordingly charged with the duties of service and worship.


  • Because, O soul!, since the All-Glorious Creator, Who clothed you in existence which is pure good, has given you a stomach and appetite, through His Name of Provider, He has placed before you all foods on a table of bounties.
  • Then, since He has given you a life decked out with senses, life too requires sustenance like a stomach; all your senses like eyes and ears are like hands before which He has placed a table of bounties as broad as the earth.
  • Then, because He has given you humanity, which requires many immaterial foods and bounties, He has laid out before that stomach of humanity, in so far as the hand of the mind can reach, an extensive table of bounties as broad as the worlds of both the inner and outer dimensions of things.
  • Then, since He has given you Islam and belief, which require infinite bounties and are nourished through countless fruits of mercy and are supreme humanity, He has opened up before you a table of bounties, pleasure, and happiness which includes the sphere of contingency together with the sphere of His sacred Names and attributes.
  • Then, through giving you love of divine (muhabbetullah) and knowledge of divine (ma'rifetullah), which is a light of belief, He has bestowed on you an endless table of bounties, happiness, and pleasure.

That is to say, with regard to your corporeality you are an insignificant, weak, impotent, lowly, restricted, limited particular, but through His favour, you have as though risen from being an insignificant particular to being a universal, luminous whole. For by giving you life, He has raised you from particularity to a sort of universality; and by giving you humanity, to true universality; and by bestowing Islam on you, to an exalted, luminous universality; and by giving you knowledge and love of Him, He has elevated you to an all-encompassing light.

O soul! You have received this wage, and you are charged with the pleasurable, bountiful, easy, and light duty of worship. But you are lazy in this too. If you perform it half-heartedly, it is as though the former wages are insufficient for you and you are overbearingly wanting greater things. Also, you are complaining: “Why was my prayer not accepted?” But your right is not complaint, it is supplication. Through His pure grace and munificence, Almighty God bestows Paradise and eternal happiness. So seek refuge in His mercy and munificence constantly. Trust in Him and heed this decree:

Say: “In the bounty of God, and His mercy –in that let them rejoice;” that is better than the [wealth] they hoard." (Qur’an, 3:31)

~Second Fruit
 
 
Hello


Welcome here. Pl. browse the forum and feel free to ask about Islam in related threads or start new threads in general section.
 
I would say that the first mistake you made was in trying to learn about Islam from an anti-islam website.
 
Greeings dcalling and welcome to the forum.

dcalling said:
I will not hide my intensions, I still think Christianity is the true religion of God, and I am here to try to convince you (if God allows), and I have prayed many times to have the God's word shine through.
Click to expand...

Please note, that to proselytize or to promote a faith other than Islam, is against the forum rules, which are located here:

http://www.islamicboard.com/faq.php?faq=islamic_forum_rules#faq_liforum_rules

15.Promoting Religions other than Islam
While interfaith discussions are allowed promoting another religion is not allowed on the discussion board. This discussion board was created to promote Islam, not another religion. There are many other discussion boards on the Web which you can promote your religion other than Islam.
Click to expand...

Our comparative religion section is currently closed, thus we are not taking threads debating two faiths against each other, just for debate. However, you are of course, most welcome to ask questions to learn about Islam.

Please do take the time to read the links in brother Signors posts, and once you've read them, let us know if you have any questions that stem from there, or indeed any other questions.

Peace.
 
Last edited:
dcalling said:
I was an atheist, after years arguing with my Christian friends, became a Christian, and then a semi devoted Christian, and started to study Islam a few month ago, just to make sure not to dismiss something before investigate it myself. Been over different websites (primarily answering-Christianity and answering-islam), did a lot of reading and they hurts.

I was pretty much made up my mind that Christianity is the true religion of God, alone with other evidences, it allows a sinner on death bed to enter heaven through grace of God because Jesus died for us, and in Islam that's not possible because he won't have any deed to back it up.

However yesterday night I was listening to a radio debate between Nabeel Qureshi and Yaha, and Yaha claimed that Islam is not a work based religion, contrary to what I have researched before (on several Islam website, which said Muhammad said at the end of days God will use something to weight a person's good deeds against his bad ones). But after search there are statements in Quran support both views.

So instead of keep doing research, I will just get on here and throw the questions myself. I will not hide my intensions, I still think Christianity is the true religion of God, and I am here to try to convince you (if God allows), and I have prayed many times to have the God's word shine through.

This is life and death. If Christianity is true, you guys can't enter heaven and be with God except through Jesus ("I am the way, truth, life, no one comes to the Father except through me"), so no matter how many good deeds you do, if not through Jesus you are not saved. However if Islam is true, then I can't enter heaven because I don't believe in Muhammad (even though I did most God's commandments and prayed to him through Jesus).

And I am not sure if it is too late if we change our minds upon the day of judgment, after finally seeing the truth.
Click to expand...

the only thing that you could convince us of is that you are misguided.

as for who get's into heaven, Allah, and Allah alone decides that. one get's into heaven by Allah/s mercy, not by deeds.

i've never seen any contemporaneous evidence that suggests that what is called Christianity today, is what Jesus and his followers believed.

if, Christianity is true, which it is not, why is it that the Qur'an, in it's original language, was completed BEFORE the New Testament was in it's original language?

if, Christianity is true, which it is not, why is that Islamic beliefs were established BEFORE Christians figured out exactly what it takes to be a Christian, and in which there is still wide spread disagreement today?

if, Christianity is true, which it is not, why is it that Muslims follow the teachings of a Prophet of God, but Christians don't even follow what Jesus taught?

if, Christianity is true, which it is not, why is that if both the "Bible" and the Qur'an were completely destroyed, Muslims could recreate the Qur'an in a matter of days, while Christians could NEVER recreate their Bible? the task of recreating the Bible can never happen because, even today. Christians cannot agree on what the Bible is supposed to be?

if you think your "investigation" is over, i would suggest that you need a new investigator!
 
Thank you Greenhill, this will definitely not be my only post. It took me over 10 years arguing with my Christian friends to finally confirm it (though still have questions, at least I can live with them), and I think it will be a life long task to live by the word of God :-)

Blessings :-)
 
Thanks Signor. I have done enough readings, know most of the basics of Islam and much more of Christianity. It doesn't mean I have read all, just mans I have read enough for my tiny mind to be able to understand in this period of time.
And to answer your question, yes I want salvation, and I want more people to be saved (or in my current mind, convert as many to Christianity as I can. I hope it is not too offensive to you :-)).
 
dcalling said:
convert as many to Christianity as I can. I hope it is not too offensive to you :-)).
Click to expand...

I understand how you feel but you can't do that on a forum, just like I am sure Christian forums have, this forum has rules which state you can't come and try to convert people..etc.
 
Hi Insaanah,

Thank you for point it out. I will try my best to obey forum rules. I have done a lot of readings for now and I will start to ask questions shortly. I am still trying to get through all my readings lately and get my questions out.
 
dcalling said:
If Christianity is true, you guys can't enter heaven and be with God except through Jesus ("I am the way, truth, life, no one comes to the Father except through me"), so no matter how many good deeds you do, if not through Jesus you are not saved. However if Islam is true, then I can't enter heaven because I don't believe in Muhammad (even though I did most God's commandments and prayed to him through Jesus).
Click to expand...

I think this might be another misconception you have about Islam. Although we believe that Muhammad (peace be upon him) is the last and final messenger sent to all of mankind by Allah, believing that Jesus (peace be upon him) has to serve as an intermediary to "save" you is the problem here. Not only is this a grave violation of the first commandment, in Islam this is considered shirk. Jesus (peace be upon him) cannot save you on the day of judgement. Jesus came and taught pure monotheism which is the same as what Moses, Abraham, David, Noah, Lut (peace be upon them all) and all other prophets taught. Even Jesus didn't pray to God through himself. That makes no sense and no other messenger did this either. Believing that God would allow a mighty messenger to be humiliated and killed by disbelievers for your sins is insulting at the least and not taking responsibility for your actions in this life should also cause you great pause.

I was a former Christian too and also prayed that God would guide me. You would do well to study the origins and changes of the Bible throughout time. Question it, examine it and ask yourself what makes more sense. Read the whole thing. Cover to cover. Different translations, too. I understand what it's like to suddenly have faith but from your introduction here it's apparent that you didn't do proper research on Islam. You learned about it from anti-Islamic websites, you probably didn't read a proper translation of the Quran(there are quite a few bad ones out there) and I wonder if you sat down and actually talked to practicing Muslims or attended services at a mosque. But joining this forum is a good start. I encourage you to learn more and seek the truth. Not a truth you have created for yourself but a truth which puts you in full submission to God and Him only.

Welcome to the forum.
 
Thanks YusufNoor,
1. do you claim one can enter heaven without any deeds? Is there a Quran verse for it?
2. Jesus's word passed down through the early recordings, with many old manuscripts survived till today, older than Quran. The teachings are of divine nature, that is part of the reason why I became what I am today.
3. What do you mean the Quran was complete before New Testament? New Testament was completed at around 300ad, with very little changes later on.
4. To me to be a Christian means reborn from spirit (get rid of the old self and let God take control of you). They have other debates about thing of divine nature that there is no way to understand except when God show us that. But that is similar to Muslims, which have Sunnis, Shia, Sufis.
5. What do you think Christians don't follow Jesus taught? Some fake ones maybe, and some new ones doesn't do the 1/10 contribution to God. But many try out best to follow God, I am even trying to follow the Sabbath (still drive/watch movies but not any commercial activities)
6. I am sure people can recreate bible as well, I can't recite the bible but there are people who can. Some sect of Christians has more books than ours, but I am sure someone can recite those books as well. For us Christians, the command from God is Love God, Love others, and that is the Bible in 2 words.
 
Aprender said:
I think this might be another misconception you have about Islam. Although we believe that Muhammad (peace be upon him) is the last and final messenger sent to all of mankind by Allah, believing that Jesus (peace be upon him) has to serve as an intermediary to "save" you is the problem here. Not only is this a grave violation of the first commandment, in Islam this is considered shirk. Jesus (peace be upon him) cannot save you on the day of judgement. Jesus came and taught pure monotheism which is the same as what Moses, Abraham, David, Noah, Lut (peace be upon them all) and all other prophets taught. Even Jesus didn't pray to God through himself. That makes no sense and no other messenger did this either. Believing that God would allow a mighty messenger to be humiliated and killed by disbelievers for your sins is insulting at the least and not taking responsibility for your actions in this life should also cause you great pause.

I was a former Christian too and also prayed that God would guide me. You would do well to study the origins and changes of the Bible throughout time. Question it, examine it and ask yourself what makes more sense. Read the whole thing. Cover to cover. Different translations, too. I understand what it's like to suddenly have faith but from your introduction here it's apparent that you didn't do proper research on Islam. You learned about it from anti-Islamic websites, you probably didn't read a proper translation of the Quran(there are quite a few bad ones out there) and I wonder if you sat down and actually talked to practicing Muslims or attended services at a mosque. But joining this forum is a good start. I encourage you to learn more and seek the truth. Not a truth you have created for yourself but a truth which puts you in full submission to God and Him only.

Welcome to the forum.
Click to expand...

Thank you Aprender, you and I come from the same back ground so it might be easier to communicate. From the word of Jesus, he is also God ("I and Father are one", "I am in the Father and Father is in me"). He is special, born of virgin and with many miracles. Our heavenly Father give him power to judge us, and everything come from him.

And I didn't learn/research Islam from anti islam websites only, the answering-Christianity website is pro islam, and I went to many Islam websites.

I don't create truth, I just research. One example is almost every Muslim I meet told me Bible is corrupted, that is more like creation. "The truth shall set us free", let's get to the bottom of this.
 
جوري;1601185 said:
Interesting, can you take this quiz and tell me how you score? For God doesn't author confusion of course

http://exchristian.net/3/
Click to expand...

Let alone in God's words, even in a child's writings you wouldn't find so many simple controversies. It seems that not only a couple, but many people have put their inks into the Bible.

By the way, dcalling, what do you mean by 'very little changes after 300ad'? Do you have any other gods besides the three entities who have the authority to make changes in God's words?

I am sorry, but I don't believe that you made a thorough investigation of ten years before converting to Christianity. It seems more like you just surrendered because you wanted to be saved.
 
OK, I can't even spell your name, but thank you, that was a good one. I got 0...

The last question shocked me a bit (i.e. can is his testimonies true by himself or not, I picked not), but when I try the other answer, and go again (not to cheat, but just to see were it says he can do that by himself), it give totally unrelated answers, I think I messed up the program a bit. I will check that one again on internet.

Most of others I already seen (I was shaking a lot more when I did the researches first on Islam, there were sites that are extremely knowledgeable, some even taught ancient Hebrew translations that actually changed my mind on certain things in Bible), and can be explained (several can't, I do agree, they can't reconcile). The last one is very trouble some, as it is not some blurred memories by disciples but from Jesus himself. It is too late today, wife is angry, so I will research that.

It is going to be a lot of work +o( but as I said truth is more important.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar Threads

Back
Top