Indroduction
All Praise be to Allah. We praise Him, ask for His Help and repent to Him. We seek Allah’s protection from the evils of our souls and the bad of our deeds. Whomever Allah guides will never be misguided and whomever Allah misguides will never be guided. I testify that there is no deity but Allah, with Whom thee is no associate. I testify that Muhammad is His servant and Messenger. May Allah bless him, his family, his Companions and those who follow them until the Day of Resurrection.
Koran 45:3. Verily in the heavens and the earth, are Signs for those who believe. 4. And in the creation of yourselves and the fact that animals are scattered through the earth, are Signs for those of assured Faith.
Some people do not believe in the existence of a Creator. They think that the Evolution Theory is a fact and that science supports it, while in reality this is not the case. Hundreds of thousands scientists are against the Evolution Theory because its not proven and it goes against the scientific facts. That's why its called a theory. When we were, in kindergarten theytaught us that a frog, turning into a prince was a nurseryfairytale, but when we got to college they toldus that a, frog turning into a prince was science!' We will proof them with one singel cell, that there is a Almighty Creator Insha'Allah.
Your body contains more than 100.000.000.000.000 cells, some so small that 1.000.000 of them brought together would fit on the tip of a needle. Despite this tiny size, however, the cell is considered by the scientific community as the most complex structure man has ever come across. W. H. Thorpe, an evolutionist scientist, acknowledges that, 'The most elementary type of cell constitutes a 'mechanism' unimaginably more complex than any machine yet thought up, let alone constructed, by man'. [W. R. Bird, The Origin of Species Revisited, Thomas Nelson, p. 298 and 299].
Koran 13:16. Say, 'Allah is the Creator of all things, He is the One, the Supreme and Irresistible'.
Is it possible?
Robert Shapiro, a professor of chemistry at New York University and a DNA expert, calculated the probability of the coincidental formation of the 2000 types of proteins found in a single bacterium [There are 200,000 different types of proteins in a human cell]. The number that was found was 1 over 10/40000. [Robert Shapiro, Origins, A Sceptics Guide to the Creation of Life on Earth, New York, Summit Books, 1986. p.127]. This is an incredible number obtained by putting 40,000 zeros after the 1!
So many attempts would fail to create a singel bacterium and only 1 attempt would succeed. A one followed by six zeros is a million, look at the numbers above! Subhan'Allah! This is nothing compared to what you will read now. Harold Morowitz, a Yale University physicist, gave a far more realistic 'Probability' for a single bacterium. He calculated the odds of a single bacterium emerging from the basic building blocks necessary were 1 chance in 10/100.000.000.000. [Cited in Mark Eastman, Chuck Missler, The Creator Beyond Time and Space, Costa Mesa, CATWFT, 1996, Page 61]. This is a 1 followed by 100.000.000.000 zeros! This number is so large it would require a library of approximately 100,000 books just to write it out! Allahu Akbar! Wallahie tell me, how can someone reject Allah after reading this?
Koran 7:40. To those who reject Our signs and treat them with arrogance, no opening will there be of the gates of heaven, nor will they enter the garden, until the camel can pass through the eye of the needle, Such is Our reward for those in sin.
Emile Borel said, 'If anything is ten to the 50th power [A 1 followed by 50 Zeros] or less chance, it will never happen, even cosmically, in the whole universe'. [Emile Borel, Nobel Prize Winner, Probabilities and Life. New York Dover 1962. Ch. 1 to 3]. So what about 100.000.000.000 zeros? And again, this whas nothing compared to what you are going to read now.
The science of probability has not been favorable to evolutionary theory, even with the theory's loose time restraints. Dr. James Coppedge, of the Center for Probability Research in Biology in California, made some amazing calculations. Dr. Coppedge applied all the laws of probability studies to the possibility of a single cell coming into existence by chance. He considered in the same way a single protein molecule, and even a single gene. His discoveries are revolutionary. He computed a world in which the entire crust of the earth - all the oceans, all the atoms, and the whole crust were available. He then had these amino acids bind at a rate one and one half trillion times faster than they do in nature. In computing the possibilities, he found that to provide a single protein molecule by chance combination would take 10, to the 262nd power, years'. That is, the number 1 followed by 262 zeros.
'To get a single cell - the single smallest living cell known to mankind - which is called the mycroplasm hominis H39, would take 10, to the 119,841st power, years. That means that if you took thin pieces of paper and wrote 1 and then wrote zeros after it, you would fill up the entire known universe with paper before you could ever even write that number. That is how many years it would take to make one living cell, smaller than any human cell!' Subhan Allah! Look at how clear Islam is and how dark the way is that the atheists follow.
The reason they reject Allah is not because they don't know. They do known, and the reason is that they don't want to believe. They don't want to believe in God, and they take the devils as their friends. Those devils misguid them and still they think that they are on the truth. Look at those numbers, how can someone reject the Almighty Creator? Allah has allways been there and He is not created. Allah made the truth like the day and falsehood like the dark night. Even a blind man can see the straight path of Islam.
Koran 6:39. Those who reject our sings are deaf and dumb, in the midst of darkness profound. Whom Allah willeth, He leaveth to wander. Whom He willeth, He placeth on the way that is straight. Koran 8:23. If Allah had found in them any good, He would indeed have made them listen. As it is, if He had made them listen, they would but have turned back and declined Faith.
According to Emile Borel, an expert in the area of probability, an event on the cosmic level with a probability of less than 1 out of 10, to the 50th power, will not happen. The probability of producing one human cell by chance is 10, to the 119,000 power. Sir Fred Hoyle, a mathematician and astronomer, was quoted in Nature magazine, November 12, 1981, as saying, 'The chance that higher life forms might have emerged in this way (Evolution) is comparable with the chance that a tornado sweeping through a junk yard might assemble a Boeing 747 from the materials therein'.
Some people reading these lines who have so far accepted the theory of evolution as a scientific explanation may suspect that these numbers are exaggerated and do not reflect the true facts. That is not the case, these are definite and concrete facts. No evolutionist can object to these numbers. They accept that the probability of the coincidental formation of a single protein is as unlikely as the possibility of a monkey writing the history of humanity on a typewriter without making any mistakes'. [Inheritance and Evolution, Meteksan Publishing 1984, p. 64].
Hugh Ross estimates that the chances of ONE planet in the universe developing life is one in ten to the 282nd power (million trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion).
Now let us look at molecules. A single drop of blood has 35,000,000 red blood cells. A single red blood cell has 280,000,000 hemoglobin molecules, each molecule having 10,000 atoms. Molecules are so small that ¼ teaspoon of water has 1.000.000.000.000.000.000.000.000 of them. De Nouy provides another illustration for arriving at a single molecule of high dissymmetry through chance action and normal thermic agitation. He assumes 500 trillion shakings per second plus a liquid material volume equal to the size of the earth. For one molecule it would require '10/243 billions of years'. [A 1 followed by 243 zeros]. Even if this molecule did somehow arise by chance, it is still only one single molecule. Hundreds of millions are needed, requiring compound probability calculations for each successive molecule. His logical conclusion is that 'It is totally impossible to account scientifically for all phenomena pertaining to life'. [Cited in Evan Shute, Flaws in the Theory of Evolution Nutley, NJ Craig Press, 1971, Page 23].
This was only a bacterium, what about the Great Creation of the heavens and the earth? This means that it is not possible for the cell to have come into being by coincidence, and therefore it must definitely have been created. In the Creation of God are Signs, for people of understanding. Look at your eyes, nose, fingers, ears, lips etc. Who created this? You cannot live more than a few minuts, without your nose. This is enough proof, to bury Darwin with his monkey theory under the ground.
Conclusion
This is suficient prove that God does exist, because not even an atom can come into being by chance. So who Created it? The only answer is Allah, the Almighty Creator of the heavens and the earth. There is no doubt about this. Since God cannot be a monkey, an idol made of sand, a blue elephant flying on a carpet with 9 hands, a prophet who used to eat and go to toilet, a ghost etc (Astagfirullah) therefore Allah must be the Creator of everything. All books who claimed to be a revelation from God, are full of errors and contradictions today, except the Qur'an. This is enoug proof that it must be a revelation from God. The Bible for example is full of errors and contradictions.
The Christians don't even know who wrote those books. There are hundreds of versions of the Bible, each one is different. So how do we know which ons is the right one? Secondly they don't even know their God. Some of them say that Jesus was God, others reject that. Some of them say Maria was the mother of God, and other Christians reject that. Some say the Holy Ghost is God, and others reject it. Some say Jesus died on the cross, other say on a tree etc. So how do we know who is speaking the truth? Each one of them has his own proofs because each one has a different Bible. The book of the Muslims is one and our God is one and our prophet was one.
There can be only one God, because God is the strongest. There cannot be 2 or 3 strongest. So if another being is stronger than you, then you cannot be God. This is what Islam teaches, and this is the truth, accept Islam and all your sins will fall away from the day you accept Islam. You will be born again like a baby, without sins. Don't die, except as a Muslim.
Last edited by Battle_4_Peace; 04-16-2006 at 12:43 AM.
czgibson, There are more people who believe in god then those who don't, you admitted it your self. so, how can they be wrong. My point is that god exists. And for your information Islam is the fastest growing religion.
Well I am not Mr Gibson, but Truth is not decided by democratic vote. This is not unknown to religious people: Noah and his sons were the only people on Earth whoe feared God. And so God saved them. Everyone else was wrong. One man was right. Or would you argue otherwise?
And Islam is still not the fastest growing religion in the world.
Le coeur a ses raisons, que la raison ne connait pas. - Blaise Pascal
The day of judgement is beyound science. Allah is capable of anything, he created science and he can destroy it. He is beyound time, matter, and the whole univere. All he wants for humanity is to believe in him and his message. This world is a test, he wants us to believe what we don't understand and see. root, i encourage you to read the Qur'an, it contains scientific facts 1,400 years ago that were only recently discovered. And sciece back then was very Limited, so it is obvious that it is the word of god.
Really? Is that an Islamic belief? Why, then, didn't He create us in His sight so that we all could see Him and know Him and hence worship Him? Why has He placed barriers in the way of belief? I do not know what He wants but surely logic tells us He wants something else other than merely our belief in Him.
Le coeur a ses raisons, que la raison ne connait pas. - Blaise Pascal
Really? Is that an Islamic belief? Why, then, didn't He create us in His sight so that we all could see Him and know Him and hence worship Him? Why has He placed barriers in the way of belief? I do not know what He wants but surely logic tells us He wants something else other than merely our belief in Him.
You can't even look at the sun, His creation, how do you want to see God?
Well I am not Mr Gibson, but Truth is not decided by democratic vote. This is not unknown to religious people: Noah and his sons were the only people on Earth whoe feared God. And so God saved them. Everyone else was wrong. One man was right. Or would you argue otherwise? And Islam is still not the fastest growing religion in the world.
Nowhere does the Qur'an say that the complete earth was under water. Noah did 950 years Dawa, he called people to Islam, they did not accept. Allah drowned his people, not the entire world, this is unscienitific. He only took the animals that were needed, like sheep, cows, chicken's etc. You can als answer the question i asked czgibson. Can those letters come into existence by chance, Yes or No?
You can't even look at the sun, His creation, how do you want to see God?
I am quite happy not seeing God, but clearly I have not been given the undeniable proof some people have. God has not appeared to me. Nor has Gabriel. If God merely wanted us to praise Him, surely that would be a built in function? He must want something more complicated (like we should freely choose to praise Him or something).
Nowhere does the Qur'an say that the complete earth was under water. Noah did 950 years Dawa, he called people to Islam, they did not accept. Allah drowned his people, not the entire world, this is unscienitific. He only took the animals that were needed, like sheep, cows, chicken's etc. You can als answer the question i asked czgibson. Can those letters come into existence by chance, Yes or No?
A lot of things are unscientific including any claim that all the sheep and cows have been through a genetic bottleneck of just two animals. I will take your word for what the Quran says (although chickens come from Malay and so at the time there probably were none when Noah was around). The point remain that just because people did not accept Noah's call it does not mean that Islam is false.
Theoretically those letters might come into existence by chance, but the odds of it are very small.
Le coeur a ses raisons, que la raison ne connait pas. - Blaise Pascal
Let us ask brother czgibson if this words can come into existence by chance. Yes or No? I'll wait for you answer.
Listen, I am only prepared to discuss things with you if you will agree to read my posts carefully and answer the questions I have put to you in response to your own questions. This debate is unlikely to progress in a useful fashion unless you and I both agree to do that.
You have made much of your claim that I have not answered your questions. If you read my posts carefully, you will see that I have done my best to do so. I do not yet see any evidence that you have taken this on board yet.
If you have an issue with some of the answers I've given, then by all means bring it up - I'll be happy to discuss it with you - but please don't just ignore everything I write.
Do we have a deal? If you can confirm that we do, then I'll be happy to answer your latest question.
Greetings hussein radi,
czgibson, There are more people who believe in god then those who don't, you admitted it your self. so, how can they be wrong.
As I said in my last post, this is an example of the fallacy argumentum ad populum. The fact that a majority of people believe something does not mean it is necessarily true. Two thousand years ago, nearly everyone believed that the Sun went around the Earth. Were they right?
My point is that god exists. And for your information Islam is the fastest growing religion.
I know what your point is, I just don't happen to agree.
As for Islam being the fastest growing religion, we've had this discussion on the forum before, and that claim is highly debatable to say the least.
Greetings cheese and Abd'Majid,
format_quote Originally Posted by cheese
i think some people here should stop being so disrespectful and talking about czgibson as if he cant see your posts..
format_quote Originally Posted by Abd'Majid
czgibson is actually very polite, lets not be rude to hiM
What can I say? I'm touched. Thank you. :thankyou:
Many, many of my posts are devoted to this precise topic. Have a look through the threads discussing atheism or the existence of god and you'll find me giving many reasons why I am an atheist.
The most important of these is that I have never come across any evidence whatsoever that supports the idea that god exists.
The most important of these is that I have never come across any evidence whatsoever that supports the idea that god exists.
I don't understand you czgibson. Here, in this world, there are many things that are shown that could not have come about merely by chance or human beings...then y do u not believe in God??
I don't understand you czgibson. Here, in this world, there are many things that are shown that could not have come about merely by chance or human beings...then y do u not believe in God??
This is essentially the argument from design once again, but what do you mean by "by chance"?
Tell me, if we can't achieve something within 100 - 1000 years. Is it impossible to ever achieve? Yes or no would be cool
With mutation nothing is impossible to achieve root and i'm sure you're aware of that. In Humans you have klinefelter's syndrome, cytosis fibrosis, sickle cell anaemia etc. That is the result of mutation.....that is not to say that all mutations are negative. In this case the likelyhood of something gradually evolving with the aid of random mutation (which really isn't random) and natural selection is quite into a complex, well functioning, conscience and intellect being coming about is far-fetched.
It is possible you can achieve something but there is a high chance of that thing dying, and as it dies everything would have to be started from scratch. Ah the frustration....
With mutation nothing is impossible to achieve root and i'm sure you're aware of that. In Humans you have klinefelter's syndrome, cytosis fibrosis, sickle cell anaemia etc. That is the result of mutation.....that is not to say that all mutations are negative. In this case the likelyhood of something gradually evolving with the aid of random mutation (which really isn't random) and natural selection is quite into a complex, well functioning, conscience and intellect being coming about is far-fetched.
I never mentioned mutational change, what was your point since mutational change is only a small part of evolution. I am not referencing evolution at all. Don't presume to pre-empt me please:
Here, in this world, there are many things that are shown that could not have come about merely by chance or human beings...then y do u not believe in God??
If something could be shown could not have come about through natural processes - a little more than chance - then it would be good evidence to suggest the existence of God. But I know of no such thing and the sensible presumption must be that God does not play an active role in the day-to-day management of the Universe.
Le coeur a ses raisons, que la raison ne connait pas. - Blaise Pascal
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