Australian cleric in dress furore

[AvarAllahNoor]

Isn't this implying it's ALL the fault of the woman??

Australia's most senior Muslim cleric has prompted an uproar by saying that some women are attracting sexual assault by the way they dress.
In a sermon, Sheikh Taj el-Din al-Hilali said that women who did not wear a hijab (head dress) were like "uncovered meat".

A transcript of the sermon has been published in an Australian newspaper.

Leading Muslim women have condemned the comments and Prime Minister John Howard said the remarks were "appalling".

"The idea that women are to blame for rapes is preposterous," Mr Howard told reporters.

But a spokesman for Sheikh Hilali said the quote had been taken out of context and referred not to sexual assault but to sexual infidelity.

Sheikh Hilali's critics have previously accused him of praising suicide bombers and claiming the attacks in the United States on 11 September 2001 were "God's work against oppressors".

The cleric's latest comments came in a sermon delivered to some 500 worshippers in Sydney last month.

If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred

Sheikh Hilali
"If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside... and the cats come and eat it... whose fault is it, the cats' or the uncovered meat?" he asked.

The uncovered meat is the problem, he went on to say.

"If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred," he added.

Sheikh Hilali also condemned women who swayed suggestively and wore make-up, implying they attracted sexual assault.

"Then you get a judge without mercy... and gives you 65 years," he added.

 

[Muezzin]

You need to provide a source.

Also, he apologised for the remarks.

I wish major religious figures would get their feet out of their mouths before opening them...

 

[afriend2]

Salaam,

Apparently everyone "praises suicide bombers"....it's a load of codswallop to me.

Wassalam eace:

 

[wilberhum]

You need to provide a source.

Also, he apologised for the remarks.

I wish major religious figures would get their feet out of their mouths before opening them...

While it is true that he apologised, but did he really?

He also rejected calls from across the Muslim and non-Muslim community to retract his comments.

 

[Zulkiflim]

Salaam,

I would say that the Imam way of conveying the message is aburpt.

Zakir Naik has a much better way of couching the message.

If two women who looked identical,one wore Hijab and the other wore a sexy clothing..which one would be most likely raped or bothered?

But again,the rapist in islam will be severely punished.

 

[wilberhum]

Salaam,

I would say that the Imam way of conveying the message is aburpt.

Zakir Naik has a much better way of couching the message.

If two women who looked identical,one wore Hijab and the other wore a sexy clothing..which one would be most likely raped or bothered?

But again,the rapist in islam will be severely punished.

Would make no difference. A rapest doesn't care what you ware. He just wants to hurt a woman. It is hate, not sex. :grumbling :grumbling

 

[- Qatada -]

Would make no difference. A rapest doesn't care what you ware. He just wants to hurt a woman. It is hate, not sex. :grumbling :grumbling

And what makes you think that's the case?



Peace.

 

[S_87]

aaaah Alhumdulillah the muslim woman has been ordered to cover up so that she will not be molested!

yes rape is wrong and there isnt an excuse for it but why are they highlighting what he said? like loads and i mean LOADS of scholars always say this so why highlight him?

and a rapist does does care what you wear. as said a covered woman will not be first choice as opposed to an uncovered woman. if a woman wants to save herself -coverup! yh all that stuff why should the woman have to do so its the man at fault blah blah but the picture is a person can only control some things and one thing one person cannot control is another persons sick desire. but they CAN prevent

 

[wilberhum]

And what makes you think that's the case?



Peace.

Knowledge through reading.

 

[glo]

Would make no difference. A rapest doesn't care what you ware. He just wants to hurt a woman. It is hate, not sex. :grumbling :grumbling

It a pretty well established in psychology that rape is about control, and not sex. I agree with you, Wilberhum.

 

[lavikor201]

If two women who looked identical,one wore Hijab and the other wore a sexy clothing..which one would be most likely raped or bothered?

Read a bit about rape. It has to do with weakness, not sexual desire a majority of times. If the women in the hijab apears weak, she the majority of times will get raped, millions of psycologists and experts say.

 

[Zulkiflim]

Salaam,

Umm,perhaps for you a better comaparison is two women...

One obese and the other toned...wearing the same revealing clothes....which would be raped?

83% of rape cases are ages 24 or under.

http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~ad361896/anne/cease/rapestatisticspage.html

Umm wonder why they prefer younger women?

 

[strider]

It a pretty well established in psychology that rape is about control, and not sex. I agree with you, Wilberhum.

Precisely!

I think the 'scholars' comments are extremely distasteful and insulting.

 

[lavikor201]

[FONT=Tahoma, Helvetica, Arial]It is saddening, frustrating as well as dangerous to see the propagation of such erroneous beliefs that not only continue to perpetuate the myths surrounding rape, but also provide the perfect environment for rape to continue. [/FONT]
[FONT=Tahoma, Helvetica, Arial]Rape is not about sudden loss of sexual self-control due to provocation. It is a crime of violence where sex is used to demean and subjugate women. [/FONT]
[FONT=Tahoma, Helvetica, Arial]Babies from below one year old to elderly women of ninety have been raped, girls in covered up school uniforms and women in what is considered "sexy" clothes have been raped - the only common factor lies in the fact that they are all women. Women and girls have been sexually violated by their fathers, brothers, grandfathers, boyfriends, acquaintances and co-workers. As Christine S. herself recognised, a woman cannot feel safe anywhere anymore. Rapes happen on dates, when you are parking your car, in your own home. Therefore, it is fallacious to state that if only women would take heed in where they go with whom and wearing what, they would not have been raped. Beliefs like these limit women's life and ability to participate fully as members of society, and further create the inequality in gender relations that makes it enabling for men to exert their power over women using sex as a weapon. [/FONT]
[FONT=Tahoma, Helvetica, Arial]Blaming the survivor only releases the man who commits the violence from the responsibility for what he has done. What this will do is again to create an environment that is acceptable and facilitating for any man to be a rapist because they are not at fault - the fault lies with the woman for no other reason than that she is a woman. Sometimes women blame the survivors to cope with this terrible crime, to convince ourselves that "rape will never happen to me because I will not go out late at night/wear sexy clothes/go on a date etc." It is urgent to realise that this does not address the root of the problem; no matter what a woman chooses to do and how she behaves, she does not deserve or ask to be violated. [/FONT]
[FONT=Tahoma, Helvetica, Arial]We plea to Christine and to every person who considers rape as an abhorrence that should not happen to any woman, to start looking at the issue where it rests: rapists who disregards a woman's right to make decisions about her own bodily integrity, rapists who do not think women have the right to say "no", and rapists who thinks they can get away with rape because the fault does not lie on their blatant disrespect for women's human rights. [/FONT]
[FONT=Tahoma, Helvetica, Arial]The issue will not disappear unless we start to examine our own attitudes and values which allows for rape to happen. [/FONT]

 

[strider]

Salaam,

Umm,perhaps for you a better comaparison is two women...

One obese and the other toned...wearing the same revealing clothes....which would be raped?

83% of rape cases are ages 24 or under.

http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~ad361896/anne/cease/rapestatisticspage.html

Umm wonder why they prefer younger women?

Again, you come over as an uneducated person. Rape isn't about sex, it's about control. You can never lay blame at the door of the rape victim.

 

[lavikor201]

Rape is not provoked by women wearing sexy clothes or behaving seductively - many teenagers in uniforms have been raped. It is also not an "over-spill" of sexual energy, or an impulsive crime. Rape is a violation of the victim's will and her body - no woman asks to be raped - and rape is a crime of violence using sex as a weapon. A high percentage of rapists are acquaintances, "friends" and relatives, and approximately 69.4% of rapes occurred in "safe" places (houses, schools etc.)

Zulikflim, do not talk about what you do not know. It is obvious you have no knowledge about psycology, so i will take the experts words, not some sexist shiekh who subjigates women.

 

[wilberhum]

lavikor201
Great posts.

 

[Zulkiflim]

Again, you come over as an uneducated person. Rape isn't about sex, it's about control. You can never lay blame at the door of the rape victim.

Salaam,

Statistics speak much more than philosphy right.

And i never said it is the woman fault for baring herself.
It is just that statistics prove that women whom are raped are young and visually pleasing.

The rapist target these young women,or are you saying that is wrong?

83% of rape cases are ages 24 or under.

http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~ad361896/...sticspage.html

And if rape is about control,about weakness again WHO DO THEY TARGET?
Fat ugly,obese girls?

 

[Zulkiflim]

Rape is not provoked by women wearing sexy clothes or behaving seductively - many teenagers in uniforms have been raped. It is also not an "over-spill" of sexual energy, or an impulsive crime. Rape is a violation of the victim's will and her body - no woman asks to be raped - and rape is a crime of violence using sex as a weapon. A high percentage of rapists are acquaintances, "friends" and relatives, and approximately 69.4% of rapes occurred in "safe" places (houses, schools etc.)

Zulikflim, do not talk about what you do not know. It is obvious you have no knowledge about psycology, so i will take the experts words, not some sexist shiekh who subjigates women.

Salaam,

Can you pls provide the link to your sources?
We already decided to post link when we referenced to the Holy Book,so can you do this to other subjects too.


Your post does not negate my point,it cleary shows that girls whom are beautiful or pleasing to the eyes are more often raped than not.


And again like i said earlier,that th shiekh words were not aptly put,read Zakir Naik interpretation.

It is not the woman fault but the chaces of a woman who bares herself will have a higher chance of being raped.

Simple as that.
Do you dispute with that notion?

For more about rape statistics,,umm not mine..go here..
[PIE]In a 1999 longitudinal study of 3,000 women, researchers found women who had been victimized before were seven times more likely to be raped again. (Acierno, Resnick, Kilpatrick, Saunders and Best, Jnl. of Anxiety Disorders 13, 6.)[/PIE]


[PIE]Among female rape victims, 61% are under age 18. (American Academy of Pediatrics, 1995)[/PIE]

[PIE]In a study of 6,000 students at 32 colleges in the US, 1 in 4 women had been the victims of rape or attempted rape. (Warshaw 1994)[/PIE]

http://www2.ucsc.edu/rape-prevention/statistics.html

[PIE]6. The majority of date and acquaintance rape victims are young women aged 16 to 24. (Helen Lenskyj, "An Analysis of Violence Against Women: A Manual for Educators and Administrators," Toronto: Ontario Institute for Studies in Education, 1992)[/PIE]



http://www.wavaw.ca/informed_stats.php


There are more and more ,,google for it.

last but not least,i do not doubt that what ever the reason for rape,control may be one of it factors,but what i am saying is that BEAUTIFUL FEMALES WHO REVEAL MORE<>>have a higher chance of being raped.

 

[Curaezipirid]

Isn't this implying it's ALL the fault of the woman??

Australia's most senior Muslim cleric has prompted an uproar by saying that some women are attracting sexual assault by the way they dress.
In a sermon, Sheikh Taj el-Din al-Hilali said that women who did not wear a hijab (head dress) were like "uncovered meat".

A transcript of the sermon has been published in an Australian newspaper.

Leading Muslim women have condemned the comments and Prime Minister John Howard said the remarks were "appalling".

"The idea that women are to blame for rapes is preposterous," Mr Howard told reporters.

But a spokesman for Sheikh Hilali said the quote had been taken out of context and referred not to sexual assault but to sexual infidelity.

Sheikh Hilali's critics have previously accused him of praising suicide bombers and claiming the attacks in the United States on 11 September 2001 were "God's work against oppressors".

The cleric's latest comments came in a sermon delivered to some 500 worshippers in Sydney last month.

If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred

Sheikh Hilali
"If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside... and the cats come and eat it... whose fault is it, the cats' or the uncovered meat?" he asked.

The uncovered meat is the problem, he went on to say.

"If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred," he added.

Sheikh Hilali also condemned women who swayed suggestively and wore make-up, implying they attracted sexual assault.

"Then you get a judge without mercy... and gives you 65 years," he added.

The front page of today's Courier Mail in Brisbane has an article slandering Sheik Taj el-Din al Hilali. He has a clear case against the modern Australian media and also curiously against the corruption among the Australian police in respect of his visit to Brisbane's Eid al Fahr festival planned for November 4th.

The front page news article was used by an undercover police skin head to tempt myself into accusing him. (The skin head movement is intrinsically connected with the corruption among the theosophical society and other occultists which support the black magic of The Behemoth, which is at the heart of the Gog and Magog wars.)

What happened was that after an overt effort was made to cause that it seemed that the newspaper belonged to a cafe for use of the customers and I had asserted to the other customer that I would read it next, he got up and left with it and I followed him and reminded him that the newspaper was still in his hand. Then he provided evidence that he had purchased it, left it in the cafe and gone to the bank, and then come back to the cafe and sat down with it. I immediately apologised for having mistaken the evidence and he immediately raised his voice and publically associated the false allegation as though I had accused him of theft with the appearance of Hijab, and then he ran away from me before I could refute him.

I only wanted to read the paper because of regarding it necessary for my self to become able to defend any Muslim cleric whose public face is so foully defamed as was enacted against Sheik Taj el-Din al-Hilali. But the police seemed to have overtly assumed that in Islam I would have hated the Sheik for his natural cause in Allah. Such fools as are the corrupt Australian police.

I am very happy to learn about the false accusation that was being levelled against me since until receiving this evidence this morning I had no conscious awareness of.

Also it seems that the fact of such accusations having been causing that the whole indigenous population was not able to reconcile with each other through blindness to such accusations has been integral to establishing the patterning of the full weight of Revelations. This whole region of Australia is, only today, through this, now fully accounted for in Revelations. The last group to be accounted are the Hare Krishnas through whom such accusations were being sustained on a mass scale. As soon as I realised what had been happening I went to their restaurant and they are now in process of entering the pattern of Revelations within their conscious mind.

Therefore I thank Sheik Taj for having let his public reputation become so defamed. Clearly many of the uncovered women's bodies, in this city especially, are nothing more than meat, but we are usually only too polite to say so. The indigenous population of Australia has been working at causing that all the persons whom desire only lust and have no belief in Allah are to be exposing themselves so very clearly among us to the effect that we may openly hold them accountible without needing to enter the places where they enact lust. The hell of gog and magog in such places, which a very few of the very best minded of the Aborigine race have ventured into so as to learn of, is so disgusting that most of us are in active desire to enter the fire so as to never again need to know that such instances could have ever actualised.

My own knowledge of is only through rare instances of experiencing recollection of Dreams which the kafir shaytan have forced upon me through black magic: and may they rot in hell through me. The genetic patterns of wanting death to be the end of black magic and so finding reason in allowing oneself to become blamed for its wrong, are now all becoming "switched" on, location by location. Soon those whom set up the foul media reports about a Muslim cleric will learn their fate.

But meanwhile this whole situation has been transpiring amid signs that all the Shaytan in this region are realising their true function within the revelations prophesies and aligning with. In that I must overtly welcome, on behalf of indigenous Australians, the Sheik up to Brisbane for the Eid al Fahr celebration; and I hope that he will be able to meet with the requirement for persons of an effective Muslim eduction to enter among those whom did the poor media reporting trick so as to help us catch them.

Alaykomuasaalamu Warahmathuallahi Warabarakathauhai (I dunno where my extra vowels can fall me down, but the vowels I put in are those my conscience dictates)(so I go off to find a thread where I can reveal the extent of my knowledge about gog and magog: even I get terrified around their method) Alaykomuassaalam