Authority of the Hadeeth

[Jalal~]

Re: Hello from Canada

Can you recommend any Hadith that you feel are essential to the Islamic faith? Either Shia or Sunni. I'll give it an honest try and see where it goes.

of course! since you've recently converted to Islam, i think this one will make your faith stronger at times of ease or hardships:
The Messenger of Allah sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam said: "Strange is the affair of the mu'min (believer). Verily, all his affairs are good for him. If something pleasing befalls him he thanks (Allah) and it becomes better for him. And if something harmful befalls him he is patient (saabir) and it becomes better for him. And this is only for the mu'min."

 

[Insaanah]

Re: Hello from Canada

This doesn't directly answer your question, but you might find the following book helpful to clear your misconceptions or concerns about hadeeth:

Usool al-Hadeeth: The Methodology of Hadeeth Evaluation, by Dr Abu Ameenah Bilal Philips

It covers their history, compilation, transmission, the science of isnaad (chains of narration), classification (including weak, and addresses your concerns about hadeeth being manipulated for various reasons, political/philosophical and others), and more.

It is over 150 pages, but maybe see what interests you from the contents page (below, not in the pdf for some reason) and dip into that from time to time inshaa'Allah..

Page numbers refer to Adobe page numbers, as the book itself that's been converted to pdf doesn't seem to have page numbers.

Section One: Definitions............page 2
Section 2: Compilation...............page 9
Section 3: Transmission.............page 19
Section 4: Classification.............page 35
Section 5: Conflict......................page 77
Section 6: Criticism....................page 82
Section 7: Grading.....................page 92
Section 8: Literature..................page 109
Section 9: Biographies...............page 138
Section 10: Women Scholars.......page 149
Section 11: Appendix One..........page 156
Section 12: Appendix 2...............page 160
Section 13: Bibliography..............page 162

Give it a go with an open mind... May Allah make it easy for you, ameen.

 

[Scimitar]

Re: Hello from Canada

Shirk? Like, how? Does not compute. How does believing the Quran to be sufficient constitute worshiping others beside Allah?

Shirk is an accusation so lightly thrown around nowadays that it's becoming a meaningless buzzword.

I said it was "almost, borderliine shirk" ... it would help if you read my post in context.

Salaam.

Scimi

 

[Muhammad]

Re: Hello from Canada

There has always been a group of muslims that reject the Hadith. I don't care how small that population of muslims might be,

Other than in the last couple of hundred years, would you mind mentioning who rejected Hadith before that time?

Here is an article about the indispensability of the Hadeeth: http://kalamullah.com/hadith04.html

Please also be sure to visit the Hadeeth section of our forum where we have many articles and responses to people in your position:
http://www.islamicboard.com/hadeeth/

 

[YusufNoor]

Re: Hello from Canada

I'm really skeptical of the Hadith, but you're right I was also very skeptical of the Qu'ran at one point in time.

Can you recommend any Hadith that you feel are essential to the Islamic faith? Either Shia or Sunni. I'll give it an honest try and see where it goes.

there is a cool story in the Seerah regarding the Night Journey. some left Islam upon hearing the story. Abu Jahl was actually delighted to hear it cuz he knew it would cause problems for Rasulullah, pbuh. ONE PERSON, Abu Bakr, wasn't phased by the story. he simply said, "IF[emphasis mine] he [Muhammad, pbuh] said it, then I believe him!"

it is a great standard for Hadeeth. if you truly believe Rasulullah said something, then what would be wrong with it?

oh, and no 2 from An Nawai's 40 Hadeeth:

HADITH 2
Also on the authority of Omar, who said : One day while we were sitting with the messenger of Allah there appeared before us a man whose clothes were exceedingly white and whose hair was exceedingly black; no signs of journeying were to be seen on him and none of us knew him. He walked up and sat down by the prophet. Resting his knees against his and placing the palms of his hands on his thighs, he said:"O Muhammed, tell me about Islam". The messenger of Allah said: "Islam is to testify that there is no god but Allah and Muhammed is the messenger of Allah, to perform the prayers, to pay the zakat, to fast in Ramadhan, and to make the pilgrimage to the House if you are able to do so." He said:"You have spoken rightly", and we were amazed at him asking him and saying that he had spoken rightly. He said: "Then tell me about eman ."He said:"It is to believe in Allah, His angels, His books, His messengers, and the Last Day, and to believe in divine destiny, both the good and the evil thereof." He said:"You have spoken rightly". He said: " Then tell me about ehsan ." He said: "It is to worship Allah as though you are seeing Him, and while you see Him not yet truly He sees you". He said: "Then tell me about the Hour". He said: "The one questioned about it knows no better than the questioner." He said: "Then tell me about its signs." He said: "That the slave-girl will give birth to her mistress and that you will see the barefooted, naked, destitute herdsman competing in constructing lofty buildings." Then he took himself off and I stayed for a time. Then he said: "O Omar, do you know who the questioner was?" I said: "Allah and His messenger know best". He said: "He was Jebreel (Gabriel), who came to you to teach you your religion."

pretty much a "rock" of Islam

:wa:

 

[Futuwwa]

Re: Hello from Canada

I said it was "almost, borderliine shirk" ... it would help if you read my post in context.

Salaam.

Scimi

Then, the question simply changes to "why is it almost, borderline shirk?"

Or is "almost, borderline" code for "I feel that way even though I can make no rational argument to that effect"?

 

[Futuwwa]

And why was this thread turned to one on the authority of the hadith? All I'm calling for is tolerance and inclusion of GodIsOne.

 

[marwen]

No, totally wrong.The Quran wasn't revealed to let you attain full knowledge of Allah. To say so is almost borderline shirk akhi.

Shirk? Like, how? Does not compute. How does believing the Quran to be sufficient constitute worshiping others beside Allah?

Shirk is an accusation so lightly thrown around nowadays that it's becoming a meaningless buzzword.

As far as I know, full knowledge of Allah is only private to Allah. Claiming you fully know/can_know Allah, is claiming to have something proper to Allah. To That's why - if I understood well - bro Scimitar described it as something similar to shirk. Correct me if my understanding is wrong.

 

[IslamicRevival]

I dont understand why some Muslims reject Hadith, even though they interlink and are perfectly in line with authentic Islamic teachings. On top of that, the vast majority of Scholars USE Hadith to try and penetrate and gain more of an understanding when interpreting verses of the Quran and to also learn more about the best of creation, our Nabi, Peace be upon him. If youre a Hadith rejecter, and i say this with all due respect...I guess its your loss.

 

[Hulk]

As far as I know, full knowledge of Allah is only private to Allah. Claiming you fully know/can_know Allah, is claiming to have something proper to Allah.

That is correct akhi.. Even the angels said this.

" They said, ‘May You be glorified! We have knowledge only of what You have taught us. You are the All Knowing and All Wise.’ "
Sura Baqara Verse 32

 

[dqsunday]

The Qur'an cannot allow anybody to obtain full knowledge of Allah, that would any who understand the Qur'an as equal to Allah and none are equal or comparable to him. The Qur'an, in my understanding is the Truth of how we, as slaves of Allah are to honor and worship him. Muhammad (salallahu alaihi wasalam) is Allah's messenger but like us, he is also his slave.

But, don't take my word for it, I have only been a Muslim about two months...and I have a long way to go to even learn the Hadiths. However, one thing I found which may be beneficial to GodIsOne and everybody else, is this series of lectures/videos about the Seerah. I have only watched the first three parts, but its very interesting so far. It may answer questions and clarify things.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y22vp9pp8JE&feature=BFa&list=PLC89682017B43845D

 

[Orangeduck]

My problem with the hadiths is that they date to 250 years after muhamad died. I often wonder why it took so long for them to get recorded.

My parents never placed my emphasis on the hadiths when we were growing up, so I never really read and studied them till only a few years ago. Most of them are rather dull to read in my opinion (not everyone if going to agree with me).

 

[Hulk]

so I never really read and studied them till only a few years ago.

Would that be the same time you studied and started speaking koine greek?

 

[Orangeduck]

Would that be the same time you studied and started speaking koine greek?

Nope. I started reading the Hadiths before starting to learn Koine Greek

 

[Insaanah]

Greetings

My problem with the hadiths is that they date to 250 years after muhamad died. I often wonder why it took so long for them to get recorded.

You made this assertion before, here:

http://www.islamicboard.com/world-affairs/134312599-lets-talk-about-israel-3.html#post1513217

The ahadeeth actually began to be written down during the lifetime of the Prophet (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him).

‘Abdullaah ibn ‘Amr said: “I used to write everything which I heard from the Messenger of Allaah (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) with the intention of memorizing it. However, some of the Quraysh forbade me from doing so saying, ‘Do you write everything that you hear from him, while the Messenger of Allaah is a human being who speaks in anger and pleasure?’ So I stopped writing, and mentioned it to the Messenger of Allah (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him). He pointed with his finger to his mouth and said: ‘Write! By Him in whose hand is my soul, only truth comes out from it.’
(Sunan Abu Dawud, vol. 3, p. 1035, no. 3639)

Abu Hurayrah said: When Makkah was conquered, the Prophet (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) stood up and gave a sermon [Abu Hurayrah then mentioned the sermon]. A man from Yemen, called Abu Shaah got up and said, “O Messenger of Allaah! Write it down for me.” The Messenger of Allaah (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) replied, “Write it for Abu Shaah.”
Al-Waleed asked Abu ‘Amr, “What are they writing?” He replied, “The sermon which he heard that day.”
(Sunan Abu Dawud, vol. 3, no. 3641 and 3642)

Some were also written down after he died, as the need to preserve what he'd said and done then took on a new importance and urgency.

Most of them are rather dull to read in my opinion (not everyone if going to agree with me).

The ahadeeth are not for entertainment value, but for us to learn how best to follow the example of the Prophet Muhammad (may Allah's peace and blessing be upon him).

Peace.

 

[Ali_008]

http://www.islamicboard.com/hadeeth/134309886-how-authentic-hadith-really.html#post1479246

 

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

My problem with the hadiths is that they date to 250 years after muhamad died. I often wonder why it took so long for them to get recorded.

My parents never placed my emphasis on the hadiths when we were growing up, so I never really read and studied them till only a few years ago. Most of them are rather dull to read in my opinion (not everyone if going to agree with me).

Greetings,

I don't understand, your the same member who mentioned, hafs, Qalun and Warsh are different versions of the Qur'aan,
How can you be so sure of what you say?

And it makes me wonder what your purpose on board is since Islaam seems so 'dull' to you..

 

[Orangeduck]

Greetings,

I don't understand, your the same member who mentioned, hafs, Qalun and Warsh are different versions of the Qur'aan,
How can you be so sure of what you say?

And it makes me wonder what your purpose on board is since Islaam seems so 'dull' to you..

Well, the hafs Is not word for word identical to the warsh, which is not word for word identical to the sana quran, which is not word for word identical to the Ciaro quran.

So what is was true. And to the person who said the hadiths were written down durring the lifetime of Muhammad, then I offer you this challenge. Find me a single document that records what Muhammad said that pre-dates Bukhari. I have heard people make the claim as you, but no one can point to a document from muhammmad's life that can be verifiably attributed to him

Edit: I never said or implied islam was "dull", so I'm. It sure why you felt the need to lie

 

[Insaanah]

And to the person who said the hadiths were written down durring the lifetime of Muhammad, then I offer you this challenge. Find me a single document that records what Muhammad said that pre-dates Bukhari. I have heard people make the claim as you, but no one can point to a document from muhammmad's life that can be verifiably attributed to him

I have no need to. Once the ahaadeeth had been verified and were put into hadeeth collections, and were in general distribution, there wasn't any need for any originals to be kept. There may be details of some, Allahu a3lam. But their not being recorded as an "official" document doesn't mean they weren't written down. That hadeeth mentioned above for a Muslim is enough proof. And if you don't believe in the hadeeth anyway, then whether such a document exists is meaningless - there are more fundamental issues to be tackled.

 

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

Well, the hafs Is not word for word identical to the warsh, which is not word for word identical to the sana quran, which is not word for word identical to the Ciaro quran.

So what is was true. And to the person who said the hadiths were written down durring the lifetime of Muhammad, then I offer you this challenge. Find me a single document that records what Muhammad said that pre-dates Bukhari. I have heard people make the claim as you, but no one can point to a document from muhammmad's life that can be verifiably attributed to him

Edit: I never said or implied islam was "dull", so I'm. It sure why you felt the need to lie

Do you think Islaam is beautiful?

I apologise i've no intention to make a lie against you, but I assumed that from a few of your posts, calling the Qur'aan and now the hadeeth 'dull'..

You stated in a previous closed thread that nobody answered your question regards to Hafs, Qalun and Warsh being a different 'version' of the Qur'aan, i gave you an answer in that thread. Please re-read it as I do not wish to put this thread off-topic.

Re-read bottom of post #29 of mine if you like.

-->http://www.islamicboard.com/comparative-religion/134312592-discussion-orangeduck-2.html <--


Can I ask, are you able to read, speak or understand arabic?