Homosexuality

[Salahudeen]

I am just wondering if being gay has a genetic cause then wouldn't it eventually die out the gene pool since gays don't reproduce?

I am just wondering, paedofiles also say they can not help the way they are this is the way they were born with a fetish for children so should we make this acceptable to? How is this different from being gay? they are both sexually devient. How come we accept 1 and make the other unacceptable, I mean after all a paedofile can not help how he is, this is the way he was born with a desire for children.

What about people who have sex with animals are they born like this too? lol should we accept this pratice also since people can't help how they were born?

 

[czgibson]

Greetings,

'nature' doesn't allow for futile cycles especially in complex organisms. If we were strict naturalists homosexuality would be the end of the line, there would be no further propagation of the specie, there would be no 'survival of the fittest' there would simply be an end point (period)-- the whole point would indeed be about reproduction (what other point can there be) when the 'meta needs' are meta physical?

all the best

p.s don't we have a zillion homosexuality thread.. shouldn't people simply do a basic search instead of this crap again?

I can't see what you're getting at. If everyone exclusively practised homosexual sex, then I expect what you say would be true. Seeing as they don't, where is the problem?

Peace

 

[جوري]

Greetings,


I can't see what you're getting at. If everyone exclusively practised homosexual sex, then I expect what you say would be true. Seeing as they don't, where is the problem?

Peace

Homosexuality would have been long extinct as dictated by the laws of 'natural selection' it is so simple that I believe you are deliberately missing it.

all the best

 

[tango92]

Greetings,



That's a response to a direct implication of your words. Otherwise what point were you actually making?

As I seem to have misunderstood, could you perhaps explain why you think homosexuality is a problem in the light of Darwinian natural selection?

Peace

my point was to show homosexuality is deviance.

 

[cat eyes]

Greetings,


I can't see what you're getting at. If everyone exclusively practised homosexual sex, then I expect what you say would be true. Seeing as they don't, where is the problem?

Peace

the point is its not natural ;D

darwin would find no logic in gays even ;D

oh and by the way if they do not have sex whats the point in being gay then? why does it exist.

why do they put label on themselves if majority of them do not sleep around which is kinda rubbish to me, they all sleep around

 

[czgibson]

Greetings,

I am just wondering if being gay has a genetic cause then wouldn't it eventually die out the gene pool since gays don't reproduce?

Does anyone claim that the cause of homosexuality is exclusively genetic?

I am just wondering, paedofiles also say they can not help the way they are this is the way they were born with a fetish for children so should we make this acceptable to? How is this different from being gay? they are both sexually devient. How come we accept 1 and make the other unacceptable, I mean after all a paedofile can not help how he is, this is the way he was born with a desire for children.

What about people who have sex with animals are they born like this too? lol should we accept this pratice also since people can't help how they were born?

In these two cases, either the child or the animal is not considered by most people to be able to give informed consent to sexual relations, therefore such action is seen as highly unethical.

Regarding the last three posts addressed to me, I am not sure I can find suitable words to respond.

Peace

 

[جوري]

Greetings,


In these two cases, either the child or the animal is not considered by most people to be able to give informed consent to sexual relations, therefore such action is seen as highly unethical.

Regarding the last three posts addressed to me, I am not sure I can find suitable words to respond.

Peace

'not considered' is the operative word here, we have certainly seen 13 year olds consenting to sex and lying about their age to make pornographic videos, not to mention having children out of wedlock, we have BCP passed to children as young as 11 in Midwestern states, emancipated while pregnant and then considered children after giving birth like in Chicago!
so simply because someone assumed that there were no consent doesn't make homosexuality more glorious and less aberrant!

They are all equally abhorrent if one merely tightens that confidence interval!


I expected you to not have a response otherwise, it would require a bit of science and that can be challenging when trying to reconcile with personal beliefs as I understand!
all the best

 

[DavidK565]

I just wanted to mention something quick regarding the posts about Homosexuality and Darwinism.

Human beings are (for the most part) a higher-thinking species, in comparison to all of the other animals on the planet. Our knowledge has permitted us to spend more of our time on things other than survival. So as strange as it may sound, Drawinian principles regarding propagation of the species and survival don't really apply to Humans.

The idea behind this notion is that animals do what is best for their survival. "Survival of the fittest" means that when it comes time to propagate the species, one would pick the best physical specimen, or one who is resistant to a disease spreading through the group, or whatever.

Humans however have the ability to think about things in a different manner. We marry and have children with people based on who makes more money, one's religion, pre-arranged marriages, love, etc. None of those things are supported by the natural evolutionary process.

Just look at modern medicine. It basically keeps alive people who otherwise would have been long gone, and never get the chance to have children. That is not "natural" either.

Based on that, homosexuality is not a surprise. And while the root cause has yet to be determined, what we do know is that its not genetically inherited, as it WOULD be eliminated from the gene pool, as someone else here had mentioned.

 

[Ramadhan]

Islam forbids it, but personally i dont have a problem with gay people, i mean its not like anyone would stop being gay, on the basis of religion ?

You are completely wrong.
Through my work (I work for an organization that funds many social causes), I got acquainted with a support network in Indonesia whose thousands of members are those with SSA - same sex attraction (they refuse to call themselves gay).
They are all muslims, males and females, and they are aware that they have this SSA, but they are fighting it, and they even call themselves muhajeerin (people who do the hijrah - for the sake of Allah).
Some of them never had SSE (same sex experience), while some others have.
But they all have the same goal: to please Allah SWT and to fight their unnatural urges/nafs and to complete their deen.
Many have successfully got married with children and live a (married, straight) happy life.
They realize that their SSA is just a test from Allah SWT and if they are successful to overcame it, they will be rewarded immensely Insya Allah.
I heard there are also similar organizations exist internationally in many other countries.

 

[Ramadhan]

All I can say is that I believe it's something can't be helped, that for some reason certain people have traits of the opposite sex and this leads to homosexuality.

Interesting to note that years ago, before all these so called "sexual liberation", many people who had homosexual tendency held themselves back and got married and lived straight life (and I believe many millions more are still able to do it, instead succumbing to their forbidden desires). So there goes your theory that it can't be helped.
Many people who have tendency to steal do not become thieves.
Many people who have tendency to be violent do not become murderers.
Many peole who have very strong tendency to have sex do not become rapists.
etc.
etc.

I have gay friends and they are lovely people. Has anyone against homosexuality come into contact with many gay people?

who has said that gay people cannot be lovely?
Many sickos are also amazingly lovely people. You read about a guy who imprisoned his own daughter for many years in the dungeon and raped her repeatedly was a normal lovely guy that not his own wife nor his neighbors suspected of being evil. Many paedophile priests who raped young boys are charming, lovely and respected. Hell, I am sure that even Hitler was lovely to his friends.
So what are you trying to prove here?

 

[distressed]

I don't know what kind of muslim community you live in, where practicing sodomy is seen as acceptable, paki communities have lost the plost - majority of them are very far from islam, the nutcase paki mullahs who initiate the homo marriages have commited kufr.... (im paki btw)

and maybe you aren't aware that tolerating homo's is one thing but accepting homosexuality as 'ok' or permissable will make you a kaffir

Thats cos most yongsters grow up without deen and do what they like, living in cultural society, and 4get their religion and eventually adopt the western way of living well obviosly there gona be far from islam. theres only one guy that i know of, from what i remember i dont think his family, knew anything, just wen he turned 18 he went to the registry office, married his bf and then told his family,..within few weeks they closed their business, and moved away from the local area. the other muslim guy was actually a mate of my ex, and he used to tell me about him all the time, apparently this guy was gay and proud and his parents were in2 their religion and were ok with it ?? I didnt know him, so cant comment, but he was from london.

Like i sed b4, i dont have a problem with them, but if a muslim decides to take that lifestyle, then he/she does it knowingly that there sinning. I never sed it was ok/permissable i sed islam forbade it.

 

[distressed]

As a muslim it should concern all, im sure you`ve read the story of LUTT as? InshaAllaah, if you read it, those people commited sin a huge sin, they were punished for commiting acts that werent inhumane. Being nice and not nice doesnt justify whether its correct to be one. And May Allaah guide those men you mentioned that are married,its ruining there future and their wife and kids future and life alltogether. SubhaanAllaah

Sis, ive not read that story, so ive no idea. but where i live there are men like that, as muslims they shud know its wrong....but they still continue to do it. Some think they are being clever and no1 knows, but seriously people always get caught out, and its like there not even bothered. A couple of the wifes i think know, but what do they do ?? if they've bin married to that guy for so many years, they just let them continue, cos its better than the shame they hav to face to confront the man or make an issue of something that is haram. At then end of the day i cant stop people being gay, if they know its rong and continue to do it, then sometimes theres nothing any1 can do to stop them. as muslims I can make dua for people like that, but i cant stop them being gay.

 

[distressed]

What about people who have sex with animals are they born like this too? lol should we accept this pratice also since people can't help how they were born?

Ive heard of stories of men that do that too. nope there not born like that there just disgusting and perverted.

 

[distressed]

You are completely wrong.
Through my work (I work for an organization that funds many social causes), I got acquainted with a support network in Indonesia whose thousands of members are those with SSA - same sex attraction (they refuse to call themselves gay).
They are all muslims, males and females, and they are aware that they have this SSA, but they are fighting it, and they even call themselves muhajeerin (people who do the hijrah - for the sake of Allah).
Some of them never had SSE (same sex experience), while some others have.
But they all have the same goal: to please Allah SWT and to fight their unnatural urges/nafs and to complete their deen.
Many have successfully got married with children and live a (married, straight) happy life.
They realize that their SSA is just a test from Allah SWT and if they are successful to overcame it, they will be rewarded immensely Insya Allah.
I heard there are also similar organizations exist internationally in many other countries.

ok, ive never heard of anything like that, so im unsure if theres sumfin like that in uk. the difference is these people WANT TO STOP, most dont + they have deen, deep down they know its wrong, they've willpower, most of all they fear allah, so they were willing to change, not everyone is like that.

 

[Rhubarb Tart]

Didn’t people of Lutt commit other sins too or was it just homosexuality?

This is a subject that non Muslims (in particular atheists) and Muslims would never agree upon. I see this discussion as pointless.

There is no concrete evidence to prove homosexuals were born to have same attraction to same sex. But I question why would some of them risk their lives just to be homosexual? If it is something they can switch off?

I would never underestimate their struggles (that is “gay” Muslims that have feelings for same sex). I always hope they can peace within themselves instead of turning to what Allah (swt) has forbidden.

Interesting to note that years ago, before all these so called "sexual liberation", many people who had homosexual tendency held themselves back and got married and lived straight life (and I believe many millions more are still able to do it, instead succumbing to their forbidden desires).

Many still had sex with same gender behind their spouse back...

 

[Asiyah3]

Didn’t people of Lutt commit other sins too or was it just homosexuality?

:wa:
I wonder the intention behind this question. Hope you're aim isn't to belittle homosexuality or lesbianism.

There is no concrete evidence to prove homosexuals were born to have same attraction to same sex. But I question why would some of them risk their lives just to be homosexual? If it is something they can switch off?

Yeah, why would pedophiles and zoophiles risk their lives if it's something they can switch off?

Many still had sex with same gender behind their spouse back...

I'm sure you are aware that he wasn't referring to those.

 

[Rhubarb Tart]

**muslimah**:wa:
I wonder the intention behind this question. Hope you're aim isn't to belittle homosexuality or lesbianism.

Keep wondering. People use example of people of the lutt as an example why homosexuality is the worse sin on earth. But I think the people of the lutt also committed other sins? Like adultery, music? That is no way belittling the sin itself. Homosexuality is a major sin along with other sins people of lutt have committed.

Yeah, why would pedophiles and zoophiles risk their lives if it's something they can switch off?

Paedophiles and zoophiles hardly ever get a death sentence in most countries (including Muslim countries) in this world unless they killed the child unlike homosexuality even in the past. In fact paedophiles are acceptable in some countries under the term "marriage" or "slave, servant" whilst homosexuals get hanged. Hence why I think your question is irrelevant, as most paedophiles dont face death sentence (unless they killed a child) even in America. So my question remains why would homosexuals risk their lives in countries where they would definitely hanged?

I'm sure you are aware that he wasn't referring to those.

Well those he was referring to (if it in west) is pretty small.

 

[Asiyah3]

Greetings,

In these two cases, either the child or the animal is not considered by most people to be able to give informed consent to sexual relations, therefore such action is seen as highly unethical.

Peace

Peace,
You must advocate incest in the same logic.

 

[LauraS]

who has said that gay people cannot be lovely?
Many sickos are also amazingly lovely people. You read about a guy who imprisoned his own daughter for many years in the dungeon and raped her repeatedly was a normal lovely guy that not his own wife nor his neighbors suspected of being evil. Many paedophile priests who raped young boys are charming, lovely and respected. Hell, I am sure that even Hitler was lovely to his friends.
So what are you trying to prove here?

I believe there's a big huge difference between someone secretly keeping their daughter locked away and raping her and someone happily and openly in a same sex partnership....so I'm actually not sure what you're trying to prove.

 

[Alpha Dude]

There is no concrete evidence to prove homosexuals were born to have same attraction to same sex. But I question why would some of them risk their lives just to be homosexual? If it is something they can switch off?

You could say that about any sin.. Why would any muslim do a wrong act (e.g. lie) and risk burning in hell when they can just as easily switch of their desire to this said act?

Anyway, homosexual acts and any form of sodomy is forbidden in Islam. There are people out there that struggle with it no doubt, may Allah make it easy for them, ameen.

I believe there's a big huge difference between someone secretly keeping their daughter locked away and raping her and someone happily and openly in a same sex partnership....so I'm actually not sure what you're trying to prove.

He's trying to say someone being 'lovely' does not mean it is ok to overlook their evil acts (as you tried to imply we should do when you questionned whether anybody has ever spoken to a gay).

Would you approve of a chronic liar given that he is lovely in every other way? Or a murderer for the same reason?

How about a necrophile? Or those that indulge in willing incest?

The point is that there is a flaw in your logic.