" Islam an Arab religion” Do you agree or disagree?

[Banu_Hashim]

.... and regarding the classical vs. modern arabic thing.... I don't think even arabs understand the Qur'an properly. They speak conversational arabic which is totally different the classical (and poetical) arabic of the Qur'an. Even if an arab can get the jist of it, it is unlikely they will have understood it properly as it may be a metaphor for something else etc.

So unless you've been trained by a scholar specifically to read and interpret the Qur'an it gets a bit difficult. Ofcourse many words in the Qur'an are used to today... but the context in which they are used was done so 1400 years ago. The language has evolved so much since.

 

[gmaall]

Islam an Arab religion” Do you agree or disagree?.

Islam is compeletly an arab religion.
who is an Arab entity
some one with a native speaker of the arabic language.

a) the quran is native arab ie revealed in arabic
sources: revealed in Arabic 12:2, 13:37, 16:103, 20:113, 26:195, 39:28, 41:3, 43:3,
44:58
b)the secondary sources are also Arabic for logical reasons,
c) the early muslims were arabs
d) the religion practices are done in arabic.
e) even if the muslim do not speak arabic , they pray in arabic.

compare to christianity

a) christians also believe the jewish scripture therefore not all sources were from Jesus christ
b) the jewish scripture are translated in many ancient and modern languages from Hibrew, roman, German english and so on.
c) a part from the gospels other writings are from different apostles such as simon peter, and saint paul and others
d) the christians are not required to pray in one language but do so in various languages.

fathermore both the quran and hadith are attributed to one single source and that is prophet mohamed.

not only is islam arabic but it is totally from single source.
prophet mohammed Ibn abdullah ibn abdul mitalib.,

 

[جوري]

lol funny guy..
if christians believed in jewish scriptures why do they fail to uphold its commandments?
Jews don't recognize a mangod your effigies of him nor do they believe that god eats pigs, a delicatessen loved by christians amongst other nonsensical things that have no room in monotheism..christianity is monolithic in its pagan practices, and no one else recognizes it as monotheistic save for christians!

Islam and Christianity aren't even on the same platform for comparison, but you really gave me a good chuckle with the rest..

didn't your god come from a middle eastern country by the way? I don't think he spoke english nor was he a french man!

all the best

 

[Rabi Mansur]

In Islam, the majority of followers are not Arab. Also, look at the story of Malcolm X for an example of how it can be a universal religion. If practiced correctly, it could bring down a lot of racial barriers.

On the other hand, you have to study Arabic to get a handle on the Quran and a lot of the teachings. Arabic seems to me to be the language of Islam. So it definitely has a strong Arabic influence and reflects an Arabic mindset.

:wa:

 

[Ramadhan]

a) christians also believe the jewish scripture therefore not all sources were from Jesus christ

Is this supposed to be a joke, an irony, or a sarcasm?
because that statement is so wrong on so many counts, so many levels.

I do not get it.

 

[gmaall]

Gossamer skye

The point I was making is that the christian scriptures include OT and NT and they are written in many languages therefore all the people understand it in their own language and people do not have to pray in one language. Arabic.

hence the point Islam is an Arabic religion.
she is arabic because she speaks arabic.

muslim have to pray 4 times a day
and have to do so in arabic.
to do so the have to learn the arabic prayers.
to understand the religion really well you have to understand arabic.

to get to islam you need arabic.

Islam is sea vassel
and arabic is the water.

the more water the better for the vassel of islam so it can sail.

I am not saying it is bad or good.,

just making the point how arabic is important to Muslims and Islam.

not so is christianity. today.

 

[جوري]

Gossamer skye

The point I was making is that the christian scriptures include OT and NT and they are written in many languages therefore all the people understand it in their own language and people do not have to pray in one language. Arabic.

indeed, but is a pointless point to point out ;D given the jews don't acknowledge you or your god and you in fact don't follow the laws orcommandments of God- at least as far as the god of the OT is concerned!

hence the point Islam is an Arabic religion.
she is arabic because she speaks arabic.

Not only is that fragment a non-sequitur it is also nonsensical!

muslim have to pray 4 times a day

Muslims pray five times a day plus nawafil.. shouldn't you do some basic learning before writing out of your a**?

and have to do so in arabic.
to do so the have to learn the arabic prayers.
to understand the religion really well you have to understand arabic.

The best folks to understand the religion are devout Muslims, and that actually goes without saying unless you prefer to bury your head in the sand.. indeed prayers are performed in Arabic, which is a Semitic language, same as the Jews pray in Hebrew another Semitic language of inferior breeding but that is a digression.. the point you have made actually should highlight to you, how you differ from monotheistic religion and their practiced prayers.. only paganists I believe then and now played the organ and dance around like hooligans before effigies of their gods!

all the best!

 

[north_malaysian]

hence the point Islam is an Arabic religion.

I prefer to say that Islam is a religion which Arabic is an important language... plus not all words in the Quran are of Arabic origin.

she is arabic because she speaks arabic.

there are millions of Malaysians who can speak Arabic, but they dont call themselves Arabs or recognised by the Arabs as Arab people.

muslim have to pray 4 times a day

5 times.

Islam is sea vassel
and arabic is the water.

the more water the better for the vassel of islam so it can sail.

wow... I'll give you reps for this.

I am not saying it is bad or good.,

just making the point how arabic is important to Muslims and Islam.

ok. point taken.

 

[Rabi Mansur]

am not saying it is bad or good.,

just making the point how arabic is important to Muslims and Islam.

not so is christianity. today.

Interesting points. :hmm: It certainly helps to study Hebrew and Greek if you want to understand Christianity but it is not essential. I've studied both and it made a big difference in my Bible studies, but one can really do just fine with English only. There are plenty of really good translations and commentaries on the Bible.

On the other hand, Arabic is fundamental to Islam. I have been studying the past few months and Arabic is still a barrier to me. Many of the religious terms are Arabic terms, they haven't always translated to english well. And when I study Quran in english, I am told that I better keep studying Arabic or I won't really appreciate and understand Quran. It is discouraging. :exhausted

:wa:

 

[Ramadhan]

Gossamer skye

The point I was making is that the christian scriptures include OT and NT and they are written in many languages therefore all the people understand it in their own language and people do not have to pray in one language. Arabic.

hence the point Islam is an Arabic religion.
she is arabic because she speaks arabic.

muslim have to pray 4 times a day
and have to do so in arabic.
to do so the have to learn the arabic prayers.
to understand the religion really well you have to understand arabic.

to get to islam you need arabic.

Islam is sea vassel
and arabic is the water.

the more water the better for the vassel of islam so it can sail.

I am not saying it is bad or good.,

just making the point how arabic is important to Muslims and Islam.

not so is christianity. today.

Did you get all these stuff from your priest or did you make those up yourself?
What stuff are you on?

The only truth in your babble is that arabic language is important to muslims, because that's the language in which Al Qur'an is revealed.

Don't you think there should be Aramaic or ancient hebrew bible so we know what the christianity teachings actually are?

 

[Sojourn]

I'd say there's some truth to the phrase since following the sunnah is integral and that requires accepting some aspects of Arab culture.

 

[gmaall]

, but one can really do just fine with English only. There are plenty of really good translations and commentaries on the Bible.

.. I am told that I better keep studying Arabic or I won't really appreciate and understand Quran. It is discouraging. :exhausted

:wa:

good points.

I want to not offend Muslims for their believes but so far

"Gossamer skye"
claimed the (all) christians eat bigs and probably enjoy and
"Hebrew another Semitic language of inferior breeding"..

how can you offend other people if you are promoting a religion that is for all minkind.
it is hard to differenciate "Us" the Arabic people from the arabic muslim Identity against them the chrisitans and the Jewish... really really difficult.


if islam compelete way of live at the center of that is a) the Quran and the sunnah and all the Islamic documentations. which is arabic.. scriptures.

no other people have translated the whole islamic scriptures and totaly made it into other languages.. (as far as I know)..

I would love to see the world where everyone prays their mother language.
and praise god who made them their languages.

and Arabic is just one of the langauges of the world not more important then others.

and I would be the first to defend if people claim it is inferior or the people are. that is immature.

making people learn your language is a bit imperialism.

 

[Hugo]

good points. I want to not offend Muslims for their believes but so far

"Gossamer skye" claimed the (all) christians eat bigs and probably enjoy and
"Hebrew another Semitic language of inferior breeding"..

how can you offend other people if you are promoting a religion that is for all minkind. it is hard to differenciate "Us" the Arabic people from the arabic muslim Identity against them the Christian and the Jewish... really really difficult. if islam compelete way of live at the center of that is a) the Quran and the sunnah and all the Islamic documentations. which is arabic.. scriptures.

no other people have translated the whole islamic scriptures and totaly made it into other languages.. (as far as I know).. I would love to see the world where everyone prays their mother language. and praise god who made them their languages. and Arabic is just one of the langauges of the world not more important then others.

and I would be the first to defend if people claim it is inferior or the people are. that is immature.

making people learn your language is a bit imperialism.

When writing an essay like this it is a good starting point to think about what problem you are trying to solve by completing the essay. Here we might say the problem might be mutual misunderstanding or cultural misrepresentation or a possible clash between western and eastern modes of thought or Muslims tend to give unquestioning support to Islamic dogma but Christians and Jews take a more openly questioning approach to their faith etc. That will give your essay focus.

Now I am not suggesting you will solve an age old difficulty but you can try to go some way to bridging any gaps there are if only in your own mind.

Secondly, you must understand that everyone has bias and there is not a lot you can do about it but you can KNOW or be aware of your own bias and that will help you keep a balanced course.

One must not set out to offend but on the other hand one has to be honest and forthright if any value is to emerge here. For example Professor Bernard Lewis has been both very critical of Islam and very complimentary so one does not have to be one or the other to say something of value. As Professor Bronowski once said about the role of a student:

It important that students bring a certain ragamuffin, barefoot irreverence to their studies; they are not here to hero-worship what is known but to question it.

 

[GreyKode]

good points.

I want to not offend Muslims for their believes but so far

"Gossamer skye"
claimed the (all) christians eat bigs and probably enjoy and
"Hebrew another Semitic language of inferior breeding"..

how can you offend other people if you are promoting a religion that is for all minkind.
it is hard to differenciate "Us" the Arabic people from the arabic muslim Identity against them the chrisitans and the Jewish... really really difficult.


if islam compelete way of live at the center of that is a) the Quran and the sunnah and all the Islamic documentations. which is arabic.. scriptures.

no other people have translated the whole islamic scriptures and totaly made it into other languages.. (as far as I know)..

I would love to see the world where everyone prays their mother language.
and praise god who made them their languages.

and Arabic is just one of the langauges of the world not more important then others.

and I would be the first to defend if people claim it is inferior or the people are. that is immature.

making people learn your language is a bit imperialism.

One simple question,
What language did Jesus(pbuh), speak? One language or many?
The Qur'an was revealed in Arabic and the sayings of the prophet(pbuh) were in his mother tongue what is so strange about that?
There are translations of the Qur'an in many different languages, some of the top scholars of Islam were not arab but persian like the famous hadith collector al bukhari, and also there are famous pakistani and Indian muslim scholars, islamic material is present in those languages as well, urdu, farsi and indonesian. etc etc
Second, Islam spread in the region of the arabian peninsula and the middle east which is predominantly arab speaking.
Third, arab christians have hymns and prayers which are in greek I think, (correct me if wrong) but not arabic.
Fourth, Islam didn't spread very much into europe or the roman empire thus you can't find much material in those languages, unlike for example pakistan or Indonesia.
Finally, what other christian material exists in different languages besides the bible? I need an answer.

 

[al Iskander]

I'd say there's some truth to the phrase since following the sunnah is integral and that requires accepting some aspects of Arab culture.

I saw during the pilgrimage a lot of muslims coming from Russia , Albania or Bosnia . These countries are not Arabic but European or Slavic and those people don't know the Arabic culture .

I am french of origin and Christian converted to the Islam and I promise you it is by no means to be Arabic to be Muslim .

Moreover , that means " Arabic culture " today ? :hmm:

Friendly .

 

[Sojourn]

I saw during the pilgrimage a lot of muslims coming from Russia , Albania or Bosnia . These countries are not Arabic but European or Slavic and those people don't know the Arabic culture .

Non-Arabs can adopt Arab culture.

 

[north_malaysian]

Non-Arabs can adopt Arab culture.

in this part of the world the Arabs adopted Malay culture.

 

[mkh4JC]

Finally, what other christian material exists in different languages besides the bible? I need an answer.

As just two examples, John Bunyan's Pilgrim's Progress is translated into many languages, an allegorical tale about the life of Christians, translated into more than 200 languages actually: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilgrims_Progress

C.S. Lewis' Chronicles of Narnia series has Christian elements (Lewis was Christian) and is available in 41 languages.

 

[Ramadhan]

if islam compelete way of live at the center of that is a) the Quran and the sunnah and all the Islamic documentations. which is arabic.. scriptures.

Yeah...so?

Are you suggesting that Al Qur'an should have been revelead in other languages, such as italian and all the sunnah been recorded in english, considering:
a. The prophet Muhammad SAW was an arab AND illiterate
b. the community where Muhammad SAW lived was an arab community
?

Do you think the jewish community where Jesus pbuh lived would have accepted his teachings if Jesus pbuh started to speak to them in GREEK?
Or was the injeel revealed to Jesus pbuh in chinese?

no other people have translated the whole islamic scriptures and totaly made it into other languages.. (as far as I know)..

apparently you do not know very far.

I would love to see the world where everyone prays their mother language.
and praise god who made them their languages.

Muslims can pray in ANY language they understand. It is only the recitation of Al Qur'an that we recite in Arabic, because well...if you still don't know yet.. Al Qur'an is in arabic.
And why the Qur'an must be in arabic? let me see.... maybe it's one way to preserve it, unlike some other scriptures?

I speak four languages, I can pray to Allah SWT in any of those four languages that I am comfortable with, with the exception of shalat and Qur'an recitation.

making people learn your language is a bit imperialism.

You have not traveled much, have you?

 

[جوري]

"Gossamer skye"
claimed the (all) christians eat bigs and probably enjoy and
"Hebrew another Semitic language of inferior breeding"..

The point is neither of all or some.. the point is that your alleged god abrogated a commandment and not directly of something he loathed.. one wonders why your god is so fickle and indecisive?
Indeed Hebrew is a lesser language than Arabic even though they are both Semitic but that was never the point as I have no interest in expanding on details of what makes languages evolved and rich, surely even you can understand that no messenger or god on earth spoke English, rather your apologists can't agree whether it was Latin/Greek/Hebrew/Aramaic that he spoke, don't you think the words of your god and his language are of supreme importance? Just so you are not alleging this one day
Leviticus 11,7-8 And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be cloven footed, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you. Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcass shall ye not touch, they are unclean to you (KJV.) Deuteronomy 14,8 And the swine, because it divideth the hoof, yet cheweth not the cud, it is unclean unto you. Ye shall not eat of their flesh, nor touch their dead carcass (KJV.)

and then changing his mind the next by some questionable means?

how can you offend other people if you are promoting a religion that is for all minkind.
it is hard to differenciate "Us" the Arabic people from the arabic muslim Identity against them the chrisitans and the Jewish... really really difficult.

Where in any of my posts did I affirm that I am promoting my religion to you or anyone else? Doesn't logic dictate that if I were interested in extending that promotion that I'd be in pursuit of Christian/ Jewish/Atheist/Buddhist forums than being a member on an Islamic board?

As far as I am concerned you have no religion or identity, you are folks content turning a man (as per the epistle of his own brother James) cursing the earth for not bearing him fruit, going hungry, using bathrooms, praying not to be forsaken, a man who has poor judgment over the people whom he chose to carry the torch in his absence; into a god and making the central theme of your religion focus on something as anti-climactic as his death, not his message or his work.. what is the point of that? Good for you, you are eating your god's flesh and drinking his blood, and believe that he died for you. God has died and the universe didn't collapse, to you that is a proper superior religion, then be happy and go live your life.. not sure what the deal is, why do you have to spend the bulk of your life fixating on something entirely laughable (as Islam being an 'Arab religion') simply to appease yourself into believing the man/god fantasies are valid?

if islam compelete way of live at the center of that is a) the Quran and the sunnah and all the Islamic documentations. which is arabic.. scriptures.

What is your point?

no other people have translated the whole islamic scriptures and totaly made it into other languages.. (as far as I know)..

really?
http://www.islamway.com/SF/quran/

funny you should say as Islam has 1.86 billion adherents and it seems that your church elders are having a fit over it..

For the first time in history we are no longer at the top: the Muslims have overtaken us," Formenti told Vatican newspaper L'Osservatore Romano in an interview, saying the data referred to 2006.
​

http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKL3068682420080330

I would love to see the world where everyone prays their mother language.
and praise god who made them their languages.

That is called supplication, people make supplications in their mother tongue all the time.. Proper prayer (salat) and supplication (treating god as your personal genie on the occasion of stress) are completely different things!

and Arabic is just one of the langauges of the world not more important then others.

and I would be the first to defend if people claim it is inferior or the people are. that is immature.

You are as smart as you are educated.. everyone has an opinion of course and you are entitled to yours, so long as in the scheme of things you realize that no one really gives a **** what you think!

making people learn your language is a bit imperialism.

whatever you say..
for the Muslims on board.. I end on this most noble note:


(Yusuf Ali: 6:66-68)

"But thy people reject this, though it is the Truth. Say: "Not mine is the responsibility for arranging your affairs."

"For every Message is a limit of time, And soon shall ye know it."

"When thou seest men engaged in vain discourse about our Signs, turn away from them unless they turn to a different theme. If Satan ever makes thee forget, then after recollection, sit not thou in the company of those who do wrong."