israel is attacking a whole city for one zionist criminal soldier!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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One of the Most difficult concepts to get across, is the concept that True Jews were/are Muslim.

A Muslim is a person who submits to the Will of God(swt) so to say that the Jews were not Muslim is to say they did/do not submit to the will of God(swt)

There always were Muslims since the creation of the first being capable of submitting to the Will of God(swt).

If the Jews had kept and followed the Truth Judaism would be the true Muslims of today. However, something was lost so the Truth had to be rerevealed through I'sa and the True Christians were the Muslims. But, it was lost again. It was finaly re-revealed again in the Glorious Qur'an and so Today the Muslims are those who follow the Qur'an. The same Truth as what was first revealed to Adam and all the Prophets.
 
Woodrow said:
One of the Most difficult concepts to get across, is the concept that True Jews were/are Muslim.

A Muslim is a person who submits to the Will of God(swt) so to say that the Jews were not Muslim is to say they did/do not submit to the will of God(swt)

There always were Muslims since the creation of the first being capable of submitting to the Will of God(swt).

If the Jews had kept and followed the Truth Judaism would be the true Muslims of today. However, something was lost so the Truth had to be rerevealed through I'sa and the True Christians were the Muslims. But, it was lost again. It was finaly re-revealed again in the Glorious Qur'an and so Today the Muslims are those who follow the Qur'an. The same Truth as what was first revealed to Adam and all the Prophets.
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That is funny because since the Torah commands Jews never to believe a prophet who wants to change Judaism, and they worshiped the Torah thousands of years before Islam and called themselves 'Jews' I would ahve to say that Jews are not Muslims.

Jews believed and always believed that the Torah was binding law no matter what! The fact that Islam does not believe this makes it that they are not Jews who lived in the Holy Land. Islam is not Judaism. Islam started in Saudi Arabia, and most of the descendants of Islam from the Middle East today trace there roots to pagan worshiping tribes in Arabia.

True Jews would have never broken the law of the Torah because in the Torah it sais that God will never make them no longer binding. Therefore a true Jew who followed the Torah is a Jew that never became a Muslim or Christian.
 
SirZubair said:
I have noticed.

On their behalf,i apoligise to each and every non-muslim on this forum that has been offended by ANY article posted by a muslim.

And as for those who are about to call me an apoligist,.go ahead.

I would rather be an apoligist than behave like a 5 year old child who fights over a crayon.

wa'salaam.
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I just noticed this post. SirZubair is correct. We are acting like 5 year old children. We can all stand up for our beliefs. But, defending our beliefs does not need to be a verbal agressive attact upon another person's beliefs.
 
Woodrow said:
I just noticed this post. SirZubair is correct. We are acting like 5 year old children. We can all stand up for our beliefs. But, defending our beliefs does not need to be a verbal agressive attact upon another person's beliefs.
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Very True.

These thread usually get ugly. lol.
 
Woodrow said:
One of the Most difficult concepts to get across, is the concept that True Jews were/are Muslim.

A Muslim is a person who submits to the Will of God(swt) so to say that the Jews were not Muslim is to say they did/do not submit to the will of God(swt)

There always were Muslims since the creation of the first being capable of submitting to the Will of God(swt).

If the Jews had kept and followed the Truth Judaism would be the true Muslims of today. However, something was lost so the Truth had to be rerevealed through I'sa and the True Christians were the Muslims. But, it was lost again. It was finaly re-revealed again in the Glorious Qur'an and so Today the Muslims are those who follow the Qur'an. The same Truth as what was first revealed to Adam and all the Prophets.
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What proof do you have of this? I can easily say that my bible say Jesus was the son of God and salvation only comes through him so the others are wrong. I can say that Catholics are wrong for idolizing Mary. I can say my Torah say Christians are
wrong and Jesus was a false prophet. Just becuase I say that don't mean it was right. Show me any mention of Islam before Mohammed came on the scene.
 
Greetings,

I find this idea that Muslims have existed since the year dot to be one of the strangest ideas of Islam. It seems to derive from two distinct meanings of the word. First, there is 'Islam', and 'Muslim', in the literal sense: 'submission to god' and 'one who submits to god'. I don't have any difficulty in accepting that, on one view of the world, people have submitted to god since before the time of Muhammad (pbuh).

Then there is the second meaning, which most people more quickly associate with the word: a Muslim is a follower of the world religion of Islam; one whose holy book is the Qur'an, and who follows the Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). By definition, this Islam can only exist after the birth of Muhammad (pbuh). It is the confusion between these two meanings that makes the idea seem strange to people.

Peace
 
I would also like to know if anyone who said the Torah is corrupt could awnser this for me:

Do you know of any archeological inscription dated within 100 years of Muhammad's death where he is called a prophet? If so, please name it.
 
:sl:
Islam was the message brought by all the Prophets and Messengers, the last of whom is Muhammad pbuh. So in the time of Prophet Musa, the religion was based on following the revelations sent to him, likewise with the time of Prophet 'Iesa. This is now the case with Prophet Muhammad. Peace be upon them all,
Do you know of any archeological inscription dated within 100 years of Muhammad's death where he is called a prophet? If so, please name it.
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Absolutely! Here is one:
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/History/Islam/Inscriptions/abasa.html

Many others here:
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/History/Islam/Inscriptions/

Regards
 
ganeshsikkim said:
That is funny because since the Torah commands Jews never to believe a prophet who wants to change Judaism, and they worshiped the Torah thousands of years before Islam and called themselves 'Jews' I would ahve to say that Jews are not Muslims.

Jews believed and always believed that the Torah was binding law no matter what! The fact that Islam does not believe this makes it that they are not Jews who lived in the Holy Land. Islam is not Judaism. Islam started in Saudi Arabia, and most of the descendants of Islam from the Middle East today trace there roots to pagan worshiping tribes in Arabia.

True Jews would have never broken the law of the Torah because in the Torah it sais that God will never make them no longer binding. Therefore a true Jew who followed the Torah is a Jew that never became a Muslim or Christian.
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"That is funny because since the Torah commands Jews never to believe a prophet who wants to change Judaism, and they worshiped the Torah thousands of years before Islam and called themselves 'Jews' I would ahve to say that Jews are not Muslims."

I believe the Tauret (Torah) was the original Truth revealed to Us and that the Jews were the Chosen people and that the Jews did submit to the will of God(swt) and that a person who submits to the will of God(swt) is Muslim.

"Jews believed and always believed that the Torah was binding law no matter what! The fact that Islam does not believe this makes it that they are not Jews who lived in the Holy Land. Islam is not Judaism. Islam started in Saudi Arabia, and most of the descendants of Islam from the Middle East today trace there roots to pagan worshiping tribes in Arabia."

Muslims also believe the original Torah was the binding law of God(swt) and that God(swt) would not change it. But, I believe the Torah no longer exists fully as it was originaly revealed. I also believe Islam did not start in Saudi Arabia, it is simply the location of the final Prophet(pbuh) to whom the truth was revealed to for the final time. It is not a new revelation nor a change of what was originaly sent through all the Prophets(Peace be Upon Them)

True Jews would have never broken the law of the Torah because in the Torah it sais that God will never make them no longer binding. Therefore a true Jew who followed the Torah is a Jew that never became a Muslim or Christian.

I agree with that except for the last sentence. The Jews would not have had to BECOME Muslim, because they were Muslim.
 
I'm sorry to say that Jews are not Muslims.

Jews follow the Torah
Muslims follow the Quran

Jews followed the Torah in Israel before Muhammad.
Islam began in Saudi Arabia and the creation of the Quran.

The fact that Islam believes that the Quran is the word of G-d completley contradicts Judaism and all of its teachings before Muhammad. Jews were not Muslims because Jews followed the Torah. Jews were not Muslims because the Torah sais that G-d will never allow the Torah's laws to be broken.

Christianity, and Islam do not follow the laws of the Torah. Therefore, they are not Jews.

I agree with that except for the last sentence. The Jews would not have had to BECOME Muslim, because they were Muslim.
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To be Muslim you have to accept the Quran as the word of G-d. The Quran is not the word of G-d. Jews do not accept it. Therefore Jews 'submited to G-d' but the teachings Islam teaches are not Jewish. Were never Jewish, and will never be Jewish teachings.
 
i was soo pissed off wen i heard that on the news..ya Allah..i wish i can do somethin bout it..but all i got is dua..Alhamdulilah!
 
lavikor201 said:
The Quran is not the word of G-d. Jews do not accept it.
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how did you know it's not the word of God?! have you ever read it DEEPLY from your heart?!?! have you ever understood it??!?!? no.. you didn't... so you basically can't say such thing unless you PROVE IT to us... which you basically CAN'T.

Muslims never said that Torah and the bible are not words of God, Torah and Bible are mentioned in Qur'an were it's confirmed that three books are words of God BUT Bible and Torah lost there original revelation by disbelievers.

you have asked a question and brother ansar al-adl have replyed and PROVED YOU WRONG.. why didn't you comment about it?!?

any way... here is SOME verses were God is talking about Torah and Bible.. and there is more if you want...


نَزَّلَ عَلَيْكَ الْكِتَابَ بِالْحَقِّ مُصَدِّقًا لِمَا بَيْنَ يَدَيْهِ وَأَنْزَلَ التَّوْرَاةَ وَالْإِنْجِيلَ

3-3:سورة ال عمران​
[3-1] It is He Who has sent down the Book (the Qur'ân) to you (Muhammad (peace be upon him)) with truth, confirming what came before it. And he sent down the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel).
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إِنَّا أَنْزَلْنَا التَّوْرَاةَ فِيهَا هُدًى وَنُورٌ يَحْكُمُ بِهَا النَّبِيُّونَ الَّذِينَ أَسْلَمُوا لِلَّذِينَ هَادُوا وَالرَّبَّانِيُّونَ وَالْأَحْبَارُ بِمَا اسْتُحْفِظُوا مِنْ كِتَابِ اللَّهِ وَكَانُوا عَلَيْهِ شُهَدَاءَ فَلَا تَخْشَوُا النَّاسَ وَاخْشَوْنِ وَلَا تَشْتَرُوا بِآيَاتِي ثَمَنًا قَلِيلًا وَمَنْ لَمْ يَحْكُمْ بِمَا أَنْزَلَ اللَّهُ فَأُولَئِكَ هُمُ الْكَافِرُونَ

سورة المائدة
[5-44]​
[5-44] Verily, We did send down the Taurât (Torah) (to Mûsâ (Moses)) therein was guidance and light, by which the Prophets, who submitted themselves to Allâh's Will, judged for the Jews. And the rabbis and the priests (too judged for the Jews by the Taurât (Torah) after those Prophets), for to them was entrusted the protection of Allâh's Book, and they were witnesses thereto. Therefore fear not men but fear Me (O Jews) and sell not My Verses for a miserable price. And whosoever does not judge by what Allâh has revealed, such are the Kâfirûn (i.e. disbelievers - of a lesser degree as they do not act on Allâh's Laws).
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وَلَوْ أَنَّهُمْ أَقَامُوا التَّوْرَاةَ وَالْإِنْجِيلَ وَمَا أُنْزِلَ إِلَيْهِمْ مِنْ رَبِّهِمْ لَأَكَلُوا مِنْ فَوْقِهِمْ وَمِنْ تَحْتِ أَرْجُلِهِمْ مِنْهُمْ أُمَّةٌ مُقْتَصِدَةٌ وَكَثِيرٌ مِنْهُمْ سَاءَ مَا يَعْمَلُونَ

سورة المائدة
[5-66]​
[5-66] And if only they had acted according to the Taurât (Torah), the Injeel (Gospel), and what has (now) been sent down to them from their Lord (the Qur'ân), they would surely have gotten provision from above them and from underneath their feet. There are from among them people who are on the right course (i.e. they act on the revelation and believe in Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) like 'Abdullâh bin Salâm (may Allah be pleased with him)) but many of them do evil deeds.
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how did you know it's not the word of God?! have you ever read it DEEPLY from your heart?!?! have you ever understood it??!?!? no.. you didn't... so you basically can't say such thing unless you PROVE IT to us... which you basically CAN'T.

Muslims never said that Torah and the bible are not words of God, Torah and Bible are mentioned in Qur'an were it's confirmed that three books are words of God BUT Bible and Torah lost there original revelation by disbelievers.

you have asked a question and brother ansar al-quds have replyed and PROVED YOU WRONG.. why didn't you comment about it?!?

any way... here is the SOME verses were God is talking about Torah and Bible.. and there is more if you want...
Click to expand...

According to his beliefs the Torah is the only word of God, and that is it. He is right, according to Jewish Law, the Quran is of no signifigance.

Sometimes we all have to accept that we just don't believe the same thing.
 
ganeshsikkim said:
The Native Americans should do what the Jews did and take back there homeland. It is there rightful land just like its the Jews rightful land.
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I agree with this, if somebody takes what belongs to you, it's is your right to retrieve it!

Although i'm not too sure of how many Native Americans are left.
 
I can not think of a single culture in existance today, that did not gain it's land without conquering and eliminating the previous inhabitants. I'm not saying that is right, just saying it as a historical fact.

Now that every bit of arable land has been occupied, any expansion we see by any nation is going to be at the expense of another nation. We can no longer think of peacefull coexistance as a luxury, it is now a necessity.

Perhaps we will never all agree on the same things, but all disagreements have to be handled in peace. I believe the world has become too small for warfare to be an effective means of settling disputes. Each nation is now dependent on other nations for survival. It is virtualy impossible for any people to survive without the cooperation of their neighbors.
 
Woodrow said:
I can not think of a single culture in existance today, that did not gain it's land without conquering and eliminating the previous inhabitants. I'm not saying that is right, just saying it as a historical fact.

Now that every bit of arable land has been occupied, any expansion we see by any nation is going to be at the expense of another nation. We can no longer think of peacefull coexistance as a luxury, it is now a necessity.

Perhaps we will never all agree on the same things, but all disagreements have to be handled in peace. I believe the world has become too small for warfare to be an effective means of settling disputes. Each nation is now dependent on other nations for survival. It is virtualy impossible for any people to survive without the cooperation of their neighbors.
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If you look at Zimbabwe (sp) mugabe is taking land off the white people and giving it back to the black, is that right or wrong? Don't forget it belonged to the blacks.
 

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