Isrealis Dates for Ramadhan:Boycott

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We stand with the Palestinians. But, let us stand as the Palestinians themselves want us to stand. Let us give them real support and ask them what is best for them. To me the best way is to check with Palestinians and learn what will support them and what will harm them.

But, one thing to keep in mind, until Palestine is an economic enity on it's own any help for Palestinians will benefit Israel. We can not let that stop us from supporting Palestinians.
 
We stand with the Palestinians. But, let us stand as the Palestinians themselves want us to stand. Let us give them real support and ask them what is best for them. To me the best way is to check with Palestinians and learn what will support them and what will harm them.

But, one thing to keep in mind, until Palestine is an economic enity on it's own any help for Palestinians will benefit Israel. We can not let that stop us from supporting Palestinians.

actually it's even more hurt to hear that some our Palestinian brethren are threated as 3rd class citizens by their muslim brethren in some countries....
 
Salaam Zulkiflim,

I will try to answer some of your questions from your previous thread.


Salaam,

Once thin you need to undrstand that the thread is started is about one item but the boycott is for ALL isrealis goods,tangible or intangible.

As for boycotting the dates will helping Israel?
Can you pls explain?

One thing it will do is increase the number of unemployed Palestinians. Produce more competition for jobs and allow the Israeli employers to find more Palestinians who will have to work for less. Each Israeli business that goes under results in more available Palestinian labor at lower wages.




Let us make a scenario.
Right now the Isrealis control Palesitne land and pay chep labour to force Palestinain to work.

These good are then sent thru out the world,under the name Isrealis goods.
May i ask who garner the greatest economic value from this?

The Palesitnian?
Or the Isrealis?

The less jobs there are for Palestinians, the lower the wages become and the more the Israelis benefit. Keep in mind there is no real Palestinian industries. The Palestinians rely on Israeli jobs.


The Isrealis will get better trade deals,a huge demand for Isrelis Palestinina made product ,and they get moce economic aid to suppress and continue the oppresion.

Why will the Isrealis stop the oppresion and genocide in Palestine as long as they make money from it?

True, and the less jobs there are for Palestinians the lower their salaries will be and the more oppressed they will become.


You say you want to save the lone Palesitina whom are working for the Isrealis out of force,,but are you saving their future generation or rahter enabling the Isrelais to further extend their mantra of oppresion?

It is a 2 way street. Palestinians need to be enabled to build up their own economy and be self sufficient, but until that day comes, they are dependent on Israeli business for survival. Perhaps a better quetion is why doesn't Jordan allow the Palestinians to cross the river into Jordan and work, instead of letting them depend on Israeli employers.

The Isrealis will say via economic factor,Here we export dates to muslim and non muslim coutnries for Muslims,,,,they are clearly labelled made in israel...and these muslim support Israel good...
So why are people complaining about the oppresion of Palesitne people?
Dont they want their goods? Dont they want our porducts made cheap thru palestine??

One reason is because oppressed people never become viable consumer. Commerce is in to directions. Producer and consumer, for it to work and for all to succeed the producers have to develop the resources to be able to also be consumers. Oppressed People can never become significant consumers. There is also the morality issue of it just isn't nice to oppress people.
 
salaam,


Leader are human being ,,they will do what they will do..
But as individuals do we place our sin and deed on our leaders?
Do we blame other for our actiona nd faults?


Our leaders do as they see fit,they shall asnwer for it.

Inshallah..We should also do as we see fit and we will also be answerable..

I fear the Question when we are dead,,and we live again.

Do you follow other and acts as other does.
Astarfillah,if that were the cae Islam would never have been for the whn the Quraish asked the Prophet to stop his preaching and in return they will give him wealth and staus above all of them...he would have done it..

Astarfillah...

Is t so hard to not buy something?
Is it so hard to spend more for items that come from Islamic coutnries...
Is it so ahrd to research about item made in Israel,and what iten consist of item.. made in Israel?

Is it so hard...

wa salam..

brother, its an admirable sentiment, but thats all it is, really it wont achieve anything, you have to look at the wider scope. so what if you stop israel, is that going to solve the ummahs problems? no it isnt, the facts are seen plainly.
 
wa salam..

brother, its an admirable sentiment, but thats all it is, really it wont achieve anything, you have to look at the wider scope. so what if you stop israel, is that going to solve the ummahs problems? no it isnt, the facts are seen plainly.

Agreed, and we can unite the Ummah through positive means and help bring about permanent peaceful changes. We can listen to the Palestinians themselves and see what they want from the Ummah and what they know will work and actually help them. They are the experts, they live it daily and know first hand what "help" actually makes conditions worse and what will help them become self sufficient. This what they want, do we not see it because it is too easy sounding?

Let us listen to the Palestinians:

International participation is important for a number of reasons:

1.Protection: An international presence at Palestinian civilian actions can ensure a degree of protection for Palestinians engaged in nonviolent resistance.

2.Message to the mainstream media: The Palestinian struggle is not accurately reported by the mainstream corporate media. The mainstream media portrays Israelis and Palestinians as two equal sides who can’t live together fighting over a piece of land, instead of an Israeli military occupation and a Palestinian struggle for freedom, self-determination and human rights. People from all over the world that join us can reach out to their respective media and help dispel this notion.

3.Personal witness and transmitting information: International civilians joining Palestinians can bear witness and return home to talk to their communities about what is happening.

4. Break isolation and provide hope: The occupation isolates Palestinians and cuts them off from the rest of the world and from each other. International ciivilians coming in, despite restrictions, send a message to the Palestinian community - "we see, we hear and we are with you." Hope that people acting together can change things is a cornerstone of our philosophy and message.

Source: http://www.palsolidarity.org/main/about-ism/

The Palestinians need support not boycots against Israel. We need to look at what will benefit Palestinians, not think in terms of seeking to harm Israel. Until Palestine becomes independent we can not harm Israel without harming Palestinians.
 
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The Palestinians need support not boycots against Israel. We need to look at what will benefit Palestinians, not think in terms of seeking to harm Israel. Until Palestine becomes independent we can not harm Israel without harming Palestinians.

Maybe it is better to exert our energy for more positive initiatives, such as making Palestinian case more widely known in the influential countries. This should be achieved in such a manner that no one should find the chance to accuse of being such and such. The Palestine cause should be dealt with on a pure humane base, free from the politics of opportunism.
 
Maybe it is better to exert our energy for more positive initiatives, such as making Palestinian case more widely known in the influential countries. This should be achieved in such a manner that no one should find the chance to accuse of being such and such. The Palestine cause should be dealt with on a pure humane base, free from the politics of opportunism.

Palsolidarity is doing just that. I am very impressed with them and recommend anyone with any interest in Palestine to check them out.

http://www.palsolidarity.org/main/about-ism/
 
maybe companies that employed Palestinians should not label "Made in Israel" for Muslim market because Muslims are allergic with the word "Israel" thus deprived them from buying goods that will benefit the Palestinians.

Is it true many farm workers in Israel are Thais, of which some of them are Muslims?

Why should they do that?

Are you saying that Muslims are anti-jewish and refuse to by any product made by a poor jewish worker, but will support a poor palestinian worker?

Yet you expect Israel to be of the highest moral standards when the topic is cultural relations? Hypocrisy!
 
Yet you expect Israel to be of the highest moral standards when the topic is cultural relations? Hypocrisy!

Maybe people are being hypocrite just because they don't have enough cluster bombs to drop on civil targets... Not a single Palestinian enjoys the unquestioned military and economic aids from the USA as Israel does. Maybe that's why you are not a hypocrite.

Forget about the moral standarts... Give Palestine half the money Israel receives from the US and then you begin to boycott the products Palestine produces. Good bargain?
 
Maybe people are being hypocrite just because they don't have enough cluster bombs to drop on civil targets... Not a single Palestinian enjoys the unquestioned military and economic aids from the USA as Israel does. Maybe that's why you are not a hypocrite.

The Palestinian enjoyed the unquestioned military and economic aid from the Soviet Union during all of Israel's wars.

Just because Israel's superpower ally is still around, you should not fault them.
 
Why should they do that?

Are you saying that Muslims are anti-jewish and refuse to by any product made by a poor jewish worker, but will support a poor palestinian worker?

Yet you expect Israel to be of the highest moral standards when the topic is cultural relations? Hypocrisy!

I dont know about other Muslim nattions, but in my country, culturally we are anti-semitic. I would never sell anything with the word "made in Israel" in my nation - I might be disowned by my people and furthermore paying fines for selling Israeli goods in Malaysia...
 
The Palestinian enjoyed the unquestioned military and economic aid from the Soviet Union during all of Israel's wars.

Just because Israel's superpower ally is still around, you should not fault them.

hmm... they atack civillians, shoot children on the school run indiscriminatley, the US and israel refuse to deal with hamas even though it was a democratically elected government, the US uses israel as its proxy to create wars in the region (lebanon), the US usurps muslim resources, the US does not want muslims in the region and across the world to decide there own political destiny... but hmm, no lets not fault them, that would just be silly wouldnt it?
 
:sl:
If this boycott is to reduce the US' and/or Israeli's monetary funding, it won't work. US is already in debt of substantial amounts and it hasn't stopped them from using absurd amounts of money. Both countries can just take out loans (which would put the respective country in debt) yet still their economy could strive (strange huh? no, just not right) cus business is booming and people are buying.

P.s; boycott dates?!
 
I saw the thread and my mind associated that: "what! are the Israelis trying to falisfy when the crescent moon was first seen?".

But would you put it past them?
 
wa salam..

brother, its an admirable sentiment, but thats all it is, really it wont achieve anything, you have to look at the wider scope. so what if you stop israel, is that going to solve the ummahs problems? no it isnt, the facts are seen plainly.


Salaam,

Somtime when you look too big you do not see the small things.
i ask you as a man as an individual,,what can you do that will affect the chage in the Ummah as a whole?

Nothing..

we are called the Ummah to be a collective...an individual action,one by one if goes in the same flow Inshallah will casue a tornado.

But what do you see here now?

Even to boycott to spend a bit more to not support Israel....it is so hard to do..
 
Salaam Zulkiflim,

I will try to answer some of your questions from your previous thread.




One thing it will do is increase the number of unemployed Palestinians. Produce more competition for jobs and allow the Israeli employers to find more Palestinians who will have to work for less. Each Israeli business that goes under results in more available Palestinian labor at lower wages.






The less jobs there are for Palestinians, the lower the wages become and the more the Israelis benefit. Keep in mind there is no real Palestinian industries. The Palestinians rely on Israeli jobs.




True, and the less jobs there are for Palestinians the lower their salaries will be and the more oppressed they will become.




It is a 2 way street. Palestinians need to be enabled to build up their own economy and be self sufficient, but until that day comes, they are dependent on Israeli business for survival. Perhaps a better quetion is why doesn't Jordan allow the Palestinians to cross the river into Jordan and work, instead of letting them depend on Israeli employers.



One reason is because oppressed people never become viable consumer. Commerce is in to directions. Producer and consumer, for it to work and for all to succeed the producers have to develop the resources to be able to also be consumers. Oppressed People can never become significant consumers. There is also the morality issue of it just isn't nice to oppress people.


Salaam,

Again my question is simple...

Tell me,when you buy Isrealis goods,empower the Palestinians,increase the trade between Israelis and the world.

What does it do to the Palestinians?

As you know,inshallah,the land the Isrealis control are Palesitnians.
The workers and Paletinain,on an ILLEGAL settlement.

You yourself recognize that the Palesitnain are paid nuts for the tedious jobs.

But what is stop the Isrealis from penalising or forcing the Palestinian from cutting the pay TO INCREASE PROFIT?

What is to stop the Isrelais from massacaring more Palestinian tro get more land for more products?
What is to stop the Isrealis from further debilitating the Palesitnain economy,so that they cna further reduce the pay of the average palestinians?


Like i said in the question,the Isrelais economic minister ask you,,why do you want to palesitnian state?
Dont you know the good you buy and wear are made cheap using palesitnian labour and palestinian land?If they have their own state would you support them?

For an economist,it just mean that Israel has strong support..

I understand you want to talk about the Palestinian whom are working now under Isrealis rule for peanuts...May i ask,,how long will you want to perpetuate it?
 
Agreed, and we can unite the Ummah through positive means and help bring about permanent peaceful changes. We can listen to the Palestinians themselves and see what they want from the Ummah and what they know will work and actually help them. They are the experts, they live it daily and know first hand what "help" actually makes conditions worse and what will help them become self sufficient. This what they want, do we not see it because it is too easy sounding?

Let us listen to the Palestinians:



Source: http://www.palsolidarity.org/main/about-ism/

The Palestinians need support not boycots against Israel. We need to look at what will benefit Palestinians, not think in terms of seeking to harm Israel. Until Palestine becomes independent we can not harm Israel without harming Palestinians.


Salaam,

that is a great website,,but pls after reading this..

How many more years do you wnat to perpetuate Isrealis dominion over Palestine?

How long do you want the People of a land to be its TENANTS?To be evicted any time by outsiders?

[PIE]Olive Harvest 2005

Join Us in Palestine for the 2005 Olive Harvest Campaign!


Palestinian farmers and agricultural organizations, in coordination with the International Solidarity Movement and the International Women’s Peace Service, announce the 2005 Olive Harvest Campaign. The campaign will take place between October 15 and November 15.

While the world is blinded by the smokescreen of Israel’s “Gaza disengagement” plan, the Israeli government continues to seize Palestinian land throughout the West Bank to expand settlements and build its illegal Annexation Barrier.

As this goes on, Palestinian communities continue to resist Israel’s attempts to cement its control of the West Bank and imprison Palestinians behind walls and fences.

The Olive Harvest is an annual affirmation of Palestinians’ historical, spiritual and economic connection to their land, and a rejection of Israeli efforts to seize it. Palestinians are the indigenous people of this land who have farmed olives here for thousands of years. The annual harvest is a symbol of life for Palestinian communities.

Agricultural productivity over the last five years has decreased dramatically because of closures and sieges which prohibit access to farms and markets. Israel’s barrier and increased attacks on farmers and their families in the fields have further diminished Palestinians’ ability to earn a living. Over half a million olive and fruit trees have been destroyed since September 2000. Palestinian agriculture is being destroyed by the policies of the Israeli government and the rights of Palestinians to their land and to a livelihood are being denied.

International and Israeli volunteers join Palestinians each year to harvest olives, in spite of efforts by Israeli settlers, soldiers and bulldozers to destroy this vital piece of Palestinian life. Because much of the world falsely believes that “a peace process” is under way with Israel’s “Gaza disengagement” plan, Palestinians need your support, solidarity and eyewitness testimonies about the reality of life under a military occupation.

How It Works
The Olive Harvest Campaign provides a wonderful opportunity to spend time with Palestinian families in their olive groves and homes.

The presence of internationals during harvest time has proven in the past to help limit and decrease the severity of attacks. After a two-day training session, volunteers for the Olive Harvest Campaign will stay in Palestinian homes in West Bank communities and accompany Palestinian families to their olive groves to serve as witnesses to document and expose attacks by settlers — supported by the Israeli Army — on farmers and their families.

In addition to olive harvest, volunteers will have the opportunity to join Palestinians in nonviolent protests throughout the West Bank against the construction of the Annexation Barrier, settlements and settlement roads.

This 2005 Olive Harvest Campaign is part of the ongoing work of the International Solidarity Movement, a Palestinian-led movement comprising of Palestinian, Israeli and international activists working to raise awareness about the struggle for Palestinian freedom and an end to The Occupation. ISM uses nonviolent, direct-action methods of resistance to confront and challenge the Israeli persecution of Palestinians.

With your help and participation, we will expose the injustice of the Israeli occupation and send a message to the world that The Occupation must end and the Wall must fall!

For more information on preparation, travel and arrival in Palestine, please see the ISM Palestine website, www.palsolidarity.org/main/past- campaigns/oh2005/travel/. ISM support groups located around the world can help answer your questions about the movement and Olive Harvest Campaign. Many will provide training sessions. For information on how to contact local ISM support groups worldwide, please also see the ISM website.[/PIE]


After ou read that,again i ask,,how many more times do the Palesitnian have to be escortted by "INTERNATIONALS" on their own land?

And how well do the "Internationals" able to protect the Palesitnians?


How many more times do Palestinians have to hide and cower and beg for work ON THEIR OWN LAND?

How many more year do the Palesitnians have to live the life they are doing now?

Will you still buy Isrealis product..If you still do after this,then all i cna say is that such ISM will alwsy be there,,with a difference,,soon it will just one grove...
 
What is to stop the Isrelais from massacaring more Palestinian tro get more land for more products?

What is to stop a Palestinian from going on a bus, and clicking a button that would end up killing a few babies and mothers. If the bomber never exists... the wall never exists... and the retaliation where more innocents die, does not exist.

Israel is not dependant on any Palestinian merchandise. It is the Palestinians who are 93% dependant on Israel's economy to survive.
 
Salaam,


Read this ...Very sad story..

http://www.palsolidarity.org/main/2006/09/16/haaretz-jordan-valley/


A quote form there..

[PIE]“There is big competition among the Palestinian workers in the Jericho area, in every sphere, in agriculture and industry,” says K., a 37-year-old Palestinian who used to work in dates and now has his own business. “They want to curry favor with the Israeli employer so he will let them keep working, and maybe make them permanent workers.[/PIE]

[PIE]S.: “The Jewish employer doesn’t even have to deal with us. He doesn’t shout and he doesn’t argue, he has no contact with us - he leaves the dirty work to the Palestinian contractor. During this time he can sit in his air-conditioned office. He knows that the Palestinian is doing the dirty work for him.”[/PIE]

[PIE] In 2004, according to the site, the valley’s agricultural produce was worth 73 million euros. A significant portion of that came from the date industry.[/PIE]

Can anyone tell me if any of that 73 million euros get to the Palestinians.??
Astarfillah,so go and buy these dates,so that the Isrealis can get a bigger profir,steal more land,,and still pay peanuts to the Palestinians.

If this continue,we will see Palestinian killing on another to work to please the Isrealis..just to survive..

If this continue,,,if this continue..
 

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