Non muslims referring to God as Allah

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Words are products of language with general meaning, while specific meanings in a language are products of culture. The words of all languages when spoken in another language would mean the same. The word Allah in Arabic would mean the same as the word God in English or Ishwar in Sanskrit. But the same words used in Islamic, Christian or Hindu culture would mean differently in each to the extent that each word would then have a specific connotation. So the word Allah when used as part of expressing oneself in Arabic would have a generic meaning and when used as part of expressing oneself in the context of Islam would have a specific meaning. This distinction ought to be kept in mind, otherwise it would lead to confusion.
 
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I think the point has been made. And I agree with MustafaMC with regard to words conveying meaning. This is why as Christian it does not seem proper to me to use the word Allah for the true God.

Not suprised at the arrogance, either that or you didn't know Jesus(pbuh) used to call God, Allah aswell, or more specifically sounding as Ellah (hebrew).

Some motivation :thumbs_up

 
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I think the point has been made. And I agree with MustafaMC with regard to words conveying meaning. This is why as Christian it does not seem proper to me to use the word Allah for the true God.

While you may be more comfortable in using the name God(swt) over Allaah(swt), that does not mean they are 2 separate deities. There is but one God(swt) and all those of the true Abrahamic, Monotheistic, Faiths (Jew, Sabian, Christian and Muslim) worship the same One. We do argue and differ about how we worship and do disagree often over the nature of Allaah(swt) but we do understand that there is One true God(swt) and it is the same God(swt) revealed through all of the True Prophets(PBUT).

Possibly you do worship the American created God who appeared in the 1860s in the minds of Pentecostals and Fundamentalist, Bible based, self proclaimed Evangelists and Ministers. If that is your case I will agree with you that you do not Worship Allaah(swt)

What makes you think the English speaking God of Fundamental/Pentecostal Americans is the True god? The God(swt) that began appearing in America during the 1860s and rapidly spreading into over 23,000 denominations does not seem to be the same God(swt) worshiped by Jesus(as). America has Americanized God and created a Bible based series of religions that adhere to new interpretations that satisfy the individual Pastors/Ministers/etc of the newly formed denominations.

Fortunately there is still hope for most of the world's Christians as they do recognize that Allaah(swt) and God(swt) are the same and that all the True Abrahamic faiths do worship the same God(swt). Perhaps one day they will accept the Qur'an.
 
While you may be more comfortable in using the name God(swt) over Allaah(swt), that does not mean they are 2 separate deities. There is but one God(swt) and all those of the true Abrahamic, Monotheistic, Faiths (Jew, Sabian, Christian and Muslim) worship the same One. We do argue and differ about how we worship and do disagree often over the nature of Allaah(swt) but we do understand that there is One true God(swt) and it is the same God(swt) revealed through all of the True Prophets(PBUT).

Possibly you do worship the American created God who appeared in the 1860s in the minds of Pentecostals and Fundamentalist, Bible based, self proclaimed Evangelists and Ministers. If that is your case I will agree with you that you do not Worship Allaah(swt)

What makes you think the English speaking God of Fundamental/Pentecostal Americans is the True god? The God(swt) that began appearing in America during the 1860s and rapidly spreading into over 23,000 denominations does not seem to be the same God(swt) worshiped by Jesus(as). America has Americanized God and created a Bible based series of religions that adhere to new interpretations that satisfy the individual Pastors/Ministers/etc of the newly formed denominations.

Fortunately there is still hope for most of the world's Christians as they do recognize that Allaah(swt) and God(swt) are the same and that all the True Abrahamic faiths do worship the same God(swt). Perhaps one day they will accept the Qur'an.

I worship and serve, and will not deny, the God of the Bible. This is He who created the heavens and the earth and all that is in them. This is He who called Abram and led him out of his country and took him to a land that He would show him. To him the true God gave the covenant of circumcision. From him came Isaac and Jacob, and from Jacob the 12 patriarchs. And God's promise and covenant was with Isaac and Jacob (Israel).

I worship He who delivered Joseph out of his oppression when his brothers sold him into slavery out envy and jeoulsy because God's promise was to him and not to his brothers. I worship Him who spoke to Moses from the burning bush in the wilderness of Sinai who spoke to Him saying, "I am the God of thy fathers, the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob."

This God led His people out of bondage to Egypt by an outstretched arm with great power and signs which He did before the all the people.

This God has spoken in times past and in various ways by the mouth of His prophets, has in these last days glorified His Son Jesus Christ, who was delieverd up and crucified, but God raised Him from the dead. The prophets foretold the coming and sufferings of Christ, and the glory that would follow. All this God has fulfilled. And now He commands all men everywhere to turn from their sin and to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ that you might receive the forgiveness of sins and everlasting life in His Name. For there is no other name given among men by which we must be saved but the name of Jesus.

All of the prophets have foretold these things, and this promise is not only to Israel, but as to as many who would call upon the name of the Lord, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile. By Him, Jesus, all that believe are justified from all things, from which we could not be justified by the Law of Moses. We also should take a clear warning from the prophets who said, "Behold, ye despisers, and wonder, and perish: for I work a work in your days, a work which ye shall in no wise believe, though a man declare it unto you."

This is whom I serve and worship.
 
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Not suprised at the arrogance, either that or you didn't know Jesus(pbuh) used to call God, Allah aswell, or more specifically sounding as Ellah (hebrew).

Some motivation :thumbs_up



Given that you do not believe that Jesus was crucified, how is it that you can assert that He called God Allah while on the cross?
 



Really. I wonder what Indonesian christians would say about that.
Many Indonesian christians (I dont know what their denominations) also interchangeably use "Allah" to refer to God, often with addition such as "Allah Bapa" (God the father), although interestingly they don't refer jesus (pbuh) as Allah.
So, at least according to Indonesian christians, there is a hierarchy in Godship, with Allah (The father) acts as the supreme God, and jesus as the lesser god. Im not sure where they place the spirit.

Perhaps you should speak to them. As I said before, I was speaking from my culture, not Indonesia. I do praise God for the Indosian christians and their comfort during all their sufferings.
 
Then why and how did you come to call him God and exactly what does the word God mean? Is not the Name Allaah(swt) more in agreement with the Christian concept of God, then the name God is?

Woodrow,

Do you want me to answer your questions denotatively and connotatively? How has the word Allah come to be used, as a generic reference to God or gods, or as the God described by the Qur'an? Denotatively, the term Allah can refer to the true God or any god, just like Elohim can. The context would determine the meaning. But this is not the meaning that it carried predominitely today. The word Allah is used as a proper noun. I am not sure why this is hard to understand or recognize.

If you follow the link I shared, and you look at the specific meaning of the various words used for God in the OT. The Islamic understanding of God is not more in agreement with the Christian understanding. We both know the differences. Therefore, when you use the term "God" it bears one meaning in your mind, and another in mine. When you use the word Allah, you are being more specific than generic. The word Allah has come to represent much more than a generic name for God.

Therefore it seems a confusion to me should I use the term Allah in reference to God.
 
Given that you do not believe that Jesus was crucified, how is it that you can assert that He called God Allah while on the cross?

We do not believe he called God(swt) Allaah(swt) at the Crucifixtion although since he spoke Aramaic and worshiped the true God(swt) it is a reasonable assumption he would have often used the name Allaah(swt). that is a Christian belief. But it does show that the early Christians did recognize the name of God(swt) as being Allaah(swt)
 
We do not believe he called God(swt) Allaah(swt) at the Crucifixtion although since he spoke Aramaic and worshiped the true God(swt) it is a reasonable assumption he would have often used the name Allaah(swt). that is a Christian belief. But it does show that the early Christians did recognize the name of God(swt) as being Allaah(swt)

Hey Woodrow,

I am not sure what is still being disagreed upon. I am not saying the the word Allah isn't the arabic word for God. My main point is the use of it today and its connotation. Is that what is being disagreed upon?
 
Given that you do not believe that Jesus was crucified, how is it that you can assert that He called God Allah while on the cross?

Never said anything about the cross. Here's someone you believe to be God or Son of God, calling another Deity Allah(swt).

Just saying, if Jesus(pbuh) said it, then ofcourse you'll find many Christians say it aswell, especially Arab Christians.
 
Woodrow,

Do you want me to answer your questions denotatively and connotatively? How has the word Allah come to be used, as a generic reference to God or gods, or as the God described by the Qur'an? Denotatively, the term Allah can refer to the true God or any god, just like Elohim can. The context would determine the meaning. But this is not the meaning that it carried predominitely today. The word Allah is used as a proper noun. I am not sure why this is hard to understand or recognize.

If you follow the link I shared, and you look at the specific meaning of the various words used for God in the OT. The Islamic understanding of God is not more in agreement with the Christian understanding. We both know the differences. Therefore, when you use the term "God" it bears one meaning in your mind, and another in mine. When you use the word Allah, you are being more specific than generic. The word Allah has come to represent much more than a generic name for God.

Therefore it seems a confusion to me should I use the term Allah in reference to God.

I agree Allaah(swt) is a proper noun and is a specific name. It is also the name used throughout the world by Arabic, Hebrew and Aramaic speaking Christians, they are Using the Name Allaah(swt) to specifically mean the capitalized name God(swt)

Allaah(swt) is God(swt) both names for a specific and same being. Ilah is god (uncapitalized) and is the generic word for god. By saying Allaah(swt) is not God(swt) you are not worshiping the same god we worship or the God worshiped by the Jews, Sabians and most Christians. You are worshiping a god invented in mid 1800s America,
 
Perhaps you should speak to them. As I said before, I was speaking from my culture, not Indonesia. I do praise God for the Indosian christians and their comfort during all their sufferings.

So Indonesian christians do not worship the same God that you worship?

Maybe you also want to praise God for the thousands of Indonesian muslims who were massacred by christians?
Im sure this kind of news does not travel to your neck of the wood.
 
I worship and serve, and will not deny, the God of the Bible. This is He who created the heavens and the earth and all that is in them. This is He who called Abram and led him out of his country and took him to a land that He would show him. To him the true God gave the covenant of circumcision. From him came Isaac and Jacob, and from Jacob the 12 patriarchs. And God's promise and covenant was with Isaac and Jacob (Israel).

I worship He who delivered Joseph out of his oppression when his brothers sold him into slavery out envy and jeoulsy because God's promise was to him and not to his brothers. I worship Him who spoke to Moses from the burning bush in the wilderness of Sinai who spoke to Him saying, "I am the God of thy fathers, the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob."

This God led His people out of bondage to Egypt by an outstretched arm with great power and signs which He did before the all the people.

This is whom I serve and worship.

I agree with all you said above and that is the same God(swt) I worship.. But I disagree with this.

This God has spoken in times past and in various ways by the mouth of His prophets, has in these last days glorified His Son Jesus Christ, who was delieverd up and crucified, but God raised Him from the dead. The prophets foretold the coming and sufferings of Christ, and the glory that would follow. All this God has fulfilled. And now He commands all men everywhere to turn from their sin and to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ that you might receive the forgiveness of sins and everlasting life in His Name. For there is no other name given among men by which we must be saved but the name of Jesus.

You have committed a grave and very serious sin by calling Jesus(as) God(swt). In doing so you have begun the worship of someone in addition to God(swt) this is polytheism.

In your last paragraph I agree with it except for what I colored blue and made bold.

All of the prophets have foretold these things, and this promise is not only to Israel, but as to as many who would call upon the name of the Lord, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile. By Him, Jesus, all that believe are justified from all things, from which we could not be justified by the Law of Moses. We also should take a clear warning from the prophets who said, "Behold, ye despisers, and wonder, and perish: for I work a work in your days, a work which ye shall in no wise believe, though a man declare it unto you."
 
Never said anything about the cross. Here's someone you believe to be God or Son of God, calling another Deity Allah(swt).

Just saying, if Jesus(pbuh) said it, then ofcourse you'll find many Christians say it aswell, especially Arab Christians.

I don't have a problem with the arabic term, Allah, being used as a generic name for God, like Elohim is in Hebrew, or God in English. What I am saying is that the term has come to take a strictly Islamic meaning, and the use of a proper noun, and not simply a noun. If Arab Christians speak Arabic, why would they use a different term?

But the reference to Jesus using the word Allah, is a reference to speech recorded in the Bible while Jesus was hanging on the cross. He spoke the words from the cross in Aramaic. The Muslim can not make this case and, at the same time, deny that Jesus was crucified. Do you see what I am saying? You cannot claim Jesus said such and such from the cross, when you deny He died upon the cross. It wasn't Jesus hanging on the cross according to Islam, so Jesus could not have said what the Bible says he said from it.

The video you posted was from a Mel Gibson movie. The utterence Jesus made, "Eli Eli, Lama Sabachthani" This statement is cleary a quote from Psalm 22. The point being, that both in Hebrew and the LXX, they are using the word for God that is a generic noun, not a proper noun. My point is that functionally, the word Allah has come to be used as a proper noun. Originally it was a generic noun. But its usus loquendi has given it a proper noun meaning.

This is why I don't use it.
 
I agree with all you said above and that is the same God(swt) I worship.. But I disagree with this.



You have committed a grave and very serious sin by calling Jesus(as) God(swt). In doing so you have begun the worship of someone in addition to God(swt) this is polytheism.

In your last paragraph I agree with it except for what I colored blue and made bold.

On a few occasions the Jews accused Jesus of the same thing...making Himself out to be God. I consider myself in good company and will stick with Jesus.

Woodrow, you know what Christians believe. And you know their understanding of the Godhead isn't polytheism. Never once in my life have advocated the idea that there is more than one God. "Shema Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Eḥad " Hear O Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is One.
 
On a few occasions the Jews accused Jesus of the same thing...making Himself out to be God. I consider myself in good company and will stick with Jesus.

Woodrow, you know what Christians believe. And you know their understanding of the Godhead isn't polytheism. Never once in my life have advocated the idea that there is more than one God. "Shema Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Eḥad " Hear O Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is One.

In my Christian years I never considered myself as being polytheistic. To me it was one God in three Persons. A mystery but one I accepted on Faith. However questions came:

Why did I pray different prayers to Each person?
Why did I see the Father as being the Creator?
The son as being the Forgiver?
The Holy spirit as the comforter and guide?

I could not see this separation of duties unless they were 3 separate entities. I had to admit to myself I was praying to 3 separate gods, no matter how I tried to consider them as one.
 
In my Christian years I never considered myself as being polytheistic. To me it was one God in three Persons. A mystery but one I accepted on Faith. However questions came:

Why did I pray different prayers to Each person?
Why did I see the Father as being the Creator?
The son as being the Forgiver?
The Holy spirit as the comforter and guide?

I could not see this separation of duties unless they were 3 separate entities. I had to admit to myself I was praying to 3 separate gods, no matter how I tried to consider them as one.

Interesting. I would like to know more of your story. Perhaps another time.
 
I don't have a problem with the arabic term, Allah, being used as a generic name for God, like Elohim is in Hebrew, or God in English. What I am saying is that the term has come to take a strictly Islamic meaning, and the use of a proper noun, and not simply a noun. If Arab Christians speak Arabic, why would they use a different term?

But the reference to Jesus using the word Allah, is a reference to speech recorded in the Bible while Jesus was hanging on the cross. He spoke the words from the cross in Aramaic. The Muslim can not make this case and, at the same time, deny that Jesus was crucified. Do you see what I am saying? You cannot claim Jesus said such and such from the cross, when you deny He died upon the cross. It wasn't Jesus hanging on the cross according to Islam, so Jesus could not have said what the Bible says he said from it.

The video you posted was from a Mel Gibson movie. The utterence Jesus made, "Eli Eli, Lama Sabachthani" This statement is cleary a quote from Psalm 22. The point being, that both in Hebrew and the LXX, they are using the word for God that is a generic noun, not a proper noun. My point is that functionally, the word Allah has come to be used as a proper noun. Originally it was a generic noun. But its usus loquendi has given it a proper noun meaning.

This is why I don't use it.

So your saying that Jesus(pbuh) only ever referred to God as Allah(swt) only when he was being crucified? You don't believe that not once in his life time did he refer to God as Allah before the "crucifiction"?

Also, it doesn't really matter to the Muslims on how Jesus(pbuh) referred to God as, it's just a good arguement against Christians that have a problem with using the word Allah, which is the impression I got from your earlier posts.
 
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So your saying that Jesus(pbuh) only ever referred to God as Allah(swt) only when he was being crucified? You don't believe that not once in his life time did he refer to God as Allah before the "crucifiction"?

Also, it doesn't really matter to the Muslims on how Jesus(pbuh) referred to God as, it's just a good arguement against Christians that have a problem with using the word Allah, which is the impression I got from your earlier posts.

So, the reason for your post wasn't to discuss the subject, but to just to try to make what you think is a good argument against Christians?

This is really simple...denotative...connotative.
 
So, the reason for your post wasn't to discuss the subject, but to just to try to make what you think is a good argument against Christians?

This is really simple...denotative...connotative.

No, your misunderstood like you did with my earlier post.

I brought that to attention because of what you said here -

This is why as Christian it does not seem proper to me to use the word Allah for the true God.
^Tell that to the millions of Christians around the world, who would use the same arguement as what I've already presented. I think it is better for you to have re-worded it to something like

"It does not seem proper for me to use the word Allah, as Muslims use that, and I seem to have a problem with words used by Muslims, regardless of meaning."
Would've made more sense.
 

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