Questions from an Atheist

[جوري]

actually we're wired from birth to believe in God.. Perhaps you'd benefit doing some research before writing what say you?

 

[joboman24]

actually we're wired from birth to believe in God.. Perhaps you'd benefit doing some research before writing what say you?

then that is even worse. What if you let the next 100 million infants to believe in whatever they wanted and asked them when they turned let's say 18 years old hypothetically based on pure observation of life. No pressure to be this or that just what the hell they want to be. What do you think would happen? Personally I believe putting your own beliefs on your kids is a form of child abuse. Just like teaching your kids to be crook in life is child abuse because now you are rewiring their brain based on what you want them to be and not what they want to be.

 

[جوري]

then that is even worse. What if you let the next 100 million infants to believe in whatever they wanted and asked them when they turned let's say 18 years old hypothetically based on pure observation of life. No pressure to be this or that just what the hell they want to be. What do you think would happen? Personally I believe putting your own beliefs on your kids is a form of child abuse. Just like teaching your kids to be crook in life is child abuse because now you are rewiring their brain based on what you want them to be and not what they want to be.

What does that mean exactly? are you wielding dung as we go along?

 

[Aprender]

No "person" was responsible for scientifically programming the brain. It is based on pure luck in terms of what human being you turn out to be in regards to your brain. A normal human being is what we consider moral as a whole not based on any religious books or studies but based purely on observation of your surroundings.

So luck is responsible for scientifically programming the brain? What are the origins of luck? What do 'we' consider moral as a whole? So we all see the same things in our observations of our surroundings and they are all moral behaviors simply because we observed it? And since it's not subject to any scientific studies then isn't it based on our own personal perceptions of what is moral and what is not or is there some magical unwritten moral code that every society lives by and everyone will agree with no matter what?

 

[Hulk]

I apologise for my short comment that contributed little to the thread, sometimes my silliness get the better of me.

I must say though that I have no idea what the argument here is about. Joboman24, if you want to prove that theists are wrong then you should attack the core of the believe which is that the universe has a Creator. You can argue that people are raised from young to believe in a particular religion(and I agree) but that does little to nothing to prove theists wrong.

Personally, instead of trying to prove others wrong I would try to learn what and why they believe.

 

[joboman24]

So luck is responsible for scientifically programming the brain? What are the origins of luck? What do 'we' consider moral as a whole? So we all see the same things in our observations of our surroundings and they are all moral behaviors simply because we observed it? And since it's not subject to any scientific studies then isn't it based on our own personal perceptions of what is moral and what is not or is there some magical unwritten moral code that every society lives by and everyone will agree with no matter what?

a moral is what a human being has deemed as "good" based purely on his observations with no influence from anyone. For some that moral may be to follow islam and to others like me it would be to follow my own set morals that I have created by myself based on observation of life and surroundings. I don't need any god or prophet to tell me what is right or what is wrong. I deem what is what myself. I believe I am an individual soul with no strings attached to anything or anyone.

 

[joboman24]

I apologise for my short comment that contributed little to the thread, sometimes my silliness get the better of me.

I must say though that I have no idea what the argument here is about. Joboman24, if you want to prove that theists are wrong then you should attack the core of the believe which is that the universe has a Creator. You can argue that people are raised from young to believe in a particular religion(and I agree) but that does little to nothing to prove theists wrong.
hello Hulk I am a little here and a little there so I apologize for that. Yes I personally believe that the earth did not have a creator. The fact is that energy cannot be created nor destroyed so we have had energy for infinite amount of time in this universe which due to whatever reason exploded in such a way it shot planets and stars all across the universe. My personal view is innocent until proven guilty. I cannot believe in something or someone until there is proof that is all. There are people who believe the world is going to end in december 21, 2012 why should I believe them unless there is some sort of factual or scientific backing?

 

[joboman24]

So luck is responsible for scientifically programming the brain? What are the origins of luck? What do 'we' consider moral as a whole? So we all see the same things in our observations of our surroundings and they are all moral behaviors simply because we observed it? And since it's not subject to any scientific studies then isn't it based on our own personal perceptions of what is moral and what is not or is there some magical unwritten moral code that every society lives by and everyone will agree with no matter what?

There is no origin to luck. Luck has been and will be for infinite. What we consider "moral" as a whole is what as an individual entity we deem to be for the betterment of the people and the human raise. Moral behaviors are based on trial and error of surroundings. You hear about Bernie Madoff ponzi scheming people out of 100's of millions of dollars and causing so much pain to the victims. You realize that it is not the correct way to live life by hurting people. A society moral code is based on real life experiences over 10's of thousands of years of trial and error which is created into western law. During the middle ages the law was what most of us would consider barbaric. Based on trial and error law has gotten to a point where it was much better than it was back in the day and it will continue to get better. Constitutional western law is not perfect by any means but it will continue to improve over time. Now sharia law for example is what one or a few people ( I am not sure if other people other than muhammad wrote about allah so I apologize for that). Now I would tend to think that if you asked a random would they like to follow a law that one or a few people created a few thousand years ago or follow a law that has gone through trials and tribulations over time over 1000's of years by 1000's of people to make it "fair" deemed on observations of life and rationality wouldn't they go with the second one.?

 

[joboman24]

What does that mean exactly? are you wielding dung as we go along?

it is just a hypothetical question I asked and was just curious for response. that is all.

 

[joboman24]

it means that if infants werent conditioned to believe in a specific religion since birth would they still believe in religion when they turn 18 years old if they weren't conditioned to believe in religion based on observation of life, luck, bad and good times in their life or seriously getting screwed over for doing absolutely nothing wrong in life?

 

[جوري]

it is just a hypothetical question I asked and was just curious for response. that is all.

I didn't see questions marks. I saw a statement of assertion, I'd like for you to substantiate it.

best,

 

[Al-bint]

Why is it that we are blindly believing Muhammad (s.a.w)?

Who said we follow anyone blindly? In Islam you are supposed to verify whatever to hear prior to blindly believing in it. As for me, I have tried reading the Qur'an. verified what I read and then started practicing. Seeking knowledge is an obligation on every Muslim.

And you ask me why I don't believe in God? I don't believe in god because there is no evidence that there is a "god" except for the blind faith people put for no reason except for a book where allah is prophesized as a god.

Then how did you come into existence? you dont believe in God but you believe in science? the science that pretty much in every decade takes a U-turn? you believe everything came into existnce b'coz of big bang? but where did that premeival mass come from? you believe in books written by Oparin & Haldein where they write about their experiments and believe them but refuse to read the Qur'an and ponder over it?

Before asking such questions I would suggest you go through the Qur'an. Once you do that (with understanding) I strongly believe that these questions of yours will appear meaningless to you!

Human beings have been on this earth for the last 400,000 years how come there was no god then but all of a sudden Muhammad (s.a.w) came up with Allah being a god 1400 years ago?

Islam Has been there since the advent of Adam (p.b.u.h). There have been more than 1 lack Prophets who walked the face of the earth and Muhammad (s.a.w) is the last one among them! Jesus (p.b.u.h) was also a Prophet who taught Islaam, so did Moses (p.b.u.h)!

Humans have been killing each other right? Just like extremists of your religion come to my country in India and kill 200+ innocent people in mumbai for what? Because allah tells them to do so because of the ongoing conflict between jammu kashmir?

What do you know about Jammu & Kashmir? Is it just what media tells you? do you know the actual condition? do you know about the condition of Muslims in Palestine, Afghanistan, Pakistan and other places? if you actually knew you would realize that Muslims are the victims not the other way round.

you talk about proof for everything right? so what proof do you have that whatever happened in Mumbai was done by Muslims? Well I have a proof for the contrary!

In Islam killing a single innocent soul is considered as if you have killed the whole of humanity! so whoever those people are, they can't be Muslims! Even if there are killings happening in Kashmir, 1000 innocents killed in kashmir still do not validate killing even a single innocent in Mumbai! these are all the anti-Islamic propagandas. Media plays the wizard and everyone falls for it's tricks.

the crux is, whatever you hear or read, verify it brother. VERIFY! that's it! By verifying I don't mean you read another book written by some-one against religion to support the 1st one you read! Search for facts.

May Allah make your quest easy for you and may you finally find the truth!

Wasalaam!

 

[Al-bint]

ah forget it im done posting here no point arguing with ignorance. goodbye.

ever tried reasoning before? it needs patience. If you have a point I am all ears!

 

[White Rose]

Only thing I believe in is that life is based on chance. You might get one hell of a chance being born to a successfull family with lots of money and 3 meals a day on the table. Or you could be born into a dirt poor family in the slums or karachi or mumbai and starve to death.

You know by that logic, it would be very difficult to strive in this hopeless world. If I am lazy, I can just say, "by this logic" that since I have such a bad luck, I should not be doing anything.

Actually, we are brainwashed with this luck logic by this world. People around us, our family, peers, and media drive us to that point that where start to doubt ourselves. We start to believe that money and richness is everything and we start to lose the concept of defying them. People who have strong faith will realize the truth and fight against the rules create to brainwash society.

 

[Pygoscelis]

LOL Accusations that 'atheists are not nice', and accusations that somebody else is trolling, all from the guy who publicly declared his desire for all atheists to die. Rich. :shade:

 

[Pygoscelis]

What kind of a atheist you are? :S I know more about your creed than you do.

What creed is he? Evidently you don't know what atheism is and yet you hate it so. Atheism is not a creed, religion, or even world view. It is just the lack of one belief. You can be atheist and believe creation, the spiritual, disbelieve in evolution as the origin of man (I lean that way), etc. There are no atheist prophets or holy texts. Don't confuse supporters of Dawkins or Hitchens with atheists at large. That would be like saying all theists are hindus (and that there are no muslims, jews, christians, etc).

 

[Pygoscelis]

actually we're wired from birth to believe in God.. Perhaps you'd benefit doing some research before writing what say you?

She's right... sort of. We are wired from birth to seek patterns and to imply agency. It is why you talk to your toaster and think clouds look like things. We are also wired to trust in a higher power as chidlren, a higher power known as "mommy". These factors combine to be part of what drives the impulse towards religious belief. Well that plus the social programming of having it drilled into you by parents and society. Both are cogent factors.

 

[Perseveranze]

a moral is what a human being has deemed as "good" based purely on his observations with no influence from anyone. For some that moral may be to follow islam and to others like me it would be to follow my own set morals that I have created by myself based on observation of life and surroundings. I don't need any god or prophet to tell me what is right or what is wrong. I deem what is what myself. I believe I am an individual soul with no strings attached to anything or anyone.

So you respect the morals of the people in germany ww2, when it was morally right to massacre and extinct Jewish people?

There is no morals through self observation; morals are only defined by God.

 

[جوري]

She's right... sort of. We are wired from birth to seek patterns and to imply agency. It is why you talk to your toaster and think clouds look like things. We are also wired to trust in a higher power as chidlren, a higher power known as "mommy". These factors combine to be part of what drives the impulse towards religious belief. Well that plus the social programming of having it drilled into you by parents and society. Both are cogent factors.

I'd be interested in seeing your spin on the original research in some esteemed journal..

best,

 

[جوري]

all from the guy who publicly declared his desire for all atheists to die.

All atheists are going to die.. unless of course the Japanese come up with something .. maybe they can bottle your essence and use it to disperse a crowd

best,