The creation??

[Whatsthepoint]

Just the same way you disagree with proof.

woa, didn't notice this.
No need to reply though, I agree with what Trumble said.

 

[Omari]

In this particular case, generally, the only people who believe it does are those who don't require proof anyway.

Not neccessarily, how do you explain people who convert to Islam from other religions? Don't they look at evidence as to why their next religion is better than their previous? But in debate situations, your right. An athiest, for example will not believe no matter how much evidence you give them, for the person supplying the evidence, its proof, for the athiest it isn't. [But then that totally depends on the person ofcourse,]

But I still stand on my point, people who convert to Islam [Fastest Growing Religion] from christianity, budhism, or any other belief, always look at proof. What else would put them into the situation of conversion?

Peace
Omari

 

[Omari]

A perfect, self-sufficient being does not need worship/human confirmation of its infinite powers, at least by means of human logic...[/QUOTE]


Here you are, comparing HUMAN logic to God's. NOBODY knows the true reasons as to why he would WANT humans to worship him, that remains with him until the day of judgment.

 

[Omari]

Quran, Chapter 6, Verse 103
"No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over all vision: He is above all comprehension, yet is acquainted with all things."

 

[Whatsthepoint]

Not neccessarily, how do you explain people who convert to Islam from other religions? Don't they look at evidence as to why their next religion is better than their previous? But in debate situations, your right. An athiest, for example will not believe no matter how much evidence you give them, for the person supplying the evidence, its proof, for the athiest it isn't. [But then that totally depends on the person ofcourse,]

But I still stand on my point, people who convert to Islam [Fastest Growing Religion] from christianity, budhism, or any other belief, always look at proof. What else would put them into the situation of conversion?

Peace
Omari

How do you explain people who leave Islam (no need to answer this one...). What makes people convert to Christianity?Why do people (muslims too) become atheists?
Islam is not the fastest growing religion and a lot of people convert due to so called scientific miracles, which are by no means, an actual proof but rather smartly advertised dubious verses, who happen to have some connection to modern science or in some cases, pseudoscience.

 

[Whatsthepoint]

Here you are, comparing HUMAN logic to God's.NOBODY knows the true reasons as to why he would WANT humans to worship him, that remains with him until the day of judgment.

As I stated previously, it's mostly religious people who use human logic to explain their gods or more commonly, why other people's gods are false.

 

[Omari]

How do you explain people who leave SIalm (no need to answer this one...). What makes people convert to Christianity?Why do people (muslims too) become atheists?
No need to waste my time on that, as you said.
Islam is not the fastest growing religion[1]and a lot of people convert due to so called scientific miracles,[2] which are by no means, an actual proof but rather smartly advertised dubious verses, who happen to have some connection to modern science or in some cases, pseudoscience.

[1]Islam IS the fastest growing religion on earth. CLICK.

[2] I am afraid you are just assuming that this is the main reason people are converting. For argument's sake, let's imagine that it is the main reason why people are converting. Are you calling people that do look at these scientific miracles illogical?
There is a thread about many WORLD RENOWNED professors who say with their own WORDS, that they have no doubt that the quran is a divine revaltion due to the evidence. IF the professors are agreeing, then the only reason that i can think of which is stopping you to come to the light is arrogance.

Omari

 

[wilberhum]

No. I call you a narrow-minded person only when you tell me your wrong conclusions about God. Yes, I do accept the world view of atheists, because I know God will not show us Himself here but only His signs and we are free to believe or disbelieve in Him.

How do you know I'm wrong? :uuh:

Because I believe differently than you? :thumbs_do

How narrow-minded can you be?

You claimed that you have the power to think that it will be divinely better if God do what you suggest. That is why I said you were narrow-minded.

Not at all what I implied. It is simply a logical argument of your clam that life is a test.

 

[Omari]

Even though this wasn't for me...

How do you know I'm wrong? :uuh:
Because I believe differently than you? :thumbs_do ,
Well, naturally. Somthing that i believe is right, and you believe differently will make me think you're wrong.
How narrow-minded can you be?

Arrogant is a better word.

Omari

 

[Whatsthepoint]

[1]Islam IS the fastest growing religion on earth. CLICK.

[2] I am afraid you are just assuming that this is the main reason people are converting. For argument's sake, let's imagine that it is the main reason why people are converting. Are you calling people that do look at these scientific miracles illogical?
There is a thread about many WORLD RENOWNED professors who say with their own WORDS, that they have no doubt that the quran is a divine revaltion due to the evidence. IF the professors are agreeing, then the only reason that i can think of which is stopping you to come to the light is arrogance.

Omari

Falun Gong is certainly faster growing. And Islam's growth is mainly a result of higher birth rates in muslim families.
Plus, is the fastest growing religion automaticcally the right one?
No, I'm not calling them illogical , I am just saying that a lot of people converting for a certain sake, does not make that sake a proof of anything.
Yes, there is such a thread, I would imagine there are plenty of them..
first, one must assume all the professors meant what they said and were not misquoted, but anyway taht's not relevant. Waht's relevant is that not all of them converted to Islam. How many of tehm converted anyway?

 

[Omari]

first, one must assume all the professors meant what they said and were not misquoted, but anyway taht's not relevant. Waht's relevant is that not all of them converted to Islam. How many of tehm converted anyway?

That is a very good question actualy...I'll have to find out.
But wether they converted or not shouldn't make a difference. They weren't misquoted, they have it on video. EACH professor is taped as they say what they said. The point isn't wether they converted or not, the point is wether they agreed on the evidence or not. And they did.

Omari

 

[Omari]

Can't I agree with science and religion in the same time? Sure I can, and it's what the professors are doing. I doubt that any professor does research one day and does bad deeds the next.
Omari

 

[wilberhum]

So you believe that if god communicated with us we would all be following the same religion. ...........
Yes, and he wouldn't screwed it up the first two times.
That is totally illogical.
The rest of the stuff only shows you believe differently than me. So what?
You dont know what god is but yet you want to find out what created it?
No, you just assume that because I say your argument is a fallacy that I'm saying your conclusion is wrong.
Everything that I know of has bin created, or must have bin created.
Do you assume that there is nothing outside what you know? :hiding:
God is not included in that "everything" for I dont know what god is! I only know that it must exist!
You don't know what god is but you know he exist. How illogical can one get.:uuh:

Having the burden of trying to be logical and believing that god would be logical your explanations fully fail to hit the mark.
I don't say what you believe is wrong, I just don't find it logical.

 

[Whatsthepoint]

That is a very good question actualy...I'll have to find out.
But wether they converted or not shouldn't make a difference. They weren't misquoted, they have it on video. EACH professor is taped as they say what they said. The point isn't wether they converted or not, the point is wether they agreed on the evidence or not. And they did.

Omari

At least one professor from the list has already denounced his staments about the divine authorship of te Quran.
Well, if the evidence is so overwhelmingly clear and convincing I would expect them to convert..
Anyway, a couple of scientists saying the Quran is divine does not prove the Quran is divine.

 

[krypton6]

"As a matter of fact Allah says in the quran, Chapter 51 and verse 57 :
"And I have not created the Jin and man but that they worship Me"

I dont see the point in this translation. I'm not capeable of reading nonsence, and the english translation of the Quran in most cases is nonsence.

God created the angels to worship him, why would he create us any different from them if we too are created to worship him? There's more behind this verse that you gave me.

How do you explain people who leave Islam (no need to answer this one...). What makes people convert to Christianity?Why do people (muslims too) become atheists?
Islam is not the fastest growing religion and a lot of people convert due to so called scientific miracles, which are by no means, an actual proof but rather smartly advertised dubious verses, who happen to have some connection to modern science or in some cases, pseudoscience.

Those woh leave Islam are very few compared to those leaving the other religions. Those leaving Islam have got a wrong image of islam, they've created a islam based on their own experience in the culture that they grew up in. They've had bad experiences through out their lifes, and they blame what has happend to them on Islam without having any evidence proving what has happend to them being caused by Islam.

Islam is the worlds fastest growing religion, and the sciencetific verses of the Quran clearly mentions the science that we know today, you just have to read it with a open mind.

Some muslims become atheists due to the theory of evolution. It is mostly young people who have bin told the good side of evolution, the anti-religion side, without being told about the other side of evolution, the one with tons of failures and unknown factors. It is young people ho have never known to intelligent design and such. Bus as they go deeper into science, they return to Islam.

 

[Whatsthepoint]

Can't I agree with science and religion in the same time? Sure I can, and it's what the professors are doing. I doubt that any professor does research one day and does bad deeds the next.
Omari

nobody's saying you can't be religious and a scientist at the same time. Since the majority of teh world's popualtion is religious I would guess the majority of scientist are religious as well.
Why is it possible to be both religious and a scientists at the same time?
1. Becaue religion comes from god and is therefore in agreement with science
2. because religion is a very adaptable thing, it can be interpreted in many ways in order to comply with science.

my choice is no 2

 

[chacha_jalebi]

erm from the creation to science!!

thats like i want to go pakistan but ended up in antartica

OFF TOPIC :mmokay: and the thread has served its purpose and its just off topic now

:threadclo