Eternity hellfire clarification

Hussein radi said:
If that what god says then i agree. I think god's wisdom is so beyond us that we will never be able to understand it. there are things that we must accept even if we don't fully comprehend them.
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Yeah there are some very mind boggling things and things we can't comprehend. But these are the things WE can't comprehend not that they are ill-logical :)

With the advancement of science and technology, we have understood many things but still a whole new world of things are still unexplained!

That point which I mentioned makes sense to me. That these disbelievers would never learn no matter how much time you give them! Therefore they will be punished for eternity.



Neelofar said:
Salaamz! =D
P.S - An33za i looovvveee ur style of writing! :D putz a smile on my face :P now, its bk to watching wimbledon! :D
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:embarrass thanx sister! :D may Allah bless you!





Hussein radi said:
Do everything in their power to avoid going back in there. you do mean punished in hell right?
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Brother, what if among these disbelievers there are some who would never learn? Who would still keep disobeying God? This is beacause, on some people's heart, there is a seal!
 
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Hussein radi said:
I am having difficulty comprehending someone being punished for eternity for a limited amout of time, lets say 100 years. If you use math you will find out that any number divided by infinity equals zero. Therefor, mathematically god is punishing humans for their limited life which has a value of 0. I need some help and clarification about this subject.
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Lets try to understand it through one example.
In history, many wars were fought and people died. But at that time, the overall population was less than that at present. So even a few number of people dying would equal a large number of people in this age.

Same way, the amount of sins done in this short life are equal to a large number of sins in an eternal life. By scaling method. I guess.

Its just so hard to explain. I hope that you may understand what I mean. imsad
 
Lets try to understand it through one example.
In history, many wars were fought and people died. But at that time, the overall population was less than that at present. So even a few number of people dying would equal a large number of people in this age.
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Yes i think i understand. Even though they lived a finite amount of time, the sins they accumulated are sufficient for god to send them to hell.
 
Even with threat of being punished of eternity and rewards of living in heaven for eternity, many people still disbelieve.

Can you imagine if there is no threat of being punished in hell?

Humans are given freewill, but are also equipped with intelligence, fitrah and guidance.
Each of us are given enough time in this world to submit to Allah SWT and worship him, and He is Most Just, Most Merciful and Most Gracious.
 
Hussein radi said:
Do everything in their power to avoid going back in there. you do mean punished in hell right?
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I think you're a bit confused, do you know what happens in the afterlife? Its either heaven or hell, a disbeliever cannot go to heaven
 
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aadil77 said:
When did Allah say believers will be punished for eternity?

That punishment is only for disbeleivers, if they were given the opportunity to live for eternity they would disbeleive for eternity

Also do not question Allah's justice, he is most just and He does not ask for much to avoid eternal hellfire

What do you suggest would happen to disbelievers after they have been punished for a finite time?
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I've always wondered about this question too but I think this is a good answer. Maybe Allah knows in his infinite wisdom that if these disbelievers were to be given an infinite amount of time they would still continue to disbelieve. Allah guides those who seek guidance.
Salam
 
You have to remember paradise is also infinite even though our life is only 60 years if we are lucky. And I remember hearing that the value of 1 good deed is worth much more, like when you do 1 good deed allah multiplies it for you and when you do a bad deed it stays as a single bad deed.

Allah the most merciful has given his slaves lots of opportunities to do good also, just look at the 5 daily prayers alhamdulilah, there's 5 good deeds for you all ready if you do them :) and you will get the reward of 50 prayers.

and also look at the other good deeds that you can perform, giving to charity, going on hajj, you have all these opportunities to do good and build up your account.

prepare for the day you will be handed your book, fill it up with lots of good deeds, rush to the obediance of Allah and run away from his disobediance. Make sincere repentance often as this will remove your bad deeds, Allah will replace the bad deeds with good deeds if you make sincere tawbah.

It's natural to be afraid of the hell every believer is, and this is also a mercy in a way cos it deters you from disobeying Allah, and his paradise is also a blessing cos it gives you motivation to do good deeds. And remember Allah loves us 70 times more than our own mother, and he gets happy at the slave who repents. sorry if this was off topic.
 
Asalaam O Alaikum...to every one.. im new here.. and i would like to add what Quran says regarding our brothers question... Whether the People of the Fire would Burn in Hell for Eternity or if the Ones who do burn in Hell for Eternity, why does Allah (Swt) make them burn for Ever in the Hereafter, because the time they spend doing there bad deeds was in their lifetime, which was limited... ?

Do correct me if im wrong regarding the question which i understood.. so any ways..

It is mentioned in Surah Al Anaam Verses 128

....(But) He will say : The Fire shall be your abode, therein to abide - unless God wills it otherwise. Verily your Sustainer is Wise, All Knowing!"


"Unless God Wills otherwise".. means according to many Muslim Theologians that Unless Allah (swt) has Mercy on them and ends their suffering in Hell. So the Blissful life of Paradise is Eternal and forever, BUT the suffering of the Fire is not Forever and is only Limited, depending on the Evil that the people of the fire committed in this Life....

In a well Authentic Tradition The Apostle of Allah (saw) said "(on the day of Judgment), those who deserve Paradise will enter Paradise, and those who deserve Fire, the fire. Thereupon God, the Sublimely Exalted, will say, 'Take out (of the fire) every one in whose heart there was as much of Faith (or, in some versions, "as much good") as a grain of a mustard seed!' And so they will be taken out of it, already blackened, and will be thrown in to the River of Life; and they will come to life (sprout) as a herb sprouts by the side of the stream: and did you not see how it comes out yellow and budding?"

(Bukhari, on the authority of Abu Said al-Khudri (r.a), in Kitab Al-Iman)


And so it shows, that Truly Allah (Swt) is The Most Gracious and All Merciful! He would give the ones who disobeyed, all their lives, the suffering of fire, BUT even them He (swt) would let them enter paradise and NOT suffer forever, as many and most of them would at least have some goodness in their hearts.... which is true, every Human does have some goodness in their hearts, even though they might not be good throughout most of their lives...


Also another Important point to mention here is that...there would be many who would suffer for very long time... and that is also explained in the Quran as to why would that happen...


"Hence, on Ressurection Day they shall bear the full weight of their burdens, as well as some of the burdens of those ignorant ones whom they have led astray :oh, how evil the load with which they shall be burdened." (Al Quran 16:25)

..so the ones who initiated any thing, like any evil in the society and however many people become part of that evil and do it, that person will not only gain the Sin of his own doing, but ALL those who followed his example, he would bear the burden of their evil acts as well..... and so this would Double His Suffering...

so yes there is not an Eternal Suffering in its literal sense, but there is a time where Allah (Swt) does forgive .. BUT He does Whenever He wills...He is the Best Judge!
 
syed_z said:
Asalaam O Alaikum...to every one.. im new here.. and i would like to add what Quran says regarding our brothers question... Whether the People of the Fire would Burn in Hell for Eternity or if the Ones who do burn in Hell for Eternity, why does Allah (Swt) make them burn for Ever in the Hereafter, because the time they spend doing there bad deeds was in their lifetime, which was limited... ?

Do correct me if im wrong regarding the question which i understood.. so any ways..
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Brother, are you a scholar? :statisfie So far you've answered all questions just so perfectly!

Now I wanted to ask that people who commit shirk; they'll never enter paradise, right? This is because Allah himself says that He would never forgive those who commit shirk! So I think these people will burn in hell for forever!

But Allah knows best!
 
Hussein radi said:
But why must it be infinity, why cant it be finite amount of time. We disobeyed god for a finite amount of time so it seems only fair for god to punish us for a finite time.
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All muslims who are unfortunate enough to enter hell will be punished for a limited amount of time, until they are cleansed of their sins, then they will enter jannah. The disbelievers on the other hand, those who died in disbelief will be punished for an eternity. The reasoning as per Anwar Al Awlaki is quite simple. The disbelievers only stopped their disbelief because death came to them, if death did not come to them then they would have continued to disbelieve for an eternity. Therefore their punishment is for an eternity, seems fair to me.
 
Asalaam O Alaikum to all brothers/sisters...


Sister Aneeza, Hope your doing fine... i am not a scholar... definitely NOT! I wish i was :)... but its just i have been reading in to Islam a lot so that why you can say i just know a little bit...BUT even then all mistakes and errors are from me and Allah (Swt) and His Rasool (saw) are innocent of it...


Well actually see many people, whom we see as committing acts of Shirk are not committing Consciously...and they are Not Mushriks in literal sense... like for example... this Hadith mentioned in the Sahih Books....

"Shirk is like a Black ant crawling on a Black stone on a Dark Night.."

... with this Hadith, which i heard sometime ago, its true, that there is many times a Shirk, which does make many fall in to it, while actually, they are not aware of it. Or the people are committing Shirk, but do not do it Consciously!

For example... In Surah Al Anaam Verse

(6:22) For one day We shall gather them all together, and then We shall say unto those who ascribed Divinity to anything beside God: "Where, now, are those beings whom you imagined to have a share in God's Divinity ?"

... now many of us think that these are just Idols or Actual Partners with God in those peoples thoughts and minds, whom they used to invoke with God... But that NOT true...

the "beings" whom Allah (Swt) calls upon also include... Our Desires, whom we Obey and disobey Allah (Swt)... it also includes our Wealth and children, whom we think as being as sufficient enough to help us throughout this Worldly life, without putting trust in Allah (Swt)... the word "beings" also include those Ideologies, or Isms as have been spread throughout this Modern age in which we live, like Communism, Socialism, Democracy, Capiatlism, whose Principles are in direct contradiction to the teachings of Quran and Sunnah (Shariah), whom many would have accepted whole heartedly as "divine Guidance" given by those "great" thinkers... while actually, they are not able to solve problems of mankind, individually as well as on collective level as the Law of Allah (Swt) can do...


.... the word "beings" also include, those Saints and Imams whom we think to possess Semi Divine qualities and are able to influence their decisions in the Heavens and Earth, whom we Invoke for help.... as We cannot do that either, because every day we say in our Prayers... Iyyakana Budu Wa Iyya Kanas Taeen (You Alone we Worship and You Alone we Seek for Help)....

... so all of the above is also included in Shirk, which can make us equivalent to associating Partners without us even knowing... as Muhammad (Saw) reminded us... that Shirk can be so unrecognizable that of like... black ant on a black stone on a Dark night...... unable for many in the World, to recognize... so Allah (Swt) knows us Better than ourselves, and knows that, if there is any punishment what type do we deserve...

Also it is that unknowingly the Sin of Shirk which many would committ and NOT Consciously ... like all the People mentioned above, DO Commit Shirk BUT do NOT Deny the Existence of One God COMPLETELY.... they do Believe in the Supreme Power to be Only Allah (Swt)... but they are mixing their Beliefs, which is definitely Denied by Quran....and so when Allah (Swt) would gather them and ask, as mentioned in the above Verse, they would say...

(6:23) Whereupon in Utter confusion, they will only (be able to) say; "By God, our Sustainer, we did not (mean to) ascribe divnity to anything beside Him!"

so the reason why they would say that to Allah (Swt) is because , while all this time, they were thinking that they were not corrupting the Concept of Oneness of God... while actually they were... so what is their Punishment, Allah (Swt) knows best...

Again for me , i would hold on to those words....



The Fire shall be your abode, therein to abide - unless God wills it otherwise. (6:128)


"Unless God wills otherwise"... whom does God forgive and take out of the Fire, from among them and who He lets suffer.. Allah (swt) knows best...



And one more Important thing to mention here is that... Allah (swt) says in the Quran...6:131-132

"Allah does not destroy a community for its wrong doing so long as its people are still unaware of the Truth (right and wrong)"

".. for all shall be judged according to their conscious deeds - and your Sustainer in NOT unaware of what they do."



.. so many people whom we see worshiping Idols clearly committing Shirk, and then think they are bound to go to hell when they die, we are NOT sure if they are going to hell, because may be they did NOT receive the Message of Allah (Swt) yet, and they died... may be they were so isolated in Mountains and jungles, deserts... that they did not hear about Islam.... or even if they did, they did received distortedly... so Allah (Swt) knows best...
 
syed_z said:
Asalaam O Alaikum to all brothers/sisters...
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Walikum Usalam Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuh!

Jazakamullahu khair dear brother for responding! :satisfie

Brother, then what type of Shirk Allah will never forgive?

4:48 Allah forgiveth not that partners should be set up with Him; but He forgiveth anything else, to whom He pleaseth; to set up partners with Allah is to devise a sin Most heinous indeed.

4:116 Allah forgiveth not (The sin of) joining other gods with Him; but He forgiveth whom He pleaseth other sins than this: one who joins other gods with Allah, Hath strayed far, far away (from the right).
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Because Allah says it so clearly in Quran that Shirk is the most heinous sin which He will never forgive!
 
An33za said:
Walikum Usalam Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuh!

Jazakamullahu khair dear brother for responding! :satisfie

Brother, then what type of Shirk Allah will never forgive?



Because Allah says it so clearly in Quran that Shirk is the most heinous sin which He will never forgive!
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Asalaam O Alaikum sister…Hope you and Yours are doing Fine :)

Well sister the words of the Quran are connected to each other, i.e the Verses are connected to one another….


The Ayaats which you quoted above, if we study them in Isolation, then it seems like NO ONE who does any kind of Shirk, will EVER be forgiven…


But then since the suffering of those who do shirk is The Fire, i.e Hell, then What does Allah (swt) say about Hell ? How long will the inhabitants of Fire suffer in it ?



If you try to analyze this Verse which I quoted before…


The Fire shall be your abode, therein to abide - unless God wills it otherwise. (6:128)


Unless God Will Otherwise……. If you try to read words of Allah (swt), when He refers to the people of Fire, He does not discriminate and say, its All of them EXCEPT MUshriks… No Allah (Swt) does not say that...... rather Allah (swt) refers to ALL people of the Fire which Include Mushriks, Disbelievers, Evil persons etc . So Allah (swt) Might will to take many out of the Fire, after Some time whenever He Knows is right, and that includes people of all Crimes, whether Mushriks or Non Mushriks….

So this is How i see it... and since Allah (swt) knows best How many of Them Were Committing Shirk Consciously ... it is His Judgment that will be the Best....



(6:57)The decision is only for Allah, He declares the truth, and He is the Best of judges."







 
Hussein radi said:
I am having difficulty comprehending someone being punished for eternity for a limited amout of time, lets say 100 years. If you use math you will find out that any number divided by infinity equals zero. Therefor, mathematically god is punishing humans for their limited life which has a value of 0. I need some help and clarification about this subject.
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they died in disbelief lets say when they were 60 years old, so why not allah just punish them for 60 yrs and then admit them in paradise?

the answer is that if they were 100 yrs old still they would have disbelief.... even 200 yrs and........till eternity they would have disbelived..... hence they wil be punished for eternity
 

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